Posts by nevermind

11

How many JW's believe to their last breath . .

by nicolaou in

jw
friends

i can easily believe that thousands did all through the watchtowers glory years but especially after '95 the whole thing has been unravelling.

kidding yourself to maintain family relationships and social networks is *somewhat* understandable in life but on your deathbed?.

i think the demographic for jw's may actually get younger as time goes on.

nevermind

JWs these days are an easily frightened bunch. Can't hold an honest conversation with one for more than a few times before he starts digging his head deeper into the sand and refuses to discuss further. I guess I ruffled his ever sensitive feathers by just innocently bringing up those many failed prophecies of the WTS over the past century, and then his "apostate" alarm set off.

There are things like the whole overlapping generation and anointed class demoted to less glorious status that affect the older folks who've been JWs long enough to gauge the significance of these changes. But for those JWs who joined post-2000s and even more recent ones, it's hard to use these as punch lines to start awakening them to the WTS fallacies. I'm guessing they probably weren't in long enough to experience the status of the annointed class given by the WTS in the earlier chapters of its history. For one, jw.org is just the WTS attempt to rewrite its own history. With these challenges in mind, I'm not sure with whether a significant amount of the younger JWs (those that joined post-2000s) will be lifers or not. Time will tell how long this WTS decepticon can continue

25

Are There Many JWs That Have Actually Left?

by minimus in

jw
friends

it seems that most people who have been witnesses that i've known in the last 20 years are still jws.

they may not be as zealous as before but they still remain as jehovah's witnesses.

.

nevermind

It seems that most people who have been Witnesses That I've known in the last 20 years are still JWs. They may not be as zealous as before but they still remain as Jehovah's Witnesses.

These JWs are probably old timers who think they've invested way too much of their lives in this club to leave, or because of fear of being shunned by family and friends (all the people they ever knew), or a combination of both. It's easier for younger JWs to leave and press the restart button on their lives.

I bet you though, that if the shunning policy stopped being practiced, half the Kingdom Halls would be empty by tomorrow. I read somewhere that an elder had estimated if the shunning policy was terminated, a quarter of his congregation would leave by tomorrow immediately followed by another quarter. The WTS leaders are wicked intelligent to institute this shunning policy. Terrible wicked.

18

March Broadcast Governing Body Truly Enjoy our new Facility Warwick

by Buster k in

hello everyone first post, i will leave my whole story for another post.

but i would like to say hello to everyone and wish everyone here much love and support.

and i should also note of my self i might say things that are odd or makes no sense, but then that is my humour.

nevermind

What is especially sad is that in 20 years or so time the Society will flip the property and sell up ( a nice luxury hotel complex perhaps , or a HQ for some middle ranked company - maybe even sell to another religious group like they did with the New Zealand Bethel ) & rebuild somewhere else. Almost all the existing GB will be dead then but all the young people shown in the video will then be middle aged. One wonders how many of them will still be JWs.

We thought the 1975 scandal would've caused a continual irreversible decline in JW numbers, but the last few decades since have shown that despite this dramatic failed prediction, the Watchtower machine continues to crank and has become a real estate enterprise. I mean c'mon, it's the information age, right? So shouldn't folks, esp the young people, research about the WTS before jumping on the band wagon? But no, cuz there's always ignorant people out there with emotional needs that need to be met, and when the JWs come into picture and somewhat fills this emotional void via love bombing tactics, the person is all hands on deck and drinks the WTS kool aid!

The thing is that as long as the Watchtower decepticon keeps crankin' and there are ignorant folks out there, the cycle repeats itself. You have the older folks who have been around long enough to witness the hypocrisy of the WTS and the crazy doctrinal flip flops or other stuff that awakens them. But then you have the younger folks who are still blind and will take them another decade or two, maybe three, or until whatever time they witness another uphaul, then they wake up if they aren't as ignorant anymore. If 20 years is what it takes to wake up these people, then 20 years it is. But they won't be missed by the WTS of course. There's another young crowd to replace them that will drink the kool aid, then lather, rinse, repeat the cycle of WTS deception. Let's just hope the WTS decepticon will run out of money sometime within our lifetime. I hope that's not too much of a far fetched dream.

