Posts by Thirdson

3

How will the WT change as older members die off?

by nicolaou in

jw
friends

the 'old-timers' generally carry a congregation.. i grew up in a cong' with six members of the 'anointed' - only two remain and one of those, a lovely lady with genuine warmth and interest in people, is now in a nursing home.. what happens when the depth that these individuals bring is lost?.

of course, they were/are barking up the wrong tree as much as the rest of the dubs but their influence at least tended to 'round out' some of the more hard-line jw's.. .

nic'.

Thirdson

Montag

Most of the young dubs don't know old WT history [or care for that matter] so as new generations continue to replace the old we can look forward to a corresponding shift in WT theology

In JWspeak generations don't get old and don't get replaced they stretch. Forget the dead people, JWs live in one big happy generation that started sometime around the turn of the 19th century and continues on.

"This generation" saw the coming of Armageddon (the 1914 one) when Jesus had arrived, saw him come again (in 1914 with hindsight) watched the "faithful men of old" live again in 1925, built them a fancy house and sold it, waited for WW2 to turn in to Armageddon, decided not to have kids, sold everything and saw Armageddon through in 1975, hoped for it in 1986, got renewed energy in 1995, watched TV all day long Dec 31, 1999...and still says the WTS is God's only channel, his organization who are not inspired but directed and the UN thing, isn't true, is true but is OK, is not OK so we left...UN who?

So many old don't remember much. Pehaps the newbies who are left won't remember or know this and will choose to forget and can move on to something different and hopefully better.

Thirdson

'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'

76

Years in v. Years Out

by Billygoat in

jw
friends

i'd like to find out how many years collectively we have acquired in the wts.

please list how many years you were/have been a jw.

please also list how many years you have been out.

Thirdson

In from birth - 36 years
Baptized 22 years
Out 4 years 6 months 2 days (not that I'm counting)

T.

'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'

83

NEWS: I am publicly reproved over UN situation.

by badwillie in

jw
friends

my wife and i met with 3 elders for a "judicial hearing".. our crime: simply put, was talking.

i showed a friend the un website where the wts was listed as an ngo which then led to a 2 hour discussion of various doubts that we both have had.

my wife also showed a friend the un thing but also discussed with her a first hand account of a pedophile cover-up that we knew about in our former congregation.

Thirdson

Bad Willie,

I am sorry for what you are going through. Please, please, please take this further and contact those people who have offered to help. By all means appeal, get the announcement stopped, write to the society and copy the elders on the letter.

All,

If the reporter from the Gaurdian is reading these pages this is another story. The WTS claimed its association with the UN was for human rights reasons yet when its own membership discuss their involvement they seek to discipline the member. If Bad Willie is disfellowshipped (the next stage if he continues with this) the WTS and the JWs will be violating his human rights, his right to dignity...and for what? Telling the truth.

Thirdson

'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'

76

CNN mentions Jehovah's Witnesses Today

by ARoarer in

jw
friends

i have been watching the news on cnn and happened to notice the news flashing across the bottom mentioning the state of ohio banning door to door work and jehovah's witnesses!

has anyone seen this?

Thirdson

I think the laywers representing Stratton should be helped out with some Watchtower Society publications. I don't have an OM book any more and its not contained on the CD-ROM. However, there are planety of quotes from the WTS publications that show that they are model citizens who obey the law when it doen't conflict with God's law. Since, the local law is not in violation of God's law they must have to challenge the fact that they are somehow being discriminated against.

