Thirdson

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Posts by Thirdson

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  46

  Tonight's memorial - did you go?

  by dmouse in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  my wife has just left for the memorial.. just before she went she asked me to come...this was the second year in a row that i declined.

  i hated seeing her so sad, i almost agreed to go just to cheer her up but that would betray her in a very real sense.

  to go to the memorial would be an admission in her eyes (and other jws) that i still believe deep down that it is the truth.

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  Thirdson

  Expat,

  You have to do what is right for you. I am lucky that I moved along way away from Witness family. I stopped attending meetings when I reached the point I thought the religion was all wrong. I didn't have a family need ever to re-attend. I hope you can keep the peace and work at leaving in ways you see fit.

  Es,

  Good to see you here and battling hard for justice.

  Best wishes and hugs to you.

  All,

  Mrs Thirdson and I went to an evening meal today and just got back. I hope this doesn't sound like I am blowing my own trumpet. 230 homeless people were provided with a hot meal, drinks, fruit and desert. Meant more to me being there than at the JW thing.

  Thirdson

  'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'
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  46

  Tonight's memorial - did you go?

  by dmouse in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  my wife has just left for the memorial.. just before she went she asked me to come...this was the second year in a row that i declined.

  i hated seeing her so sad, i almost agreed to go just to cheer her up but that would betray her in a very real sense.

  to go to the memorial would be an admission in her eyes (and other jws) that i still believe deep down that it is the truth.

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  Thirdson

  Dmouse,

  I think you have done the right thing. Over the years I have known many unJWbelievers attend the memorial just to please their spouses. Some of these have become JW's themselves. Those that haven't but still attend give their spouses hope whether real or not.

  In order to show your complete disbelief in the WTS org, religion and belief system you have to stay away. You have the strength and wisdom to do so. I hope in time you can convince your wife that it is right to stay away.

  Thirdson

  'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'
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  25

  1975 - After 26 years isn't it time to move on?

  by digderidoo in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i'm relatively new on this site...but one subject i've noticed that seems to create alot of interest is that of 1975.. our family became witnesses it 1983 so i wasn't around at the time.

  forgive me if i do not understand why many were so angry with the wts at the time.. i understand the point that the society blamed individual witnesses and didn't take any responsibility themselves.

  i can see how witnesses got angry over that.. but, what i do not understand is why many still research into what the society said, or didn't say, or insinuated.

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  Thirdson

  G'day Didgy,

  1975 was a key year and the years leading up contained an element of excitement that the WTS has never been able to duplicate. The lines "the world is about to end" and "its going to happen in 1975" were quite effective at bringing in new converts.

  That period of time had long lasting effects on JW's particularly young ones. Some of my siblings and I left school in the 1970's and the attitude that the world will end soon influenced our decisions about education or the lack of it. Those attitudes continued on into the 80's when my youngest brother left school and went pioneering.

  So not only did the WTS get it wrong, make excuses that the timing was slightly out (my belief after 1975) but got it totally wrong, dropped the "generation" of 1914 teaching, are likely to drop more of their prophetic teachings including the FDS and the annointed.

  So they got a few things wrong, you say. But what about the 100,000's who made career and education decisions based on the WTS's fervour? Whose fault is that?

  Of the six siblings I am the only one to get any formal education after high school. I spent 4 years at technical college rather than a proper University. My older brothers drifted between jobs until both ended up as programmers and advanced from there. One (a JW no longer) owns his own software/consulting company. I held steady jobs in mechanical engineering and the machine tool industry before retraining as a programmer too. My sister is finishing a computer science course at college and might turn that in to a full degree. She has not worked full time since she started a family.

  My youngest brother (now mid 30's), who left school with higher honors than any of us lives with his wife in a tiny 2 bedroom flat (apartment) and works in retail. At least he enjoys the perks of his wife's job (cheap airline tickets). He has suffered the most from the WTS failings and has yet to see the light.

  The siblings that are no longer JW's are working hard at jobs, businesses and further education. But I often wonder what my two JW brothers think now. The oldest, an elder to boot, recuits college graduates for his company. What does he think about the WTS ban on higher education? How does that effect what he advises his own kids to do after school? Seeing the success (at least relative success) of his other siblings, how does my youngest brother feel? Does he think that the years he spent pioneering (less than 6) were a waste or a good foundation? I don't know.

  1975 was 26 years ago but for some of us that year continues to have a major impact on our lives.

  My thoughts,

  Thirdson

  'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'
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  26

  How long was it for you?

  by expatbrit in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i'm curious: how many years were you in before you left?

  by left, i mean either df'd and decided not to go back, or da'd, or faded, or even just realized it was a crock but stuck around anyway for family reasons?.

  we're told in la-la-land that it's the newly baptized, those who are "spiritually immature" that mostly leave.

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  Thirdson

  I was born in and baptized at 14. I went in active at age 35 and left totally 4 years ago at age 36. My last meeting was the Memorial 1997.

  I served as an elder from 1991 to 1994.

