i have been surprised recently to see so much support by ex-jws for the watchtower's refusal to fight and kill.
in my opinion it is a vice masquerading as a virtue.
of course war should always be a last resort but there are occasions that it has to be done.
JW's strong adherence to shunning itself shows they are not pacifists.
War is divine when it is done for right cause--just like cutting the flesh is good when a surgeon does it for removal of cancerous formation whereas cutting the flesh for its own sake is bad.
so jehovah the bronze age deity god of the nation of bc israel.
next he's the god of the whole world even outer space,, as man's understanding of the earth increases past the bronze age so does jehovah's greatness.
the watchtower interpretation of scripture presupposes what they know about the world today or perhaps only what their thick brains know about the world today,, because they have this evil fixation about science and higher education being a tool of the devil to draw people away from the real truth found in the bible, their knowledge is very limited and back to the 1800s.. much to the chagrin of the watchtower corporation jehovah's godship has been significantly reduced due to what science can now tell about a probable multiverse.
God must be laughing at the way Bible and other scriptures depict Him. His role is to “renew” the provisions for life’s enjoyment whenever humans deplete/destroy them (Mathew 19:28). He is in no need to give details about Himself because many of the atheists do not act unrighteously and many of the theists do not act righteously, which means knowledge about God has often no effect on people’ behavior. Belief in God is similar to belief in other basic truths, such as belief in other minds. Body-mind problem and universe-“superior mind” (as coined by Einstein) problem are similar. Belief in God is optional.
i googled it and pretty much my understanding is the same as what i imagine.
no one really knows, your guess is as good as the next.
interesting thought to consider imo..
All those verses of sacrifices are written by Scribes whose hobby was to lie, says non other than great prophet Jeremiah 8:8
a couple of times at the meetings this year we've been told that in the future we might get some strange directions from the society that might not make any sense to us.
then they've said will we show our loyalty to jehovah by still obeying?
seems a rather unusual thing to say.
When survival is the issue, one would do anything--things such as dropping importance of 1914 teaching, amnesty to apostates ....
something just dawned on me today as i processed my assimilation into the real world (thanks to our new poster, @jester, giving me a major throwback to my first post).. when you're a jehovah's witness, you really are in some sort of la la land.
things which are perfectly normal are acts of eating from the table of the demons.
things which are horribly grotesque and extremely unjust are branded as "righteousness".
Everyone saw apple falling down, yet only Newton thought differently. Situation is same with those within the organization. Very few fortunate ones would dare to think!
i googled it and pretty much my understanding is the same as what i imagine.
no one really knows, your guess is as good as the next.
interesting thought to consider imo..
It is not about denial of Jesus or what he stands for etc. Approach this as if you are hearing them for the first time! You would also feel the same way as rationalists ask: "Jesus was tortured and executed in payment for the hereditary sin of Adam, including possible future sins." But why?--especially so when the Bible says sin cannot be swapped: "Fathers shall not be put to death for their sons, nor shall sons be put to death for their fathers; everyone shall be put to death for his own sin.” (Deuteronomy 24:16)
i googled it and pretty much my understanding is the same as what i imagine.
no one really knows, your guess is as good as the next.
interesting thought to consider imo..
Crazyguy,
That's an interesting point (Jesus passed test, was still killed).
All religious stories depicts Cause and Effect. Genesis 1 says mankind was created, and they remained perfect for some time. Then mankind turned egoistic and paradise is lost. This is symbolised through one man, Adam, who attached himself to "fruits of a tree," produce of creation, or turned materialistic.
Adam was mistaken as one man by apostle Paul, hence he thought one perfect man could regain what is lost, hence the story of Jesus's ransom sacrifice.
just wondering if there is any data about how many anointed there were in say 1914, and considering most would have passed 'beyond the veil' already, are the jw's numbers adding up?
we know there are more in 2017 then there were in 2016, but just where are we in the grand total column?.
