Posts by Journeyman

17

What would Watchtower Corporation(tm) do?

by punkofnice in

what would watchtower corporation(tm) do in compromise of their 'north korean style rules' if by publicly removing them, they could get more money and power?.

if each governing body(tm) member (pee be upon them), were offered a few million quid/bucks each to rescind the barbaric 'no whole blood' rule?.

i know what i think these fake religionists would do.

Journeyman

We probably could do with a nice juicy bust-up right now to liven things up. The AMIII thing turned into a disappointment as it has fizzled out under a cloud of secrecy (possibly secured by a payoff, NDA or something similar).

But if there are rifts in this GB over what direction to take the org, then we might see some interesting fall-out in the next few years as the pressure comes on from court cases and negative media attention (and possibly internal pressure too from BoEs, COs, etc).

Obviously they would try to keep it quiet, but I reckon it would become more apparent these days because the org and its teachings have much more public scrutiny, their material is openly available online and the ExJW community is much more active and ready to highlight any inconsistencies or flip-flops.

This supposed pulling of the two shunning videos from the 2023 convention (if true) might already be an indication of divided opinion internally. It used to be said there were often clashes between the teaching committee and the writing committee on how to address some subjects in meetings and magazines. We might be about to see the same again over these controversial topics.

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

Journeyman

Except Ray shags everyone else's wife, Lloyd shags everyone but his wife!

Bwahahaa! Good one.

I do feel sorry for Dijana. Even though she is somewhat complicit in him being able to continue acting as he is. I don't know how much of that is her having been manipulated, and how much is self-preservation/getting what she can out of the situation?

In a sense, it could be a form of prostitution itself: you tolerate the crap you get from your husband and even support him (on the surface at least), in return for the 'pay' - income and a form of material security (but at the cost of your own emotional and mental health).

17

What would Watchtower Corporation(tm) do?

by punkofnice in

what would watchtower corporation(tm) do in compromise of their 'north korean style rules' if by publicly removing them, they could get more money and power?.

if each governing body(tm) member (pee be upon them), were offered a few million quid/bucks each to rescind the barbaric 'no whole blood' rule?.

i know what i think these fake religionists would do.

Journeyman

I think the answer hinges on the question "What do they (individually and collectively) actually believe?"

I think many of the opponents of JWs (whether exJWs themselves or not) underestimate this factor, perhaps because they assume that because they no longer believe the theology (and possibly never did), then none of the leadership do either.

If a GB member genuinely believes he has a God-given role to "lead the flock", and he genuinely believes in the no blood teaching, then threats or bribes will not sway him, and in fact are more likely to make him dig his heels in. Likewise with other controversial things like shunning. Most of us can remember being like that ourselves when we were "in", if we were threatened or sweet-talked into being tempted to "compromise" on any of those beliefs.

Where it would become really interesting, and maybe has been (or is) already causing tension at the top, is the power balance. What % of the GB are completely behind these teachings and how many could be persuaded to relax them or even abandon them at some time in return for "concessions"? Who holds the balance of power regarding which teachings are non-negotiable and which could be "flexible"?

I really don't think offering money would make a difference, but something like dropping legal action and/or giving immunity from prosecution or (in the case of more intolerant countries like Russia) giving the JWs more religious freedom might be tempting to some in the GB.

Possibly for some, giving them more influence in "the world" might also be tempting, like with UN lobby groups and national legal processes (forming religious freedom laws, etc), but again that would depend on how much they believe the "no part of the world" teaching and the concept that political organisations are controlled by the Devil, and their belief they're going to heaven to rule.

The evidence so far seems to be that the GB are "circling the wagons" and going into defensive mode over their most controversial core teachings, which suggests they really do believe in them and also really do believe that they are heading for the Armageddon showdown with "the world", or at the very least that changing their teachings now would somehow be worse than keeping them. It makes it less likely they will give way on anything unless one or more of them who hold some authority break rank.

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

Journeyman

green screen ! DUH!

Better be careful mentioning "green screen" or a certain person will be reporting there's a thread of 960+ pages on how he should use a green screen...

Oh my goodness, no. What a horrible vision. I have no problem with speakers with beards as some in the congregations do, but the day we see anyone giving a talk while having a tacky hairstyle and neckbeard like that, we will know that the JW standards of "dress and grooming" have really slipped!

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

Journeyman

Following up on that, here's what his recent "My Greatest Wish And Worst Fears" video was about.

Our 'friend' discussed his wishes and fears around the future of the JW org only, nothing about his own channel or life.

However, he did make a couple of comments that seem amusingly (or annoyingly) lacking in self-awareness. I've italicised his quotes and put my own observations in bold.

1) Over the years he has changed his view: Used to think it would be possible to see the JW org face a catastrophe, either from falling numbers or going bankrupt. Now he believes the JWs "can weather almost any storm".

2) His greatest wish now, with those reduced expectations, is for an FBI raid on Paterson and the seizure of the abuse database. Also feels it needs to happen at Bethels around the world, but if it happens in the US it could start to "snowball" from there.

