Posts by troubled

One last thought about Armageddon. Who knows what circumstances might happen between now and then that might move many others to embrace God and Truth? In a case like that, 99% of humans would not be destroyed.

Also, since Jehovah is the reader of hearts, if he sees many, many loving persons would embrace Truth if they had different circumstances, exposure to information, biological makeup, opportunity, etc., I'm sure He will take this also into consideration.
Sometimes I think about Ninevah. How he had Jonah give the warning of destruction. But due to the hearts and responses of people, He did not bring such a destruction after all. We know what He has said in his Word, the Bible. But we can't see the whole picture. The details, extenuating circumstances, and complexities behind each person's life decisions, etc. Or the situations where persons have been hurt by the organization. But Jehovah knows these things. It is He who will ultimately decide who will live in his righteous new world.

There's so much more we don't know. But I believe Jehovah will be fair in his decisions. More and more, I see how flawed, vulnerable, and human we all are. Truly, we are dust. Myself included. Despite the flaws and errors in the organization, I have chosen (up to now) to stay in this religious organization. However, I do not ever pretend to be the judge who will decide the fate of my fellow human or determine his/her worthiness for everlasting life.

I love God and people. I admit my weaknesses and lack of full knowledge. I see where the BG has made some serious errors with people's lives. But for now, Jehovah's organization is the place I want to be.

I think I am different from most of you in that I was NOT raised in this religion. Therefore, I did not feel FORCEd to do it. Also, I had a great deal of freedom before becoming a JW. And while I prize freedom and use of intelligence and reason, I did not find complete fulfillment in this world's hodgepodge of abstract ideas where no answer can ever be pinned down, where a thousand various ideas are all right, and where every truth is "relative."

Despite the many flaws and failings in myself, in my fellow JWs, and in the organization, at present it is still the place I want to be. I don't know if I will be next month, next year, next decade. As I said, I have some serious spiritual issues I am dealing with myself.

But to portray all JWs as callous, exploitative automatons simply isn't true. I don't want people to be killed at Armageddon, I do not refer to non-JWs as "goats" or joke that after Armageddon, "I want that house!" I hope only for a happy outcome in the end. There are many good and loving people in this world.

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Watchtower Exploitation Begins!

by metatron in

jw
friends

over the weekend, various publishers/congregations were.

instructed to go out in service for a "special work".. some congregations received letters from circuit overseers.

emphasizing immediate use of old awake magazines with articles.

troubled

Metatron,

I too must respond to your posts.

As you know, if you have read any of my previous posts, I am an active JW. However, I do not believe it is a perfect religion, that we have a grasp on absolute knowledge, or that the GB has never made errors. In fact, I have my own personal struggle in certain areas of our religion, which I am trying to weigh, evaluate, research, and come to grips with.

However, it is unkind and untrue to categorize all JWs into a group and portray them as unfeeling, exploitative humans waiting to capitalize on the suffering of others. This is my own personal experience.

My husband and I were on vacation when we heard about the disasters at the World Trade Center and the Pentagon. The news was devastating to us, just as it must have been to most other humans living in our country. We cut our trip short and returned home. Not because we were afraid, but because it didn't feel like "vacation" anymore. I couldn't keep enjoying the majestic, pristine beauty of the Canadian Rockies, knowing that at that same moment, so many others were suffering such unspeakable suffering and tragedy.

Since that day, I have continued in my normal routine, but things do not feel normal to me. I have a heavy sadness in my heart that weighs me down. I've had trouble sleeping since then. I go back and forth between watching the news and having to get away from it. It feels so emotionally overwhelming. Not because I'm surprised it is happening, but because it still hurts to see people suffer and in pain. (By the way, our congregation was never instructed not to watch the news.)

I went out in the ministry Saturday AM, not to exploit people or play on human tragedy. I went because I knew that if others felt the way I did, they could use some comfort. I almost didn't go. I told my husband, "I don't know if I can do this today. I'm afraid I might cry at the door." He said if I did, it was OK. At least people would see that JWs are people with feelings. Gladly, I made it through field service without crying. But I have cried on and off in the past week and feel deeply for everybody who is grieving, afraid, and in pain.
My goal on Saturday wasn't to sell magazines. I didn't ask for money. I rarely do. Just prepared a few scriptures in case I met someone it might help. The direction we got from the CO was "Just let them talk. Don't preach to them; just show you care and offer comfort if you can." I don't think I was able to do much. I wish I could do more. No, I'm not giving blood, saluting the flag, or advocating war. But I would gladly dig through the rubble myself if I was able. Believe me. It's true.

With respect to your comment about Armageddon, it has always been the hope of JWs that the majority of mankind gain life, not be destroyed. Who said 99 percent of humankind would be killed off at Armageddon? Yes, we believe God is using an organization here on earth to gather people for survival into a new earth. But Jehovah is the ultimate Judge. He sees the whole of a matter and can read the heart. Not us. OK. Maybe sometimes we forget that.

Anyway, I've rambled way too long. But I just needed to express how I feel.

5

Update for SixofNine

by troubled in

jw
friends

hi sixofnine,.

yes, i think my depression is getting a little better.

i think alot of it is that i've finally been able to admit to myself, to my therapist, and to my one nonjudgmental friend at the hall that i do indeed have some spiritual concerns and doubts.

troubled

Thank you, SixofNine and Seeker, so much for your responses.

