80+ branch davidian cult members died in waco, texas.
250,000+ #jehovahswitnesses have died refusing blood.
stop this #cult!
I still think it's the same study, besty, only analyzed from two different perspectives. What I DON'T see reflected in this study is an A/B comparison between two sample groups (JW's and non-JW's) and their observable results, stratified, when one receives a blood transfusion and the other refuses.
Eden
80+ branch davidian cult members died in waco, texas.
250,000+ #jehovahswitnesses have died refusing blood.
stop this #cult!
This is a short of the said study conducted by Dr. Andrei Belyaev (AKA Beliaev):
BACKGROUND: Management of anaemic Jehovah's Witness (JW) patients, who refuse blood transfusion on religious grounds, is challenging. In the published literature, there are few cohort studies that consider causes of mortality in isolation and are lacking in their predictive power. This does not allow clinicians to monitor treatment progress of severely anaemic JW patients and adjust their risk of mortality. The study aims to develop an anaemia-related mortality risk prediction instrument. METHODS: This retrospective cohort study evaluated anaemia-related mortality risk factors of JW patients. JW patients were identified from the records of four major public hospitals in the Auckland and Midlands regions of New Zealand (North Shore, Auckland City, Middlemore and Waikato hospitals) for the period 1998 to 2007 inclusive. The inclusion criteria were age ≥15 years and severe anaemia (haemoglobin concentration ≤80 g/L). Palliative care cancer patients were excluded. RESULTS: Anaemia-related risk factors of mortality for JW patients were identified, weighted and used to construct a mortality risk predictive score (the Hamilton Anaemia Mortality Risk Score (Hamilton AMRS)). This permitted stratification of JW patients into mortality risk groups according to their Hamilton AMRS. It is shown that patients with Hamilton AMRS of 0 to 2 had 4% mortality, patients with Hamilton AMRS of 3 to 4 had 29% mortality, patients with Hamilton AMRS of 5 had 40% mortality and patients with Hamilton AMRS of ≥6 had 67% mortality. CONCLUSION: The Hamilton AMRS allows treatment monitoring of anaemic JW patients and adjustment of their risk of mortality.
This can be found at:
Now, can someone enlighten me how can someone extrapolate from these figures to arrive at an overal estimation of 50.000 or 250.000 deaths among JW's in direct consequence of blood transfusion refusal, world-wide, since 1945 (or 1954) ?
Eden
80+ branch davidian cult members died in waco, texas.
250,000+ #jehovahswitnesses have died refusing blood.
stop this #cult!
TTATT,
This woman took upon herself the responsability to represent an organization that wants to expose the 'falsehoods' and the 'dangerousness' of the Watchtower Society. It defeats their purpose to use false figures with the clear intent to stirr hate in the public eye regarding the WTS. It denotes a vendetta, not a genuine desire to use the "truth" about "the truth". As in other ocasions in the past, the ends justify any means, for this lady. I can't agree with that.
Eden
80+ branch davidian cult members died in waco, texas.
250,000+ #jehovahswitnesses have died refusing blood.
stop this #cult!
If anyone is interested, this website explains how someone came to the figure of 250.000:
http://masonemerson.freeyellow.com/christianwitnessescom/id76.html
Now, here's the basic flaw of their reasoning.I quote:
American Red Cross figures published in 1980 indicated that one hundred people per thousand, or 10 percent, need blood in some form every year. With today’s Watchtower organization drawing more than twelve million people worldwide to its meetings, nearly five million of these being active Witnesses and the rest children and new converts in the process of joining, 10 percent would mean that between 500,000 to 1,200,000 among them “need” blood in some form every year, yet refuse treatment. |
Not even pointing the fact that medicine has come a long way since pre-1980 days (33 yeas ago at least), the figure from the American Red Cross indicates that 10% "need blood in some form every year". 10% of what? Of the entire US population? That's impossible. More likely is that 10% of all the people involved in medical emergency situations / elective surgery in 1979 needed blood.