On the topic of the sort of people who might be visiting your home this what the Kingdom Ministry said in December 1974:

Question Box
• In a case in which a person, because of genuine repentance, is not disfellowshipped, is it nonetheless proper to restrict him from the preaching work under certain circumstances?
When one is privately or publicly reproved, the information on page 168 of the Organization book applies. While it is true that certain restrictions may be placed on such individuals, it is good to note what is said on page 168 regarding the preaching work, namely: "The person would be free to engage fully in the preaching work and to report such . . . " Likely in the case of a notorious situation where one is publicly reproved, it would be the course of wisdom for that one to engage in the preaching work in a section of the territory where the problem is not widely known, at least for a while. It is good to keep in mind that the preaching work is a basic part of our service to God, and all who serve Jehovah should be sharing in it.-Matt. 24:14; 28:18-20.
What about a person who has been reinstated following disfellowshiping? Should he be allowed to engage in the field service immediately? Yes, in harmony with the above thoughts he should be allowed to engage in the field service following reinstatement. As to other privileges in this regard we can be guided by what is stated in the Organization book, page 177.

Slightly off the subject. Don't you see a restiriction on FS would be gladly endured by the repentant wrong-doer. However, since FS is a huge chore and effort why would they want to remove that as punishment?

It makes you think!

THirdson

'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'

13

JW Children: Feeling alone and sad

by Gopher in

jw
friends

friday many american schools recited the pledge of allegiance to the nation's flag simultaneously, at 2pm eastern time (8am in hawaii).

to be sure, the pressure on children of jw's was great because of the nationalistic feelings that have swept america in the aftermath of the 9/11 terror attacks.. should jw parents simply have removed their children for that afternoon?

or perhaps armed them with a better explanation (about why they won't say the pledge) then "it's because of my religion"???.

Thirdson

Prisca,

I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America
and to the republic for which it stands: one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

When I attended school in South Australia we had a Monday morning asembly in the quadrangle where anong other things the national pledge was said to the beat of a drum. I can't remember all of it but it started:

"I am an Australian, I love my country, I honour her Queen, I salute her flag..."

I stood there silent being the JW kid I was. This was the early 70's with much dissent and opposition to Australia's involvement in Vietnam. My one older brother attended high school and said that on ANZAC day in 1972 not a single student said the pledge and during the national anthem only the principal sang the words!

As a JW I remember being left out of religious school assemblies and being missed out of quite a few other things that went on there. In the last few years of high school I went to all assemblies. Hardly anyone sang the hymns so I wasn't alone.

By the time my son was at school I decided not to exclude him from activities on religious grounds. Not that there is much religion in US schools. I let him sing in the choir. No carrols are sung and "Jingle Bell" is a song about a sleigh ride. Within a short while I had given up on all the weird "no-nos" of the WTS. I hope he has a better time at school than me. He already has to cope with being different for ethnic, nationality reasons I don't religion to cause further issues.

Thirdson

'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'

5

Commemorating the 2014 Centenary

by Room 215 in

jw
friends

for all the philatelists among us, i sure hope the brooklyn-based world government-in-waiting is preparing a commemorative stamp issue to honor the imminent centernary of our lord's presence.

maybe one stamp for each of the detainees in atlanta, capped off by a high-value airmail stamp depicting the rapture that never was?

seriously, how many of you folks out there collect stamps?

Thirdson

R215,

It won't just be stamps. I can’t wait. Watching a show on cable TV and every other commercial break will be this:

In celebration of 100 years of misleading American heroes the History Society or America is proud to bring you the messianic memorial silver dollar. This genuine and legal tender (in Liberia) silver dollar coin features the head of Charles Taze Russell on one side and Michael the Archangel ousting the devil from heaven on the other. Beautifully and meticulously reproduced from actual Watchtower published illustrations this magnificent coin can be yours to treasure forever.

This one of kind coin can be yours for just $59.99 (plus $6.95 shipping and handling). But wait. Order in the next 5 minutes and we’ll include free a CD-ROM containing everything the Watchtower Society has published in the last 100 years a $2.00 value. But there’s even more, we’ll also include a leather-look book bag monogrammed with the Watchtower logo.

Don’t delay. This is a limited time offer (we will run out real soon) Our operators are standing by. Have your credit card number ready. Rush delivery available.

