sorry for the double post. I dont know what happened there!
Unclepenn1
JoinedPosts by Unclepenn1
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20
Sciptures? Help???
by lostsheep82 ini know this subject is touchy, and i dont want to stir feathers.....but with my most recent convo with my mom and her "anointed" husband, they dont have as much of a problem with me discrediting the society as i do, as they do with the fact that i'm gay.
as he puts it....ignore the society and what they teach....go to the bible...so i asked him what about david and jonathans relationship, how can you prove they didnt have a sexual love for eachother and he says...'amanda, do you think they were bum holing eachother?'.
well when you put it that way i dont know, but that has nothing to do with the fact that most gay relationships have nothing to do with the actual act of sex, they have to do with the love two people share, cause they can't share it with someone else.. his response was simpathetic, and cause of my abusive past, that is what they blame it on........if i wasnt abused i wouldnt be gay.
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Sciptures? Help???
by lostsheep82 ini know this subject is touchy, and i dont want to stir feathers.....but with my most recent convo with my mom and her "anointed" husband, they dont have as much of a problem with me discrediting the society as i do, as they do with the fact that i'm gay.
as he puts it....ignore the society and what they teach....go to the bible...so i asked him what about david and jonathans relationship, how can you prove they didnt have a sexual love for eachother and he says...'amanda, do you think they were bum holing eachother?'.
well when you put it that way i dont know, but that has nothing to do with the fact that most gay relationships have nothing to do with the actual act of sex, they have to do with the love two people share, cause they can't share it with someone else.. his response was simpathetic, and cause of my abusive past, that is what they blame it on........if i wasnt abused i wouldnt be gay.
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Unclepenn1
>Well UP I respect your comments, and somewhat agree with you even though, no, that isn't what any gay person wants to hear. lol.
I appreciate your response. You are obviously thinking very much about this subject, and the fact that you did not rip my head off reveals a lot :)
>Your illustration was an interesting one and you make a point, however, in this day and age, do you really think God is going to destroy all the gays, and people who don't go to 'church'? That would amount to an aweful lot of people.
Here is what I believe, because it is what the Bible teaches (not any man made religion). I am going to use a few of the 10 commandments as an example of why God WILL condemn most of humanity.
Humans are in a perpetual state of sin. They have been cursed because of the Fall of Man, and whatever they might try to do to please God, they fail, because of being lawbreakers. Let me give you an example, and this has nothing to do with homosexuality. I will ask you a few questions to make it more personal. Just answer in the privacy if your own heart.
1. You shall not lie.
Have you ever lied? How many times in your life do you think you have lied? What do you call someone who tells lies? (hint, it rhymes with fire)
2. You shall not steal.
Have you ever stolen anything, even if it is small (regardless of how much it costs)? What do you call someone who steals things?
3. You shall not take the name of the Lord in vain.
Have you ever used the title or name of God or Jesus to curse? The Bible says that no blasphemer will enter the Kingdom. Think about it. If God gave you life, and you use his name to curse, that reveals what is in your heart. The Bible says that we are all enemies of God through our wicked works.(Col 1:21). We do not speak well of our enemies.
4. Have you ever had sex outside of the marriage covenant?
God made sex for two people who will be united before Him in a covenant. The sexually immoral will not enter the kingdom.
5. Honor your Father and Mother.
Have you always obeyed your parents? Did they ever have to tell you to do something twice?
Just by looking at a few of the commandments, it is obvious that we are all lawbreakers, and in need of forgiveness. This is where the GOOD NEWS comes in. God (Yahweh, Jehovah, El Shaddai, etc) became a man in the person of Jesus Christ. He lived a sinless life, he never lied once, he never blasphemed once, etc. When he was put to death, he was paying for the sins of those people who would repent and trust in him. It was a legal transaction that was taking place. We broke God's laws, Jesus paid the fine with his sinless life and substitutionary death. NO more killing of bulls and sheep. Jesus was the lamb of God and bore the sin of many (see Isa 53).