However, the author of the extrapolation goes on to say that, consequently, an average of 10% of all the 5.000.000 active Jehovah's Witnesses (circa 2005) - therefore, 500.000 - "need blood in some form every year, yet refuse treatment". Can you see the glaring, basic fallacy here?
The author would like its readers to accept that one can draw from an estimation of 10% upon a target group of people who have been involved in a medical emergency / elective surgery can be extrapolated into an entire population of Jehovah's Witnesses, whose vast majority hasn't been involved in a medical emergency in the course of a year.
This is the false premise upon which the entire figure is deducted. It's false, false, false, with an intent.
Eden
80+ branch davidian cult members died in waco, texas.
250,000+ #jehovahswitnesses have died refusing blood.
stop this #cult!
Tilly, I rather blow whistles that people take seriously. This isn't one of them.
Is the blood doctrine wrong? Yes. Does it put lifes in danger ? It does. Have people died unecessarily as a result of that? Yes. Have 250.000+ people died as a sole direct consequence of refusing blood? I've been a JW over 25 years, and I've never knew anyone who had died as a result of refusing blood. If that figure had any measure of credibility, I should have met a handful of cases like that in my life, and I haven't.
Eden
80+ branch davidian cult members died in waco, texas.
250,000+ #jehovahswitnesses have died refusing blood.
stop this #cult!
Since we're at it, why not say: "4 million Witnesses have died refusing blood" ?
If we perhaps assume that 4 million human beings died while they were Jehovah's Witnesses, and their refusal of blood was part of their beliefs, one can also claim that they have died refusing blood. In this precise wording, it would also be a true statement; but, clearly, it woud be made with the intent to suggest a direct connection between the death of 4 million people and the refusal of receiving blood, while at the same time cleverly hiding behind semantics to cover their asses from legal responsability.
Ask yourselves: Wouldn't that claim be utterly intellectually dishonest?
Eden
80+ branch davidian cult members died in waco, texas.
250,000+ #jehovahswitnesses have died refusing blood.
stop this #cult!
I don't follow tweeter, but when someone goes in public, in representation of an organization like AAWA, and claims: "250,000+ Jehovah's Witnesses have died refusing blood", it's NOT someone stating an OPINION. It's someone making a claim that better be backed by solid data. I see none.
This ain't no peanuts. This amounts to an accusation of mass genocide or a crime against humanity - made in public, in representation of an organization. How credible, then, is that accusation? Where are the facts, the hard data, the studies? Isn't this simply a groundless fabrication, cheap slanderous sensacionalism, that cannot be taken seriously even by a 7 year old child? Is this how this silly organization intends to oppose the Watchtower?? Really? Give me a break. You guys must me kidding me. You at AAWA DESERVED to be taken down by a exemplary lawsuit that would strip you all from your life-long assets. Grow some credibility, for goodness sake. You're making the GB roll on the floor laughing at you. Is that your brilliant plan to help the Witnesses to wake up for TTATT ?
Eden
it-1 p. 523 - "just before israel entered the promised land, in 1473 b.c.e., jehovah made a covenant with natural israel at moab.
" (de 29:1; 1:3) .
why deceptively use the word "natural"?
marked
# 3 newbie post.
first of all, the newbies have set a record here!.
have you ever seen a 4pg post where 21 new members reply!
No. I started to investigate when I became aware of paedophile allegations that were known to people outside the WT. I started to investigate where that originated from.
Eden
i was thinking about the next scenario:.
the united states (and western world) are losing influence compared to china, india and other new economy's.. with this decline of influence, the watchtower society, a true american religion and it's subsidiary's corporations are losing profits and losing it's base in much country's under china / india / indonesia / brazil influence.
what i see is that the watchtower society is selling it's main assets: landmark buildings in optimal condition.
I don't think they will be closing shop, ever, as long as the masses still believe. They are simply reorganizing themselves and bracing for the next challenge: How to keep the believers believing in this information era where you can no longer withold secrets and science brings certain dogmas under scrutiny and discredits old ideas about religion. They obviously forecast that massive amounts of people will leave, which will shorten their income for a while, while they regroup and reorganize. Then, once they come up with a new set of "new light" adjusted to modern times, they will be ready to grow again.
Eden