Thirdson
Stamp collector 1966 - 1972 -- Albums in a box at my folks place in England.

'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'

24

WOL tightened security

by Moxy in

jw
friends

all new registrants must be referals now.

and the contemplations forum where the only really interesting stuff ever is (e.g.

the 'free to remarry' thread) is being made private.

Thirdson

I say let them tighten security all the way. Make their boards a closed group of 50 people discussing the banal, living in fear that any one of their group could really be an infiltrator. The only places left for any open discussion will be the free liberal boards like this one. Here the real truth is discussed, open, frank, "warts and all".

Besides, they all know this is the place to be that is why they lurk here.

Hi WOL and GT Crow.borgers

Thirdson

'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'

7

Tom Clancy inspired bin Laden?

by JanH in

jw
friends

i killed quite a bit of time a couple of years ago reading tom clancy's 1996 novel executive orders.

it is not a particularly good novel, and for having 1200+ pages, it has an anti-climactic ending, imo, and the protagonist (and author!

) seems to be somewhere to the right of mussolini.. but the similarities between the plot in this tom clancy novel and what has happened in the us since sept 11 are scary, especially if it is true that the same people who organized the wtc attack is also behind the envelopes with anthrax bacteria sent to media outlets.

Thirdson

Jan,

I thought the same things. In the book the timing of the crash was helpful having all of government, President, VP and judiciary in the Capitol. I don't think the ideas are particularly unique though and the skill (a subjective term) of the author is spinning the yarn in to something worth reading.

However, isn't the attack in the Sum of All Fears more scary? The movie version of the book as been shelved for the time being because of the subject matter related to the attrocities commited in the US recently.

Thirdson

'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'

10

So What Will Become Of Them?

by Englishman in

jw
friends

so what will happen now?.

the 1914 debacle means that the urgency has gone.

"armageddon ernie" has slipped into sheol and still awaits resurrection.

Thirdson

Ozziepost,

You make a very good point:

I know I've raised this before, but to me it seems that without the doctrines and teachings that set the WTS apart from the rest, there's really no reason to join. Wouldn't it be easier (and more satisfying etc) to attend one of the mainstream churches?

I agree. Further, once the ones who leave because of a realization that the WTS is not God's sole channel, (or not even a channel) and doesn't have the "truth" who would be left? The ones left would be the die-hard JWs who can rationalize any world event and anything the WTS does with the fulfillment of God's will and the Bible. Within the "society" these ones find comfort and support believing that they are special, have God's protection and will be rewarded because they stick to the WTS and do what the corporation asks them to do. These die-hards will not like the change to more orthodox beliefs or at least a change to caring about people in general with the demolition of the wall dividing Watchtower followers from the rest of "them" in the "world".

By mainstreaming the WTS stands to lose the die-hards who need a controlling religious body and the ones who will see just as much benefit by joining an alternative mainstream religion. And then there are those who won't bother with any organized religion at all after being fooled by the Watchtower.

It doesn't bode well. At a time of renewed religious feelings the Watchtower's fumbling of the UN matter will only discourage those who were thinking "maybe the WTS does have the truth." The figures for the WTS's first quarter of the service year will tell.

Thirdson

'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'

7

"UN" Searches at the Watchtower

by Thirdson in

jw
friends

i am really appreciative of the work done by many here related to the un hot-topic, for those who contacted the un and those brave enough to approach the wts directly too.

i have printed my copy of the letter and have saved an image for use this weekend.. heres another thought on the un thing.

during the last couple of weeks i have checked the watchtower main web-site and the media site for references for the un.

Thirdson

Eyebrow,

Not a problem. I didn't mean to be critical of you, sorry if my wording seemed that way.

When I searched the site originally I tried "United Nations", "League" and UN. I know the "League" got the best hit which is what I tried for the quote above. I use the "find on this page" feature of IE as well to scan the text. I don't particularly want to have to read large sections of the WTS stuff

Thirdson

'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'