Posts by undercover

56

Are You Psycho???

by minimus in

jw
friends

i liked frannie's question but i like this one even more!.......so are ya?

?

Sunday's WT study at the local KH

by Mulan in

my jw friend called me this morning to complain about the wt study yesterday.

it was all about apostates.

evidently some in that cong.

undercover

The definition of the word "apostate" is very simple: "One who has abandoned one's religious faith, a political party, one's principles, or a cause."

So whether one leaves the JWs because they disagree with the teachings or they leave because they just can't cope then, by definition, they are apostate. Whether we disagree with them or not, whether we vocalize it or not, whether we care or not, it doesn't matter, we're apostate. So is one who leaves the Republican party. Whether or not he joins the Democratic party doesn't matter. If he left the party, he is apostate.
To the average non-JW person, the word really doesn't mean anything. It's irrelevant to most people. It's just a word.

However, the WTS has taken this word, redefined and bastardized it until the true meaning of the word is completely lost. They have turned it into a buzzword that all JWs when hearing or seeing it, feel instant fear and loathing.
These articles are an excellent example of how they manipulate words and their meanings, how they manipulate the thinking and reasoning of their followers. Any logical, thinking person, not brain-washed by their tactics can see right through it. Unfortunately, they have enough brain-washed followers that hang on every word and treat those words as if from God himself that those of us who wish to leave feel the wrath and loathing of such manipulated people. We become victim to their witchhunts. But I refuse to be a victim.

I, for one, don't care what they call me. Call me apostate, call me weak, call me ungrateful, call me stupid, I don't care. I have finally awakened from a long nightmare known as Jehovah's Witnesses and realize now that they are a cult and I am free of it and will live my life on my terms and not those of a controlling, mind-warping, brain-washing cult. They have no power over me. I don't care what they think of me or what they tell others about me. Do your worst. I am free.

56

Are You Psycho???

by minimus in

jw
friends

i liked frannie's question but i like this one even more!.......so are ya?

?

undercover

Is THAT why my bum hurts?

Do you need someone to kiss it and make it all better?

56

Are You Psycho???

by minimus in

jw
friends

i liked frannie's question but i like this one even more!.......so are ya?

?

undercover

all i gotta say is....lock the bathroom door before taking a shower

45

Name Silly Reasons JWs Get Disfellowshipped

by minimus in

jw
friends

i know an argument can be made that any reason is unjustifiable but i'm thinking more of the dumbest reasons.

for example, if 2 "witnesses" saw you buy a lottery ticket, you could be df'd for "greediness"......any others??

?

undercover

I get a kick out of the idea that you can be DF'd for not buying the Watchtower doctrine, but it can change. So it's conceiveable that you could believe X and be DF'd for it, then the Society could change its mind and start teaching X, but you'd still be DF'd.

The founder of Christianity operated outside of the then present organized system but is considered truly righteous and true. The founder of the WTS(God's earthly organization) was operating outside of any organized system but is considered the original modern day faithful and discreet slave. Both of these men were apostate teachers(if looking at them from the organized system). If either one of these men rose out of the JW congegation today, they would be DFd.

24

How Spiritual Are You? -- A 20-question true/false test from TIME magazine

by Gopher in

jw
friends

the new time magazine has a story called "the god gene", which suggests that the need for god is built into our genes, and may have possibly evolved.

wouldn't that be ironic?

anyhow, here's the quiz.

undercover

I don't believe any test that says that I'm too skeptical.

28

Did You EVER See Yourself Leaving This Religion??/

by minimus in

jw
friends

15 years ago, i would've never thought i'd leave "the truth".

now, i wonder how i could've stayed on so long.

undercover

I think that's the case with a lot of people min. They try really hard and get discouraged because it's not working out the way the WTS said it would. So they figure it's their own fault some how. So they trudge through life hoping they are doing enough to gain God's favor, fearing Armageddon instead of welcoming it.
Every once in a while, someone wakes up and says, "Hey, this isn't right. Let me look into this." It isn't long before they realize the lies and deceit that have been handed down for generations.
Then there's the group who really don't pay attention to anything about anything. They just go along with what ever is said by the org and don't study, or question or anything. Those are the ones who will defend the WTS, because they don't have the capability to use their own power of reason anymore.

12

arguing with a dub....or....how I learned to be apostate and love it

by undercover in

recently, a jw relative tried to discuss my "spiritual well-being" with me.

i have had conversations in the past with this same relative concerning 607 vs 586/587 and 1914. no matter what i said, it went in one ear and out the other.

it was like talking to a brick wall.

undercover

It will never cease to amaze me that a person can listen to all that and still walk away with their ~~belief~~ denial system operating at full speed.

I wish I could say that, but I used to be that same person. I could stand at a door and argue about the WTS doctrine all day with someone and as soon as I got back in the car, I'd say, "How can they not see what I just showed them?" And they close the door and say, "How can these people be so self-deluded?"

Even though I left my dub relative speechless, they'll deny that they got stumped and pat themselves on the shoulder for their good deed. But, I too have been in his shoes and reacted just as he will. I can see why it happens because I have done it myself.

That's why I tend to accept the notion that the WTS and JWs are a cult. They use mind-control techniques to keep their members in self denial and self-deluded into believing that they alone have some kind of special connection with God and his "organization" and that nothing anyone else has to say can influence them to think otherwise.