Number is definitely beyond 144000 because there are many candidates from Old Testament too: "Instead, they were longing for a better country--a heavenly one. Therefore God is not ashamed to be called their God, for he has prepared a city for them." Hebrew 11:16)
they seem to think that all they will do is enjoy a carefree life with little or no concerns problems or worries whereas nothing could be further from the truth... according to the bible.. without trying to speculate on these concerns or problems during this one thousand year reign of christ jesus ,lets hear what the bible has to say about the end of his thousand year reign.. rev.20:7-10 satan is to be let out of his prison {as if he hasn`t done enough damage in 6000 years of roaming about in the earth at the same time fraternizing with jesus and jehovah in heaven} i digress.. and the reason he is let out of prison ,lo and behold ,is to mislead those nations in the four corners of the earth gog and magog to gather them together for the war.
{ here we go again ,armageddon didn`t solve anything we have to go through another one.
} 1000 years later.. now get this it`s not just some isolated little skirmish with a few hundred or even a few thousand dissenters ,as the bible states they number the sands of the seashore and they advanced over the breadth of the earth and encircled the camp {not a nation but a camp} of the holy ones.and the beloved city.. with that description it would seem the holy ones are in the minority and the opposes apparently were spread over all the earth.. so that description of the bible to me about jc 1000 rule does not appear to be one of living in a paradise , that is not on the agenda until after jesus christ 1000 year reign and only if you are lucky enough to survive another test/war of your loyalty after all you have gone through previously.. i wonder if this realization is one of the reasons why so many now are claiming to be of the anointed because as one of the other sheep you have to pass another test after the 1000 years of christ jesus rule whereas of one of the anointed on death now you go straight to heaven ..
In scriptures and in their interpretations we would find inconsistencies.Why? In this connection, Richard Dwakins makes an interesting observation in his God Delusion: "Why anything exists at all. What breathes life into the equations, and actualized them in a real cosmos? Such questions lie beyond science, however: they are the province of philosophers and theologians.' I would prefer to say that if indeed they lie beyond science, they most certainly lie beyond the province of theologians as well. What expertise can theologians bring to deep cosmological questions that scientists cannot? Why are scientists so cravenly respectful towards the ambitions of theologians, over questions that theologians are certainly no more qualified to answer than scientists themselves?"
they seem to think that all they will do is enjoy a carefree life with little or no concerns problems or worries whereas nothing could be further from the truth... according to the bible.. without trying to speculate on these concerns or problems during this one thousand year reign of christ jesus ,lets hear what the bible has to say about the end of his thousand year reign.. rev.20:7-10 satan is to be let out of his prison {as if he hasn`t done enough damage in 6000 years of roaming about in the earth at the same time fraternizing with jesus and jehovah in heaven} i digress.. and the reason he is let out of prison ,lo and behold ,is to mislead those nations in the four corners of the earth gog and magog to gather them together for the war.
{ here we go again ,armageddon didn`t solve anything we have to go through another one.
} 1000 years later.. now get this it`s not just some isolated little skirmish with a few hundred or even a few thousand dissenters ,as the bible states they number the sands of the seashore and they advanced over the breadth of the earth and encircled the camp {not a nation but a camp} of the holy ones.and the beloved city.. with that description it would seem the holy ones are in the minority and the opposes apparently were spread over all the earth.. so that description of the bible to me about jc 1000 rule does not appear to be one of living in a paradise , that is not on the agenda until after jesus christ 1000 year reign and only if you are lucky enough to survive another test/war of your loyalty after all you have gone through previously.. i wonder if this realization is one of the reasons why so many now are claiming to be of the anointed because as one of the other sheep you have to pass another test after the 1000 years of christ jesus rule whereas of one of the anointed on death now you go straight to heaven ..
In all the Scriptures and Epics of the world, details are too many, hence problematic. "When words are many, transgression is not lacking." (Proverb 10:19)
However, behind the details there is truth:
1) Earth continues to be a paradise till ego appears, and world becomes decadent.
2) Decadent, old world is renewed by God in its due time. (Mathew 19:28)
Interestingly, this theme can be seen in all scriptures of the world which defines God as the one who renews things, not as one who creates the world. This definition of God is reverberating throughout Bible also (Isaiah 65:17; Isaiah 66:22; Acts 3:21; 2 Peter 3:13 ; Revelation 21:1, 5 ....)