5

Update for SixofNine

by troubled in

jw
friends

hi sixofnine,.

yes, i think my depression is getting a little better.

i think alot of it is that i've finally been able to admit to myself, to my therapist, and to my one nonjudgmental friend at the hall that i do indeed have some spiritual concerns and doubts.

troubled

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5

Update for SixofNine

by troubled in

jw
friends

hi sixofnine,.

yes, i think my depression is getting a little better.

i think alot of it is that i've finally been able to admit to myself, to my therapist, and to my one nonjudgmental friend at the hall that i do indeed have some spiritual concerns and doubts.

troubled

Hi SixofNine,

Thanks for asking how I am. Yes, I think my depression is getting a little better. I think alot of it is that I've finally been able to admit to myself, to my therapist, and to my one nonjudgmental friend at the Hall that I DO INDEED have some spiritual concerns and doubts. But now that I've accepted that, it's not quite as scary as before.

For a long time, I couldn't admit or accept that I had doubts, questions, or disagreed with anything the F&DS said. And if I caught myself thinking or feeling that way, I would feel so guilty and disloyal to Jehovah. Like I was a horrible, wicked person if I didn't accept everything that was said from the platform. So it was just too scary to let doubts surface.

Right at the instant a doubt or uncomfortable feeling would come up, I would catch them and shove them down again, almost before I was even conscious of it. At even the slightest twinge of discomfort or feeling of disagreeing with something, I would tell myself "No I don't. No I don't." But it was all kind of automatic, like when a person drives a car on "autopilot." I didn't even realize I was doing that to myself. But looking back, I can see now that I was twisting my own reality, which eventually just led to my breakdown.

I didn't just practice denial with JW-related stuff. I did it with everything uncomfortable or negative I felt or thought in my life. I just wanted to think and do good things all the time as much as I could. And not ever think bad or mean things. I never learned as a child how to handle negative emotions, and in the Truth, I thought I shouldn't have any. So I just plain tried not to. I mean, I've always wanted to be a good person.

I guess this denial was a self-protective thing. Because to admit I had grave spiritual concerns would be too much to handle, and then what would I do? But now that I've worked through some of my other issues in therapy, I seem to be able to accept and focus on the spiritual one now. Just being able to start openly accepting my feelings and thoughts as they come up is a tremendous relief!

I don't always like what I see in myself, but at least I'm being real now. At least to myself. And my goal is to be able to live and express myself truthfully and honestly with everyone, eventually.

Even though I still feel alot of guilt, it is less intense than before. I am more able to accept that there's nothing wrong with having questions and wanting to find out answers! It's not that I hate the WTBTS. I still love Jehovah and want to do what's right. I just need to live with my eyes open now. That's all.

Please don't think I blame the WTBTS for all my depression problems. Much of it had to do with childhood stuff, and my own way of (not) handling negative thoughts and emotions. My tendency to be a people pleaser. My reluctance to see anything bad, etc. All that was ingrained way before I ever became a Witness. But when you combine some of the things I saw happening in the congregation with my own inability to acknowledge and deal with those feelings, eventually everything just kind of erupted. So it was a complicated thing.

Oh yeah. My doctor also switched me from Zoloft to Effexor. That seems to have lessened my constant guilt over everything. So if my posts seem different, that might be part of the reason!

Sorry my messages are always so long when I post. I hope this made sense.

16

Why do loyal dubs post here

by Room 215 in

jw
friends

this issue, of course, has been raised before.

of course there's no one simple reason.

arrogance, i'm sure plays a role -- the ones that feel the wts counsel to avoid dialogue with opposers is meant for the ``weaker ones'' and cannot possibly apply to someone as well-grounded and mature as they.. it may be a tacit acknowledgement that the society's arguments against debate are specious.

troubled

In my post yesterday (about pedophiles) I was questioned about my goals (reasons) for being here. See my reply, if you're interested.

12

Missed you guys, had "The Talk" with ...

by reagan_oconnor in

jw
friends

it's been about a month since i posted... sorry to stay away so long.. many of you are aware that my parents stopped speaking to me last year, and the only time i've seen them in a year is when my dad had a heart attack.

i got an e-mail from my mom that asked how i "felt about their religion" since i'm celebrating holidays.. i sat down with mom on saturday and told her that regardless of our differences in beliefs, that we're still family, and that will never change.

i told her that i understand that she's conflicted because of her beliefs, and that it's been difficult for her.

troubled

Hi Reagan,

Thanks for your post. I've read several of them and have found them very thought-provoking.

I think you were very loving toward your mom. That must have been difficult, as you say they haven't spoken to you but once in the last year. I'm sure that has caused alot of pain for you. Yet you handled her with love and honesty. I really respect you for that. It couldn't have been an easy thing.

Regarding your ex doing research and your mom making the statement about apostate literature: Yup, any kind of evidence brought up about wrongdoing in the WTBTS is automatically considered "apostate." People want to jump back like they've been burned on the stove. It's so sad. That's why I'm so afraid to come forward with anything. I know it will be considered rebellion, rather than disillusionment and honest questioning.

I have just one friend in the Hall I can honestly talk to about this. We're doing research and discussing some of the stuff I've found on the Net.

But it's crazy, the way we have to sneak around and hiding the info from our husbands, like we're criminals. Two middle-aged women feeling like ashamed and guilty spies, disloyal simply because we want to READ something and weigh both sides.

Sometimes, I think I am just going nuts.

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