Posts by avaddohn94

gb helper robert luccioni paid a visit to the branch that oversees mexico and central america and, you can probably imagine all the "excitement" among the witnesses who were tied in via internet.. this time they really emphasized that none of the information that was shared during such a "magnificent" event was to be posted on social media.

the fact that they are becoming more secretive should alert anyone about the dangers posed by cult-like religions but, truth be told, that is a very difficult thing to understand from within.. still, this picture might be of help!

in the end, luccioni's objective as representative of the governing body was very clear: money!

avaddohn94

Well, I'm sure you probably still find those huts you mention in certain areas OneEyedJoe, but most kingdom halls used in Central America, even in the poorest regions are similar to this one: http://static.panoramio.com/photos/large/11863196.jpg

Actually, Chiapas, which is probably the poorest state in Mexico has 3 or 4 assembly halls already (well-built and pretty functional depending on their region if I may say). You will also find nice kingdom halls built in rural areas in Belize, Costa Rica and so on.

The thing is that whenever they get into a project of that nature, the Branch will make loans for plots of land and during the months or years that the construction takes place, the brothers are told: "keep the donations coming my friends, the need is even greater". Eventually, they get their kingdom hall and as we all know, they also get an unpayable debt which as per their new instructions is not a monthly lease but a contribution (woe betide them if they cease sending the money one month because they'll get a letter immediately demanding for reasons and, more importantly, the money).

I've only posted 2 topics at jehovahs-witness.com. You may find the other one pretty interesting as well on these same matters.

15

Pathetic manipulation at the Zone Visit to the Mexico Branch (Central America)

by avaddohn94 in

jw
friends

gb helper robert luccioni paid a visit to the branch that oversees mexico and central america and, you can probably imagine all the "excitement" among the witnesses who were tied in via internet.. this time they really emphasized that none of the information that was shared during such a "magnificent" event was to be posted on social media.

the fact that they are becoming more secretive should alert anyone about the dangers posed by cult-like religions but, truth be told, that is a very difficult thing to understand from within.. still, this picture might be of help!

in the end, luccioni's objective as representative of the governing body was very clear: money!

avaddohn94

GB helper Robert Luccioni paid a visit to the branch that oversees Mexico and Central America and, you can probably imagine all the "excitement" among the witnesses who were tied in via internet.

This time they really emphasized that none of the information that was shared during such a "magnificent" event was to be posted on social media. The fact that they are becoming more secretive should alert anyone about the dangers posed by cult-like religions but, truth be told, that is a very difficult thing to understand from within.

Still, this picture might be of help! In the end, Luccioni's objective as representative of the Governing Body was very clear: MONEY! And this time, they mounted a complete play appealing to their sense of shame using the "experience" of an "anonymous" kid whose savings into a piggy bank were sent in support of the worldwide work.

Next, they actually showed the piggy bank with a bow and then warned all the brothers south of the border once again not to share this information on social media. IMO, there is one word that truly defines all of the above: PATHETIC.

If you think that a lot of people in Central America (i.e. Panama, Nicaragua, Honduras, Guatemala, El Salvador, Costa Rica and Belize) live in abject poverty and the fact that according to the World Bank 33% of Mexico's population lives in moderate poverty and 9% in extreme poverty, you can imagine why some of us consider the above a despicable way of manipulating, not just any people, but our families and friends who are still within.

In the end, they will probably end up sharing this when they start broadcasting in Spanish at tv.jw.org and many will probably say: "you see, there is no secrecy and everything is clearly exposed", however, even if they upload these shameful talks, very few of our friends and dear ones will get a chance to see the wicked agenda of their leaders.

Best regards,

Avaddohn94

50

Look at this fear mongering graphic from latest WT

by cappytan in

.

avaddohn94

I'm not sure if which I image I fear the most. The one posted by cappytan or this one:

12

They're GONE

by OneFingerSalute in

so any scuttle-butt on the wherefores and why's of the disappearance of song 139 and the april km from jdubya dot org?.

seems strange even for them to release something and just a few days later nuke it.

.

avaddohn94

Below you will find the link that still works to download the KM.

http://www.jw.org/en/publications/kingdom-ministry/km201504

Now, I did download a copy on February 10 and I've just compared it vs. the one above and they seem pretty much the same.

http://www.diffnow.com/?report=a5k3r

We'll have to wait and see if they actually post a different one.

I actually did notice a difference with the version in Spanish which is the number of the "new song". In English they just say "New Song" whereas in Spanish they do include No. 139. I don't think that "fact" should be the cause for dropping the file but, who knows?