I am now in a right relationship with God because I have been forgiven by Him.I do good works now because I have been forgiven and God is my Father, and no longer my enemy. I live for Him and love Him more than my own desires, because He put His spirit in me. This is the gospel, and one of the reasons that the JW's are teaching a false gospel. The JW 'system' can never wash away your sins, because it is based on doing good works to please God. Only a sinless sacrifice can do that, and that is what Jesus did.
Sweetheart, your problem is more than a struggle over homosexuality. You know in your conscience that it is wrong, and that is why you are looking for something--anything!!--to make you feel like it is right. But that is not how God made you. However, even if you were not attracted to the same sex, you still have a problem with all the other sins against God. You need to be reconciled to Him. Not by church,not by works, but by faith in the sin-bearer, Jesus Christ. HE will save you and give you a new heart and new desires. (Pick up the gospel of John and just read it- in a real translation, not the NWT)
I used to be a slave to my desires, with sex, drugs, and anything that gave me pleasure. But God is rich in mercy, and he has forgiven me and has given me something far greater than physical pleasure. He has given me joy, and I wake up everyday with joy because I no longer have a nagging conscience.
This is genuine love. The world (and religions like the WT) offer a false love, that is dependent upon something else (in the WT's case, going to meetings or field service, and if you don't, look out, attitude change towards you). But God's love is real, but it involves following Jesus and forsaking sin.
I care for you, and am praying for you, honey. If you ever need to talk about anything, please email me. ([email protected]) I will give you the truth in love as best I can. Thanks for listening. -
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Sciptures? Help???
by lostsheep82 ini know this subject is touchy, and i dont want to stir feathers.....but with my most recent convo with my mom and her "anointed" husband, they dont have as much of a problem with me discrediting the society as i do, as they do with the fact that i'm gay.
as he puts it....ignore the society and what they teach....go to the bible...so i asked him what about david and jonathans relationship, how can you prove they didnt have a sexual love for eachother and he says...'amanda, do you think they were bum holing eachother?'.
well when you put it that way i dont know, but that has nothing to do with the fact that most gay relationships have nothing to do with the actual act of sex, they have to do with the love two people share, cause they can't share it with someone else.. his response was simpathetic, and cause of my abusive past, that is what they blame it on........if i wasnt abused i wouldnt be gay.
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Unclepenn1
>Well UP I respect your comments, and somewhat agree with you even though, no, that isn't what any gay person wants to hear. lol.
I appreciate your response. You are obviously thinking very much about this subject, and the fact that you did not rip my head off reveals a lot :)
>Your illustration was an interesting one and you make a point, however, in this day and age, do you really think God is going to destroy all the gays, and people who don't go to 'church'? That would amount to an aweful lot of people.
Here is what I believe, because it is what the Bible teaches (not any man made religion). I am going to use a few of the 10 commandments as an example of why God WILL condemn most of humanity.
Humans are in a perpetual state of sin. They have been cursed because of the Fall of Man, and whatever they might try to do to please God, they fail, because of being lawbreakers. Let me give you an example, and this has nothing to do with homosexuality. I will ask you a few questions to make it more personal. Just answer in the privacy if your own heart.
1. You shall not lie.
Have you ever lied? How many times in your life do you think you have lied? What do you call someone who tells lies? (hint, it rhymes with fire)
2. You shall not steal.
Have you ever stolen anything, even if it is small (regardless of how much it costs)? What do you call someone who steals things?
3. You shall not take the name of the Lord in vain.
Have you ever used the title or name of God or Jesus to curse? The Bible says that no blasphemer will enter the Kingdom. Think about it. If God gave you life, and you use his name to curse, that reveals what is in your heart. The Bible says that we are all enemies of God through our wicked works.(Col 1:21). We do not speak well of our enemies.
4. Have you ever had sex outside of the marriage covenant?
God made sex for two people who will be united before Him in a covenant. The sexually immoral will not enter the kingdom.
5. Honor your Father and Mother.
Have you always obeyed your parents? Did they ever have to tell you to do something twice?