  Thirdson

  'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'
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  32

  Pink Songbooks - Green Bibles

  by nicolaou in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  those of us who've been around long enough will understand the title.

  what we are looking for here are examples of the society's lack of taste.. for example, i'm sure our kingdom hall wasn't the only one in the 70's with dark brown carpeting that rose halfway up the walls and a nice trendy rubber plant in the corner of the platform!.

  nic'.

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  Thirdson

  Hello Mr. Angry,

  (Wasn't he a character on a Radio 1 breakfast program?)

  The orange plastic chairs brought back many unhappy memories. We had a KH with blue carpeting, orange chairs and a similar dank smell. It was one of the worst designed halls ever and also suffered from having an army cadet (boy soldiers) hall off the property. (It was behind a pub too!) On Rememberance Sunday the cadets would fall-in and start their parade from the KH parking lot. Used to really upset one elder!

  It was a dreadful hall and the congregation that met there was not much better. After a couple of years there we were assigned to a different hall in a different town. Some years later I was reassigned again this time back to that hall when 3 cong's were formed into 5 and just prior to a new "qick-build".

  I don't know what ever happened to the old hall. When I left the area the hall was being used to store DC equipment. Probably illegally as the hall's tax exempt status did not include using a church as a warehouse.

  Thirdson

  'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'
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  20

  Evidence of "Independent Thinking"

  by COMF in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  you need some history to understand what i have to tell.

  i have two grown sons.

  son1 is single and a staunch jw whose goal for years has been to go to bethel and to become a missionary.

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  Thirdson

  Thanks for that wonderful piece O Captain! my Captain.

  There are some valuable lessons to be drawn for all of us with JW relatives. I have tried the confrontational approach and it doesn't work. The low-key, lip biting style I hope will be a better tactic.

  I wish you well with your son.

  Thanks again,

  Thirdson

  'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'
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  55

  Biblical Inerrancy

  by Francois in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  is there any denial that at 1 kings 7:23, the value of pi is ascertained as 3.000?.

  and where does this leave the idea that the bible is inspired in every word, jot, and tittle by god?

  just wondering.. any takers?.

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  Thirdson

  Arniem falls in to the trap of trying to justify everything in the Bible as being true, accurate and scientific. It isn't and doesn't have to be unless you have to believe the Bible to be true, accurate and scientifically correct. All sorts of reasons come up for making the Bible's measurements fit. Give it up, the Bible is neither a science of math book.

  As for Jericho, the walls did fall down. Unfortunately, I understand that the ruins excavated were from a period several hundred years before Israel was supposed to have captured the city.

  THirdson

  'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'
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  12

  Why do they ask us to stand up?

  by ozziepost in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i have a question.

  at the beginning of each meeting at the kingdom hall, the chairman invites us to find our seats and be seated.. after we have got ourselves comfortable and all is (reasonably) quiet, the meeting chairman then invites us to stand and sing the opening song.. does anyone else find this a bit strange?

  why are we invited to sit, then before we've done anything else, we're invited to stand.. just seems odd to me.

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  Thirdson

  I think the question has been answered as why standing for singing is appropriate in most settings. What I find different about other services compared to Kingdom Hall meetings is the quiet and contemplative environment of a church before services begin. People are already seated (or kneeling) before standing to sing. Kingdom Halls before a meeting (except Memorial night) are hardly reverent places and most meetings are devoid of any worship except the before and after prayer and a 3 poorly worded songs. The only rituals are Memorial night and the only liturgy is wedding vows.

  Thirdson

  'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'
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  6

  The Bible, Math and H2O Rick

  by Thirdson in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  over on h20 our friend rick is trying to get to grips with circles, spheres and basic geometry in an attempt to prove the bible to be scientifically accurate.

  (i dont see the point as the bible is not a book of science and its history is often shrouded in myth) .

  all of this reminded me of a passage in a recreational math book called beyond numeracy by ja paulos.

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  Thirdson

  Over on H20 our friend Rick is trying to get to grips with circles, spheres and basic geometry in an attempt to prove the Bible to be scientifically accurate. (I don’t see the point as the Bible is not a book of science and its history is often shrouded in myth)

  All of this reminded me of a passage in a recreational math book called Beyond Numeracy by JA Paulos. In the book the ancient’s value of pi are compared. The Bibles value for pi (3) comes bottom of the list. In regard to this the book says:
  

  Ancient estimates for pi include 3 (Old Testament – an insurmountable problem, it would seem, for biblical literalists) Beyond Numeracy page 176.

  Maybe we should let Rick have a go a justifying the Bibles value for this basic circle related ratio. Just how round are round loaves in the Bible?

  Thirdson

  'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'

  Edited, removed Greek characters that didn't display with right character set.
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  32

  Pink Songbooks - Green Bibles

  by nicolaou in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  those of us who've been around long enough will understand the title.

  what we are looking for here are examples of the society's lack of taste.. for example, i'm sure our kingdom hall wasn't the only one in the 70's with dark brown carpeting that rose halfway up the walls and a nice trendy rubber plant in the corner of the platform!.

  nic'.

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  Thirdson

  I agree with Ozziepost.

  I liked the pink song book. I still have a deluxe version with the shiny pink cover and the gold edged pages.

  You can always tell a JDub library...the shelves look like a box of Crayola.

  Thirdson

  'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'