quick recap.
i'm 44, been df'd about a 10 months.
got baptized when i was 18, in and out of the borg for years due to guilt.
Perhaps the knowing look - while you felt like a spy - showed that he was also aware of the disreputable things which you know. The clumping together of the audience in the centre is herding, as if afraid of spreading. I don't know about the attendants, but their bright colours suggest clowns, while the feathers suggest the illusion of angels.
All amateur interpretation, I'm afraid, but I've had some very meaningful dreams in the past too.
i have been perplexed as to how to brung my wife out of jws and to exit the religion... but i had an idea last night.
i know that elders will legitimantly meet with brothers who have doubts and encourage them... not df them .. this is a sheperding call etc.. thus since my wife knows i have doubt s i could say: i want to have two brother over to discuss this ... she will agree.... of course i will hit these guys with biblical textual issues, an biology to where they are stunned and still ask... "so brothers... can you solve this conflict...?".
in this case they will not think of me as an apostate but may question their own beliefs... .
Forgive me - I misread your post when you spoke of being considered "apostate". If you sincerely do not believe, then I won't try to change your sincerity.
All the same, your unconfined manner must surely be noticed eventually, because there is something very un-natural, very claustrophobic in religions which tell one what to believe. People can't be in the company of someone who is normal without eventually noticing and wondering why they themselves do not feel that sense of freedom.
just as i think my loathing for the jw cult has peaked, it goes higher and higher.
i wish this cult would just go away.
i wish my wife would just wake up.
Good afternoon GoingThroughTheMotions,
My very best wishes to you and yours!
You'll have noticed how much attitude there is - whether for God or for watchtower / catholic / Pentecostal / ... or against - its everywhere, and its sickening. I sometimes wonder how many people actually value what it real - perhaps that can be to your advantage.
Perhaps the more normal you are, the more your family will wonder at themselves, and feel that their life in the church is somehow twisted - not though Holy Spirit, but just twisted, warped. I've seen others do this, not needing to question those around them on scripture or anything, just letting their spirit show itself as healthy compared to those who remain in the church. In the end, it becomes painful to ignore the truth - they just mellow, bit by bit, and stop seeing you as a lost soul but as a calmer, saner, more content, less stressed-out person
warning of a long boring post ahead.
i feel like i need to vent my story out, as i feel quite helpless at the moment.. i'm 31 year old, married, father of toddler with another one on the way, due later this month.
i've been serving as elder for about 4 years now in a south florida congregation.
Good morning Sanchy,
It takes someone very, very brave to admit that they've been wrong in something - very brave. There will be those who harden their faces at you, but that is a difficult heart to maintain without questioning within themselves - especially when someone is so clearly sincere, and clearly loving in his manner.
I think you will be held in high esteem - perhaps silently, for a while - but very much admired!
SIncere best wishes, sincere love to you and yours,
Acts5v29
i have been perplexed as to how to brung my wife out of jws and to exit the religion... but i had an idea last night.
i know that elders will legitimantly meet with brothers who have doubts and encourage them... not df them .. this is a sheperding call etc.. thus since my wife knows i have doubt s i could say: i want to have two brother over to discuss this ... she will agree.... of course i will hit these guys with biblical textual issues, an biology to where they are stunned and still ask... "so brothers... can you solve this conflict...?".
in this case they will not think of me as an apostate but may question their own beliefs... .
It might be hard to do, but remember that you are an individual lover of God first - and a member of the religion second.
Churches tend to have their protocols such as "shepherding calls" - which by their definition attribute a certain status to the one they are calling on - but you are a lover of God, and whatever they may have as their labels are nothing to do with you.
The watchtower is rich and powerful and massive, but the smallest person who is a lover of God - whatever his problems, whatever his flaws - is greater in God's eyes than a man-made church. You love God, yes...? then let can you let that love override the church's bluster - a creation of men, not of God? Whatever they tacitly threaten to take away, you will find elsewhere - except without the stringent controls upon you!
i mean this with all due respect, i would like to hear from genuine people who think jw have it wrong and then what is the truth?.
im not talking about silly little quibbles here and there.. is jehovah real?
the the bible is word?
In response to coffy who has claimed I threatened him in a letter, and after receiving many a belligerent post on the thread, I volunteer the PM I wrote to him entitled:
"must this continue...?"
If I may, I would like to mention something that happened many many years ago.
A fellow director made a spurious court claim against my defunct company. I had to get legal counsel, and since I could see he had no case I said I would like to write to this ex-director to offer him shares in the new company rather than him take this action which could only go wrong for him. My counsel said that is the very thing I should not do.
So the court case arose, my counsel was not allowed to speak in court or communicate with me during the proceedings. The case went more badly than I could have imagined: the judge denounced the director strongly, who had threatened to sue his own legal counsel as his case collapsed, and more to the point he had brought his son to the proceedings in order to savour his expectation of victory.