28

Did You EVER See Yourself Leaving This Religion??/

by minimus in

jw
friends

15 years ago, i would've never thought i'd leave "the truth".

now, i wonder how i could've stayed on so long.

undercover

Once upon a time, when I was active and trying to be the best darn JW I knew how (read; at my most self-denied), I really couldn't understand how people could allow themselves to "fade-away" or get in trouble and lose contact with the organization. I had a good friend who was constantly in trouble with the elders. DF'd twice, reinstated twice, but always pushing the limits of what was acceptable. I looked at "weak" ones and wondered how could they face the rest of us when they came to the hall once every couple of months. I couldn't fathom being "out" looking in and being miserable as I had assumed that all "weak" ones were.

Now that I am out and I see the hypocrisy and the lies, I wonder, "How did I ever fall for this? What kept me in this mess for so long? Why wasn't I strong-willed enough to realize that I was being had?"

Going back to my earlier statement about being in self-denial, I equate my most devout period as a JW with my period of being the most in self-denial. As a kid and teenager, I wasn't serious about being a JW, but did just enough to stay under the radar. I led a double life in school. Later, I became an MS and married, but still was flying under the radar to not attract attention to certain things.
But just a couple of years before I finally admitted to myself something wasn't right, I really tried to put the "kingdom" (read organziation) first. Aux. Pioneered. Evening witnessing. Saturday and Sunday field service. Gatherings with the friends to study. Actually read the Bible and pulbications every night. Studied and prepared for meetings.
It was then that I realized that something wasn't right. I was doing all that I could and puttin on the new personality and keeping away from the world and its influences. But it wasn't enough. The more I did, the more they expected. The more I did, the happier I wasn't. The more I did, the more that the doubts that I refused to give voice to when I was "weaker" began to surface more often.
It wasn't long before I started searching outside of the "official" publications to find answers.
It wasn't long before I realized that I had been wrong my whole life.
It wasn't long before I quit being a Jehovah's Witness.

12

arguing with a dub....or....how I learned to be apostate and love it

by undercover in

recently, a jw relative tried to discuss my "spiritual well-being" with me.

i have had conversations in the past with this same relative concerning 607 vs 586/587 and 1914. no matter what i said, it went in one ear and out the other.

it was like talking to a brick wall.

undercover

Recently, a JW relative tried to discuss my "spiritual well-being" with me.

I have had conversations in the past with this same relative concerning 607 vs 586/587 and 1914. No matter what I said, it went in one ear and out the other. It was like talking to a brick wall. I realized I was wasting my breath and time, so I avoided "spiritual" discussions with this relative after a while.

In these discussions I usually tried to be non-agressive and non-threatening in my responses or my points, so as to not to get labeled "trouble maker" or even "apostate". I tried to just raise questions and doubts without committing to any one viewpoint or personal belief.

Well, recently this relative cornered me and started in again on my not attending meetings and questioning the F&DS. Instead of trying to counter argue every thing they said, I let them ramble on. I waited until their foot was firmly planted in their mouth and for them to take a breath. This time I decided to just come out and say what I was thinking instead of playing pyscho-babble bullshit games.

It was a fairly lengthy discussion, with them doing most of the talking until they got tired, but when I spoke, it was to the point, it rattled them and left them without a word to say.

They kept talking about the "organization" and how Jehovah has "always" had an earthly organization. I asked what organization did Adam belong to? What organization did Job belong to? What was the organization in 200AD? What was the organization in 1699? What organization did Russell belong to before creating the WTS? Speaking of Russell, Russell taught that Jesus returned in 1874 and that Armageddon was to come in 1914. It didn't happen, so the date changed. It didn't happen again and he died. Also while speaking of Russell, the man was a crackpot. Go back and read the early Watchtowers. The man was loopy. He measured pyramids and claimed that they were modern prophets. Where the hell did he get that? Divine inspiration? He died and another nice'un took over(against the will of the man who started it all). He set a new date and promised resurrection of people long dead. He was wrong. He changed the date of Jesus return from 1874 to 1914. Had to keep that 1914 date in there somehow.
So what is truth? 1874? 1914? 1975? Truth cannot change. If you claim that something is truth and then either change it or it is proved wrong, then truth was a lie. Truth cannot be one thing today and something else next week.
This "organization" has constantly revised doctrine and dates for Armaggedon. Every one of them for over one hundred years has been proved wrong. (At this point, they tried to argue that the WTS never said Armaggedon was coming in 75) Oh yes they did. They might not have said in these words, "Armaggedon is coming in 1975" but they alluded to it, they created a sense of urgency and they convinced us that it was so close that education, housing and medical situations were not important. But yet 1975 wasn't even an important year in anything. Nothing happened then, or later. But yet they kept that sense of urgency because the people alive in 1914 would see Armaggedon. Wrong again. That generation is gone. So, the WTS changes doctrine once again. This religion has preyed on the fears of people and none of their "prophecies" have come true. (Again they tried to argue that the org is not a prophet). Oh but you need to read your Watchtowers. They most certainly have claimed to be prophets. But they were wrong. They have false prophecied.
So you want me to put faith in a religion that has been proven wrong time and time again over and over? You want me to believe that this group of doomsayers started by a whacked pyramid measurer is God's prophet? Forget it.

They just stood there, dumbfounded and speechless. It was priceless.

But I know that this person will probably report back to the elders, so I can expect a phone call sometime soon, I'm thinking.