Just by looking at a few of the commandments, it is obvious that we are all lawbreakers, and in need of forgiveness. This is where the GOOD NEWS comes in. God (Yahweh, Jehovah, El Shaddai, etc) became a man in the person of Jesus Christ. He lived a sinless life, he never lied once, he never blasphemed once, etc. When he was put to death, he was paying for the sins of those people who would repent and trust in him. It was a legal transaction that was taking place. We broke God's laws, Jesus paid the fine with his sinless life and substitutionary death. NO more killing of bulls and sheep. Jesus was the lamb of God and bore the sin of many (see Isa 53).
I am now in a right relationship with God because I have been forgiven by Him.I do good works now because I have been forgiven and God is my Father, and no longer my enemy. I live for Him and love Him more than my own desires, because He put His spirit in me. This is the gospel, and one of the reasons that the JW's are teaching a false gospel. The JW 'system' can never wash away your sins, because it is based on doing good works to please God. Only a sinless sacrifice can do that, and that is what Jesus did.
Sweetheart, your problem is more than a struggle over homosexuality. You know in your conscience that it is wrong, and that is why you are looking for something--anything!!--to make you feel like it is right. But that is not how God made you. However, even if you were not attracted to the same sex, you still have a problem with all the other sins against God. You need to be reconciled to Him. Not by church,not by works, but by faith in the sin-bearer, Jesus Christ. HE will save you and give you a new heart and new desires. (Pick up the gospel of John and just read it- in a real translation, not the NWT)
I used to be a slave to my desires, with sex, drugs, and anything that gave me pleasure. But God is rich in mercy, and he has forgiven me and has given me something far greater than physical pleasure. He has given me joy, and I wake up everyday with joy because I no longer have a nagging conscience.
This is genuine love. The world (and religions like the WT) offer a false love, that is dependent upon something else (in the WT's case, going to meetings or field service, and if you don't, look out, attitude change towards you). But God's love is real, but it involves following Jesus and forsaking sin.
I care for you, and am praying for you, honey. If you ever need to talk about anything, please email me. ([email protected]) I will give you the truth in love as best I can. Thanks for listening. -
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Sciptures? Help???
by lostsheep82 ini know this subject is touchy, and i dont want to stir feathers.....but with my most recent convo with my mom and her "anointed" husband, they dont have as much of a problem with me discrediting the society as i do, as they do with the fact that i'm gay.
as he puts it....ignore the society and what they teach....go to the bible...so i asked him what about david and jonathans relationship, how can you prove they didnt have a sexual love for eachother and he says...'amanda, do you think they were bum holing eachother?'.
well when you put it that way i dont know, but that has nothing to do with the fact that most gay relationships have nothing to do with the actual act of sex, they have to do with the love two people share, cause they can't share it with someone else.. his response was simpathetic, and cause of my abusive past, that is what they blame it on........if i wasnt abused i wouldnt be gay.