I knew he did not have a case and did not want him to be embarrassed, but ultimately there was nothing I could do, to my regret. He died a few months later.
I cannot answer questions to you which are not relevant, just because you want them to be. Some posts are becoming unkind, exaggerated and slanderous now. Please, save yourself further in this - the ministry is what it is and happens to be immune to your particular questionings. I sincerely do not wish you to be upset when the ministry itself is to bring a release of stress in people.
sincerely,
Acts5v29
I hope this will show - from its title to its ending - that it was a plea for posts on the thread to be more reasonable and subdued, and not a threat at-all.
i mean this with all due respect, i would like to hear from genuine people who think jw have it wrong and then what is the truth?.
im not talking about silly little quibbles here and there.. is jehovah real?
the the bible is word?
Good morning Outlaw
All you`ve done is..
Slap a Different "Time Line" on Armageddon..
The watchtower mentions the scriptures, so there are bound to be similarities - but the differences are vast: Armageddon does appear in the inspired scriptures, so it is going to happen sometime - but the timeline of the watchtower is clearly wrong. Armageddon will happen sometime after God's intervention, but it is not synchonised to it.
And..
Non Believers of your Faith/God "STILL DIE"..
Well not really. worshipJehovah.org is not a religion, and everyone - good or bad, believing in the intervention or not - will be rescued alive at God's intervention. We do not impose rules or beliefs on anyone, infact neither I nor my colleagues are allowed to teach scripture and beliefs.
When the intervention comes, then Christ will be in active authority - we will hear God's guidance from him, not the filtered version through religions - and people will be free to follow or not: either to stay independent, or to follow God's direct guidance. As for Armageddon, that only comes when some have decided to actively fight and defeat the Christ who will have come to solve the crisis that was killing us - remember the illustration of the vineyard?...
"This is the heir! Let's kill him, and the inheritance will resort to us"
- then, and then alone, will they be killed. But by that time, their belligerence will be beyond doubt and beyond reform.
i mean this with all due respect, i would like to hear from genuine people who think jw have it wrong and then what is the truth?.
im not talking about silly little quibbles here and there.. is jehovah real?
the the bible is word?
Genesis 2:17 is clearly a prophecy:
"If this happens, then that will happen"
It is all too easy for someone to quote selective words for their own advantage - such as "There is no God" from Psalm 10, or some supplementary words from a PM to portray as a threat what was genuinely conciliatory.
What is curious is why you are not afraid of this misrepresentation inasmuch as it damages your reputation a great deal. Sincerely, I would not wish that upon you.
( jw governing body members are invited to respond) .
however professional and glossy their pr makeover is, as seen on jw tv and the jw org logo... the bottom line is that 19th century religious adventist claims are no longer sexy..
to outsiders the jw org now has all the allure of a donkey wearing lipstick..
Good morning slimboyfat
The answer would probably be along the lines: who else has proclaimed Jehovah's name around the world? Who else teaches who Jesus really is, the Son of God, and how he gave himself as a ransom for mankind? Who else tells people the message that Jehovah plans to restore the earth to a paradise for obedient mankind? Who else tells the truth about what happens when you die? Who else has love among themselves and will not take arms up against each other if they happen to live on opposite sides of borders? Other groups may have some of these truths or be so small they have splintered from the truth. Only JWs proclaim all these truths around the world. It is on the basis of having identified these core truths that the GB can be said to be being used by Jehovah to lead his people in these last days.
A problem with this list is that it is a selective list of what the watchtower does, and then treats it as a touchstone for others. We have already spoken on another thread "Praying for the death..." which shows the kind of spirit they have resorted to - and I have shown form the scriptures that the fear-inducing centuries-long preaching of imminent Armageddon cannot possibly be true - yet you still do it. Given these things, exactly how can you claim to be being led by God?
There is a better way... let yourself be led by God, and leave behind those things which are so clearly at the opposite end of the spectrum.
i mean this with all due respect, i would like to hear from genuine people who think jw have it wrong and then what is the truth?.
im not talking about silly little quibbles here and there.. is jehovah real?
the the bible is word?
Good morning Outlaw,
Our ministry is different from the ones you mention, nothing to do with the watchtower no matter what coffy may impute - infact, a mere consequence of it shows that Armageddon cannot possibly be imminent, that the events of Revelation have not yet begun, and that the centuries-long preaching of imminent Armageddon has all been flawed.
Ours points to the climate crisis, and says there is a rescue of everyone alive - regardless of belief - and points to the 1st prophecy which warned we would reach this stage. Its proof requires not only a nemesis - such as the climate crisis will eventually be - but also a rescue from God, otherwise His prophecy that leaving Him would bring our demise would be hollow. The reasoning is very simple.