18

March Broadcast Governing Body Truly Enjoy our new Facility Warwick

by Buster k in

hello everyone first post, i will leave my whole story for another post.

but i would like to say hello to everyone and wish everyone here much love and support.

and i should also note of my self i might say things that are odd or makes no sense, but then that is my humour.

nevermind

"Wow, new world headquarters! Beautiful surroundings! Must be a nice lakeside retirement home for the leaders of your organization to enjoy!" However you guys word this sure must ring a bell in the rank and file JW's mind

Key words are "lakeside resort," "lakefront retirement home"...

Anyway, more ammo for your next opportunity to open up a JW's mind

13

Stupidology and its findings

by Terry in

since the early 1800's in america a number of new religions have appeared.. the church of jesus christ of latter day saints (mormons), christian science, jehovah's witnesses, scientology, etc.. there are elements in common.. some individual makes unprovable claims, untestable assertions and crafts unusual doctrines which dovetail in some ways with established beliefs while.

simultaneously and radically replacing them.. mormons produce a better and purer revelation in their book of mormon.. scientologists piggy-back off of psychiatry and gnosticism while inventing a new technology which eliminates infestations by alien beings trapped inside humans.. jehovah's witnesses claim leadership by a governing body as a sole channel of communicating escape plans from the imminent war of god on humans.. and so forth.... .

practioners of these religions must sooner or later grapple with disproofs which include discoveries made public of lies, misrepresentations and duplicity.. yet, the majority of adherents selectively dismiss such revelations as a test of their own faith and an opportunity to demonstrate solidarity.. a close examination of this self-reinforced refusal to confront disputatious rebuttal of doctrine i choose to call stupidology.. .

nevermind

Thanks, Terry, for your insights on Stupidology!

I have to say though that those of us fortunate or unfortunate enough to deal with those who are deliberate victims of Stupidology are also victims ourselves. I can feel my arteries tighten as my heart rate goes up the roof whenever the JW rejects any evidence that proves their religion wrong. Our health goes down the drain as we are left with a jaw-dropping incident of dealing with someone this hopelessly brainwashed. What can you do when a JW deliberately shuts off his brain and refuses to do any examination of his beliefs whatsoever? There's nothing as the JW just shuts you out cold, leaving you in the dust, jaw dropping wondering how anyone in this world can be this stupid? It's sad because they are or can be otherwise intelligent people. Well, you as that well-intentioned friend can do nothing at this point. As someone remarked to me while I was still recovering from the JW shutting me off cold, "This is America. People are free to believe whatever they want." I'm like, sure and of course he is free to believe whatever he wants, but I was only trying to help him see. Eventually, I stopped getting angry at how the JW can resort his life to deliberate stupidity. Cuz at the end of the day, I'm the one suffering trying to impart knowledge in an effort to "enlighten" his closed mind, while he is blissfully ignorant in his hermetic, closed system. Let go, and live your own life. There's only so much you can do for those you try to help. It's America after all. People are free to believe whatever they want, even if it's a scam.

13

What is it like at Warwick Bethel?

by nevermind in

from reading about people's first and second hand experiences about working at wt world headquarters back in the 70s and 80s era, the hypocrisy and lovelessness caused many bethelites to quit even before their term ended, some even leaving to never again return to a kingdom hall.

that, coupled with open access back then at bethel to the literature of watchtower's early days can easily open the eyes of any rank and file jw to the society's occultish beginnings.

fast forward to the warwick bethel today.

nevermind

Hey guys,

Great answers! Thanks for all your insights! I personally know someone volunteering at Warwick right now, and he is just so brainwashed it brings tears in my heart. I hope something will happen that will start to awaken him to TTATT. I dunno, maybe one day an awake Bethelite will share his or her Warwick experiences on this forum

That whole real estate business model (aka religious scam) warrants an audit or investigation of some sort. I hope something similar to the ARC will happen here in the US to get these GB thugs investigated.