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Unclepenn1
Well, this will not be the most popular post I am sure, but you are asking for people's opinions and I felt I should share mine. First of all, I am sorry that you grew up in an abusive situation. That is horrible, and adding a cult like the Watchtower to the mix is all the more distressing. I feel for you, and I am so sorry! Next, I want to paint a scenario for you and see what you think. Lets say that as long as I can remember, I have had a desire to steal things from people. If I am in a store, or even in someone's home, I get "itchy fingers" and I just cannot help myself. I see something I desire, and I go after it. I get great pleasure from it, more so than I do doing the right thing. I think this is the way that God made me..... How would you respond to such a scenario? Would you agree that there are certain behaviors that would best be suppressed? That there are certain things that people need to avoid pursuing, because they are impulses within them that are wrong? Even sinful? I believe your feelings for women are real, but I believe that they are not there from God, nor are they things that should be cultivated. You are confusing identity with behavior. You follow a particular behavior, and use that as a means of your personal identity. I am sorry, this is not what you want to hear, but it is true. I know it is hard to hear, and please, consider this a big hug from me as well, but this is something that God does not approve of at all. He did not make men to be with other men, and women to be with other women. It is apart from His created order. Contrary to some of the other posts, there is no scientific evidence for homosexuality, (although many have tried really hard to find something). I have a male friend whom I love deeply. He is my brother, and I can trust him, and I care for him. This is the kind of love that David and Jonathan had. They loved one another, but not in a perverted sexual way. The reason people say that is because they want to justify their behavior, so they go to the Bible looking for anything that will give them an out to do whatever they wish. I am sorry sweetheart, but it is not consistent with what God has told us, and those who point to genuine love in the Bible and twist it to justify their behavior are leading you astray. I know your understanding of God has been distorted. I would just ask that you look to Jesus. If you want to know what God is like, look to Jesus the Son. He is the embodiment of God Himself, and He revealed everything we need to know. He is compassionate and understands your sins, but wants you to forsake them. He warns us that if our right hand causes us to sin (or a particular relationship), cut it off. He wants us to be holy because that is where we will find freedom. Not in a religion, or an organization, but in a person. In Him. "He who has the Son has life" 1 John 5:12. Respectfully, UP
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Selling entire WT collection......HUGE 1879-2005
by Unclepenn1 inif you were ever interested ini owning all of the old material that you could show to jw's, here is your chance to get it all in one place.
it takes many years to find and purchase all that is needed to do this.
now, get it all in one shot!
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Unclepenn1
bttt
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Selling entire WT collection......HUGE 1879-2005
by Unclepenn1 inif you were ever interested ini owning all of the old material that you could show to jw's, here is your chance to get it all in one place.
it takes many years to find and purchase all that is needed to do this.
now, get it all in one shot!
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Unclepenn1
If you were ever interested ini owning all of the old material that you could show to JW's, here is your chance to get it all in one place. It takes many years to find and purchase all that is needed to do this. Now, get it all in one shot!
Please see the auction link below. Taking best offers!
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280065706443
copy/paste link into browser -
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Help With Insomnia
by metatron ini frequently have insomnia - but have found some help in getting back to sleep.. first, stop talking to yourself in your head!
if you get up to go to the bathroom, don't allow any internal dialog.. second, try doing the "wave".
you pretend that a gentle wave is moving your body in bed.
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Unclepenn1
I understand about the internal dialogue, but my problem is that I wake up to go to the bathroom and I have a song in my head, that I cannot turn off. It is like a radio playing a song that will not end. Ugh! Drives me crazy. I have tried everything. I switched my position to sleep north/south instead of east/west and that seemed to work for a month or so..... Penn
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Shunned Father and WT Lawsuit
by Unclepenn1 indoes anyone know anything else about this as of late?
what is going on with it?
is he getting enough money?
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Unclepenn1
Does anyone know anything else about this as of late? What is going on with it? Is he getting enough money?
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Hello, I'm new here
by debbiedebbie ini left the jw's in 1990 and officially left or at least decided never to return again in 1993. i announced that i'd rather die in armageddon than live with these people.
they don't want to speak to me much anymore.. but i'm concerned because i have a 4 yr old child and i don't want to attend any church.
nothing against those who do.. but should i go for my child even though i will stare into outerspace until its over or is this a worse example than not attending at all?.
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Unclepenn1
Hi Debbie, have you ever been to a church? I mean, lately? There are some wonderful churches that I frequent, where they teach about God in a loving and supportive environment. I think it is worth a try. Dont let the WT indoctrination keep you away. You just need to experiment and see what is right for you. I think you might be surprised.
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I NEED YOUR HELP WITH LAWSUIT AGAINST THE WATCHTOWER
by SHUNNED FATHER ini need your help to continue my lawsuit against the watchtower society and the doctor who the watchtower society arranged for to give my daughter arsenic.
the wts lawyer, hlc members and the doctor deceived bethany and lied to her, convincing her that arsenic would cure her.
bethany was convinced that arsenic could cure her and was curing her.
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Unclepenn1
Just donated. Keep this thread going, or start a new one soon! (Sometimes the multiple page ones get passed by)
Penn