His worst fear, apart from the current situation continuing indefinitely? He said: "I guess I'm living in my worst fear every day" - no, not that his own lies, manipulation of other people and cruelty to his wife have been exposed and his status and income have suffered but, that the organisation continues to facilitate abuse of children and "break apart families". Oh, the irony! At least they've never advocated so-called 'ethical' non-monogamy, aka sleeping with prostitutes if you feel you can't control your penis and your wife isn't "good enough" in bed.

He added: "Every day is a living nightmare with this organisation" (I don't think he meant working with Tibor and Dijana...)

3) How does he think it could be even worse? That the org becomes more self-aware, because at the moment they make it so easy to be criticised. (Ahem! More irony there.)

Removal of Tony Morris maybe means they are taking steps to make the organisation seem more credible to outsiders.

He said he "senses" there is a power shift going on, and slowly the leadership may be changing, with the likes of Sanderson having more influence and the arrival of new appointments Fleegle and Winder.

He theorised: What if the org were to hire a really good PR firm who would encourage them to shed the delusion thinking that has been guiding their decision making so far, and try harder to recruit thinking adults with rudimentary critical thinking skills?

One suggestion he speculated a PR firm might make was to give Splane "an indefinite time-out from appearing on camera until he can learn to stop being so condescending and patronising". He also added that Mark Sanderson is a "cold, calculated, manipulative individual". Pots and kettles, people in glass houses, etc?

While he perhaps makes some valid points, this video is a prime example of why he has zero credibility as a standard-bearer for reform. Every time he criticises others he exposes the hypocrisy of his own behaviour, none of which he has ever expressed real regret about.

21

Canada Bethel (Georgetown) to begin renovations early 2017

by Richard_I in

jw
friends

a letter was just read at my midweek meeting that georgetown (canada bethel) will have renovations done on it beginning spring 2017. the letter asked for publishers who are electricians/plumbers/etc.

and in good standing to apply to help out.

those helping out will be considered "part-time commuters" and will only be at the property for about 3 days a week and must reside outside of bethel and pay for all their own expenses.

Journeyman

the circuit overseer is still begging for free labour on this project.

It's odd that it's taking this long because in the USA and UK, when they put out appeals for labour and such for Bethel construction, they're usually able to get 'volunteers' quite easily.

I had heard that numbers and interest were declining in Canada (in common with most other developed lands) - perhaps the drop-off is greater than we thought?

Or perhaps, as said, it's the post-COVID effect. The building of the new US and UK Bethels were completed before the pandemic (in the case of Chelmsford, only just!) It's been noticeable that meeting attendance and ministry enthusiasm since 2020 are dramatically down, so perhaps volunteering is too? (Of course the GB would never admit to that.)

Another thought: JW numbers in the USA are much greater so they would get labour more easily, but the UK and Canada are comparable (about 120,000-140,000 peak pubs) - but of course the distance to travel is much greater across Canada, so maybe that's putting off volunteers who don't want to cross the country and stay away from home, or can't afford to do it - or both?

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

Journeyman

How exactly is he swamped? Ok, so the JW conventions are coming up. So that's three days (actually only about 18 hours in total) of meeting content. Wow. Added to what? One broadcast, a few additions to the JW website to comment on and maybe an interview or a couple of voicemails and a handful of member live chats a month. That's supposed to be his actual job though!

Hardly "swamped". What else does he do with all of his time, apart from some occasional gigs or comedy shows? Oh, and writing nasty, gaslighting messages to his wife.

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

Journeyman

We don’t know whether he has replaced it with a newer and better vehicle. He left it open for speculation and perhaps this was deliberate.
... Perhaps he has done what all micro-penis middled aged men do in a mid-life crisis...

That's a fair point. After that hair, the embarrassing motor would be a logical follow-up. Or maybe he's bought a motor-home. Travel around the country without having to pay rent and have his own 'love nest' in the back for those 'special' (paid for) encounters.

And I can't believe I missed this wide open goal:

... unlike yourself, eh, Lloydy-boy?

Oh, and by the way:

That number just keeps on slowly sinking!

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

Journeyman

So why has he sold off the BMW?

Surely he still needs his own transport if he's going to be at venues for gigs/comedy shows, or for taking the kids out when he meets up with them?

Since he was concerned about how much he would get for it, perhaps he really is cutting back financially now? He didn't sound as though he was happy to part with it.

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

Journeyman

Looks like the tweet has gone now and there's no sign of this "live debate", so he was either trolling or he probably couldn't be bothered. Or perhaps the alleged unbaptised publisher backed out (if they ever even existed).

But really, is this how low he's sunk? Trying to drag unbaptised publishers into his arena to be put on display and harangued for views?

What happened to the lengthy panel discussions with members of the exJW community, the exclusive leaks and news from inside WT?

Oh yes, that's right. All his sources and contacts abandoned him because of his disgusting behaviour, so he's reduced to this sort of thing.