On the NT, the apostle Paul (he is a fascinating character, nevertheless). On the OT, I struggle between Samson and Abimelech (book of Judges). But, the overall winner is clearly Yahweh.
Eden
EdenOne
JoinedPosts by EdenOne
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71
Which bible character do you hate the most?
by Bonsai inthe more i think about it, the more i feel an extreme dislike for the apostle paul.
he was on par with hitler in his treatment of the jews before he "saw the light".
he replaced jesus teachings of love and mercy with a more legalistic, pharisaical concept of devotion to god.. any evil person can come to believe in god and worship him if the scales were literally and miraculously removed from his eyes.
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It's official - JWs have least common sense of any religious group in US
by slimboyfat insome fascinating results in the latest pew research.
(how did i miss this before?
) including that jws rely on their religion the most of any group to tell right from wrong and rely on common sense the least.
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EdenOne
If I'm correct, that Pew research is only looking at the US?
Yesterday someone (a JW) shared on Facebook some sensational article that claimed that archaeologists had found evidence of a huge ancient army whose remains were supposedly found on the seabed of the Red Sea, thus "proving" that the account of the Exodus was accurate. Well, the picture of two divers holding a skull looked familiar, so I got on the case and bingo!, that picture was from another archaeological discovery of 2014, but in a underwater cave in Mexico. So, the news item was an hoax. Then I visited the brazilian website where it had been posted. And looked at the comments section. What I read was UNBELIEVABLE.
Most of the posters were obviously evangelical and pentecostal Christians. They nearly had orgasms with the news. But when someone dared to say the item looked like an hoax, they jumped that poster with such fanatical hate, I can't even describe how ignorant, hate-filled, disgusting, outrageous things were written. I never saw JW's going so low on the ignorance scale like that. If you could read portuguese, I would give you he link, but I hope you believe me. It was among the most ignorant, hateful drivel I have ever seen. All this to say that, at least outside the US, I don't think the JWs are on the bottom of the scale when it comes to common sense ... fundamentalist evangelicals are, for sure.
Eden
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We talk a lot about conditional friends on here
by cappytan inso, when people post about being shunned by their friends, i've heard several posters say things like, "their friendship is conditional.
real friendships aren't conditional.".
i'm sorry, but that just isn't really true.. if you and i were friends, there are conditions.
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EdenOne
Cappy made an excellent observation: Unconditional friendships are utopic. We all establish certain conditions to keep a friendship going, or starting a new one. It's only natural and human.
However, humans normally establish these conditions in freedom of conscience. Each one can decide for himself what are those conditions, and even change those conditions if he/she feels appropriate. The problem with Jehovah's Witnesses is: they don't have that freedom. They are subject to relentless undue influence via indoctrination and threat, in order to dismiss friendships based on criteria that they didn't establish themselves in freedom, but was imposed upon them, under threat of penalty. Such penalty may range from a vague 'displeasure from Jehovah' to a very real disfellowshiping.
Because their religious experience is served as a complete package to them, Jehovah's Witnesses don't have the freedom to accept the theology while choosing to reject what the religion dictates in terms of choices of friends. The total obedience demanded by the religious leadership implies that their criteria for terminating a friendship must replace any other criteria previously held by the individual Jehovah's Witness, or, in case of a born-in, that criteria becomes the only criteria that person has ever known. Thus, the way the JW believer deals with friends who no longer share the belief system or even slightly escape the religious norm stems, not from their personal choice exercised in freedom, but from the very nullification of their individuality.
Eden
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Forgiving Loans the Watchtower Way
by cofty inbank - thank you for maintaining your loan repayments for the past 3 years.
to show our appreciation we are forgiving the balance of your loan.
borrower - yeah!.
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EdenOne
LOL ... yep, that's exactly what it is...
Eden
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Has anyone tried using gold and metal detectors?
by EdenOne ini'm thinking about trying out a new hobby.
in my country there are plenty of places that are geologically suitable for the presence of gold nuggets.
in fact, several gold mines have been historically explored from the days of the romans until present day.. at the same time, i love archaeology and history and there are many possible unexplored archaeological sites near me that might merit a superficial survey.
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EdenOne
Thanks for the replies.