13

What is it like at Warwick Bethel?

by nevermind in

from reading about people's first and second hand experiences about working at wt world headquarters back in the 70s and 80s era, the hypocrisy and lovelessness caused many bethelites to quit even before their term ended, some even leaving to never again return to a kingdom hall.

that, coupled with open access back then at bethel to the literature of watchtower's early days can easily open the eyes of any rank and file jw to the society's occultish beginnings.

fast forward to the warwick bethel today.

nevermind

From reading about people's first and second hand experiences about working at WT world headquarters back in the 70s and 80s era, the hypocrisy and lovelessness caused many Bethelites to quit even before their term ended, some even leaving to never again return to a Kingdom Hall. That, coupled with open access back then at Bethel to the literature of Watchtower's early days can easily open the eyes of any rank and file JW to the Society's occultish beginnings. Fast forward to the Warwick Bethel today. The "apostate library" must be locked up somewhere so the rank and file JW can't witness such eye opening facts about the TTATT. Also, there is now a heavy dependence on younger, tech savvy volunteer force. So, does Warwick want to treat this younger generation of Bethelites better simply because they can't afford to lose them? Back then there was Knorr, heavy drinking culture at Bethel, apostate literature lying in the open, etc, which is ample evidence to shock a Bethelite into awakening! What in the world can happen today at Warwick to be a jarring enough experience for these JWs to quit and realize the TTATT?

80

Lots Of Whining And Complaining About Us JW's

by Deaconblues1914 in

in reading these posts, it sounds like a lot of you are very jealous of the wt.

society’s annual income and the money they/we have in the bank.

jehovah has indeed blessed us.

nevermind

Deaconblues1914,

Now aren't you just a cute, prickly little porcupine? While reading your posts, you really make me think of porcupine attack!

24

What not to say...

by joey jojo in

hey guys.

i was recently talking to a old friend who is a very active elder.

i was talking about ' the truth' and he suggested i sounded like an apostate because i used terms like ' the society' and ' watchtower '.. i am aware that ' dubspeak ' has changed over the years and i am pretty sure that someone posted about it here but i can't find the thread.

nevermind

Interesting...come to think of it, it now makes total sense. No wonder a JW friend of mine, while discussing, I would always use the "Watchtower" or "Society" terms, but he never refers to them as such, and instead he uses "our organization." For those of you guys who are more familiar, since when have JWs been wary of using the term "The Watchtower (Society)?"

8

a question for your JW friends

by Carol1111 in

the earth is to wear out and cease to exist.. hebrews 1v11, isaiah 51v6-8.

what will happen to those living in paradise earth?.

nevermind

Carol1111,

From my experience and from those who have witnessed much to JWs, it's no use trying to point out their errors from the Bible. You give them a verse that shows them they are wrong, they will just rip another verse out of context just to counter your statement.

That being said, it's best to ask them questions about the new earth instead. Ask them questions like "Armageddon is going to get billions of people dead, in fact over ninety nine percent of earth's people will be killed. So how do you get from the dead bodies and mountains of destroyed rubble and debris to the paradise earth? Do the billions of dead bodies and piles of destruction just go 'poof' and you end up with a cleansed, paradise earth?" Ask them one question at a time. Have them think and respond. If they are honest with you, they will admit that the WT teaches they will have to watch birds and worms eat up the dead flesh, JWs themselves will have to bury the skeletons, and clean up the mess and build houses and work to bring it to that paradise-like condition. Then, follow up with asking, "So since there needs to be so much clean up to do after Armageddon, what has the Governing Body or leaders of your organization been doing to make sure all JWs are ready for all this hard work after surviving Armageddom? In order to bury dead bodies, you will need wheelbarrows, shovels and gloves. Has the Watchtower been buying up all the wheelbarrows, gloves, and shovels and storing them up to make sure JWs will have these tools to bury all these dead bodies after Armageddon?" This will get the JW to begin thinking that the GB or Watchtower just talks the talk, but don't walk the walk.

This are honest questions to start asking JWs without seeming too direct and confrontational with them. Don't state facts for them; always just ask them simple questions, so they can do the thinking for themselves! They always talk about surviving Armageddon and the paradise earth, but they never think about how these Watchtower teachings don't add up and can't withstand any scrutiny!

So, ask JWs questions about the new earth instead! This will plant seeds of doubts in their minds! The trick is to weaken their trust in the Watchtower. It's no use to point out their errors from the Bible.