20

Looking for details about the Org , property ownership and not a religion in Mexico

by Crazyguy in

i was unable to find any details on this on jwfacts, anyone have details on the wt not being a religion so they could instead own property?.

avaddohn94

Not really Apognophos. Here's what I identify as the problem. Neither the preaching work nor owning places of worship was banned or semibanned in Mx. Mormons and evangelicals did their preaching work during those 50 years without any restrain or limitation and the Catholic Church held massive gatherings out of their temples as well. They only surrendered their places of worship to Mexico's government pursuant to the law in effect back then and because of that, they were able to sing inside their temples, use the bible when preaching and pray. The Watchtower chose to retain ownership of their properties and assets and preferred to become a cultural association. Their Kingdom Halls became "Halls of Cultural Studies" (which were mainly built in backyards of "spiritual families" in some sort of clandestine way), they ceased to pray, they were not allowed to use the Bible when preaching and of course, they did not sing. I'm sorry, but I do see a double standard coming from a religion which actually preferred to give up to three main elements of spiritual gatherings before turning their assets to Caesar (as all the other churches did in order to provide their spiritual aid).

20

Looking for details about the Org , property ownership and not a religion in Mexico

by Crazyguy in

i was unable to find any details on this on jwfacts, anyone have details on the wt not being a religion so they could instead own property?.

avaddohn94

Now, the original wording of section II of article 27 (which dates back to 1917) was:

http://www.juridicas.unam.mx/infjur/leg/conshist/pdf/1917.pdf

II.- Las asociaciones religiosas denominadas iglesias, cualquiera que sea su credo, no podrán en ningún caso tener capacidad para adquirir, poseer o administrar bienes raíces, ni capitales impuestos sobre ellos; los que tuvieren actualmente, por sí o por interpósita persona entrarán al dominio de la Nación, concediéndose acción popular para denunciar los bienes que se hallaren en tal caso. La prueba de presunciones será bastante para declarar fundada la denuncia. Los templos destinados al culto público son de la propiedad de la Nación, representada por el Gobierno Federal, quien determinará los que deben continuar destinados a su objeto. Los obispados, casas curales, seminarios, asilos o colegios de asociaciones religiosas, conventos o cualquier otro edificio que hubiere sido construido o destinado a la administración, propaganda o enseñanza de un culto religioso, pasarán desde luego, de pleno derecho, al dominio directo de la Nación, para destinarse exclusivamente a los servicios públicos de la Federación o de los Estados en sus respectivas jurisdicciones. Los templos que en lo sucesivo se erigieren para el culto público, serán propiedad de la Nación.

Translation:

Religious institutions known as churches, regardless of creed, may in no case acquire, hold, or manage real property or hold mortgages thereon; such property held at present either directly or through an intermediary shall revert to the Nation, any person whosoever being authorized to denounce any property so held. Presumptive evidence shall be sufficient to declare the denunciation well founded. Places of public worship are the property of the Nation, as represented by the Federal Government, which shall determine which of them may continue to be devoted to their present purposes. Bishoprics, rectories, seminaries, asylums, and schools belonging to religious orders, convents, or any other buildings built or intended for the administration, propagation, or teaching of a religious creed shall at once become the property of the Nation by inherent right, to be used exclusively for the public services of the Federal or State Governments, within their respective jurisdictions. All places of public worship hereafter erected shall be the property of the Nation.

So, as you can see 1917's Constitution clearly states that churches in Mx could not own property. This law was in force when the organization obtained it's first registration back in 1932. Nine years later in 1943, they somehow "noticed" this tiny little detail and decided to restructure itself as a "civil association" which aim was SUPPOSEDLY no longer religious but "cultural" (as they have already told you, this part of the story can be barely found in pages 211-212 of 1995's yearbook).

An interesting fact you won't find anywhere else regarding this period (1943 - 1993) is that the only publication that was actually prepared and "adapted" for Mexico was Our Kingdom Ministry which kept its old title and at first, did not use the names of Jehovah or Jesus. They were known as the "Maestro Principal" and "Gran Maestro" respectively. Great emphasis was put on the adult literacy campaign and to quote the Bible a code using numbers was followed (for instance Matthew 23:10 appeared in the Bulletin as 40, 23:10).

Though they do admit that their decision had to do with the ownership of property, they try to include preaching and holding public assemblies as two other reasons which have no real basis to be credited.

The fact that this "cultural status" had more to do with "property ownership" is highlighted if you consider that after the reform of article 27 in 1992, on April 13, 1993 they immediately embraced back their "religious status".

Do they still report and announce with a great fanfare their literacy campaign achievements? Rhetorical question...

20

Looking for details about the Org , property ownership and not a religion in Mexico

by Crazyguy in

i was unable to find any details on this on jwfacts, anyone have details on the wt not being a religion so they could instead own property?.

avaddohn94

In 1992's reform, section II of article 27 was modified and to this day reads as follows:

http://www.diputados.gob.mx/LeyesBiblio/htm/1.htm

II. Las asociaciones religiosas que se constituyan en los términos del artículo 130 y su ley reglamentaria tendrán capacidad para adquirir, poseer o administrar, exclusivamente, los bienes que sean indispensables para su objeto, con los requisitos y limitaciones que establezca la ley reglamentaria;

Fracción reformada DOF 28-01-1992

Translation:

II. Religious organizations set up pursuant to article 130 and its regulations shall be entitled to acquire, possess or manage, exclusively, the property required to accomplish its purposes, provided they comply with the requirements and limitations set forth in the abovementioned regulations;