I'm mostly interested in finding gold nuggets, and treasure hoards are relatively rare where I live. Besides, there's the question of unduly disturbing an archaeological site, which is worth considering. Nevertheless, I wonder where's the 'sweet spot' price range for a fairly professional piece of gear - I'm willing to spend around 1.000€. Not interested in a ROI, just in the fun it can bring.
BTW, Cofty, those are some neat findings!
Eden
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Interesting videos on using the socratic method to talk with people on their deeply held beliefs
by bohm init is rare you find something on youtube on religion which feels fresh, but this did it for me.
most here properly agree that the best (only) way to have a constructive conversation with jw who is in is using methods such as those described by steven hassan.
however if you search youtube or the internet, most discussions on faith takes the form of debates or at any rate discussion about factual things -- exactly the things steven hassan would tell you is the least likely to work.. i came across a series of youtube videos with a guy who is basically walking around with a camera and interviewing people on their beliefs.
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EdenOne
Marked for later.
Eden
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Let's Consolidate World Branch Layoff Threads - Oct 2015
by TheListener inthere has been many threads from various posters around the world about recent bethel layoffs.. so far i remember threads about:.
south africa.
united states.
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EdenOne
Portuguese branch Bethel 25% layoff confirmed.
Eden
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372
On respect for the belief of others. Sorry for the long post
by StarTrekAngel ini am inclined to start this thread in response to some comments made in other threads.
i have been coming around these forum for quite some time now so whatever you find in here is not just related to something someone may have said this week.
it can go months back as well.. i have seen many who claim to respect the belief of others but when it comes down to applying it into practice, things take a whole different tune.
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EdenOne
Do you think other person's property is deserving of due regard? It's not on the definition, but it certainly is. Similarly, a person's belief may be worthy of due regard, even if it doesn't meet the criteria of adherence to reality, but meets another criteria, that of serving the greater good for mankind / society. And, again, notice that I'm not discussing religious belief systems in general, but an individual's belief.
Adherence to reality / evidence-based thinking may be the best possible way to evaluate the intrinsic validity of an idea, but it doesn't tell everything there is to say about the respect that it may (or not) merit.
Eden
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372
On respect for the belief of others. Sorry for the long post
by StarTrekAngel ini am inclined to start this thread in response to some comments made in other threads.
i have been coming around these forum for quite some time now so whatever you find in here is not just related to something someone may have said this week.
it can go months back as well.. i have seen many who claim to respect the belief of others but when it comes down to applying it into practice, things take a whole different tune.
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EdenOne
I stressed due regard, because that's the core of the definition. It can be worded "due regard for the beliefs of others"; perhaps I should have been clearer. The definition doesn't include "property", for example; yet, 'respect' is also due regard for the property of others. Just because isn't included in the definition, it doesn't mean it's ruled out.
Eden
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372
On respect for the belief of others. Sorry for the long post
by StarTrekAngel ini am inclined to start this thread in response to some comments made in other threads.
i have been coming around these forum for quite some time now so whatever you find in here is not just related to something someone may have said this week.
it can go months back as well.. i have seen many who claim to respect the belief of others but when it comes down to applying it into practice, things take a whole different tune.
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EdenOne
It could, but you would lose. There is simply too much evidence against that thesis.
Agreed. The point I made was that Weinberg's statement is a gross oversimplification. And I responded with another one, that you could promptly pinpoint as invalid.
Is it really in keeping with the meaning of the word "respect" to use it in connection with beliefs?
In the context of this discussion, I will stick with this definition of "respect", from the Oxford dictionary: "Due regard for the feelings, wishes, or rights of others".
That being said, to which particular "Christian-themed belief of that particular individual" are you referring when you ask your question? Christianity is a collection of many different and often conflicting and internally incoherent beliefs. In point of fact, there is no way you could even come up with any definitive listing of what Christian beliefs are and are not.
Oub, I think you're missing my point with the example I gave. It's not a discussion about the merits of flaws of Christianity in general. Agreed, they're a set of incoherent beliefs. The point is about the particular belief of that individual, which can even be a uniquely particular interpretation of Christianity. The same irrational belief in Jesus and in heaven that doesn't adhere to reality (one angle of evaluation of its merit) is in fact the same belief that drives him to be a humanitarian (another different angle of evaluating the merit of his belief). So, my question remains. Is this man's belief worthy of RESPECT? (because that's the OP's original subject)
Eden