ZazuWitts

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Posts by ZazuWitts

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  25

  What is?

  by larc in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  what is your favorite flavor of ice cream?

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  ZazuWitts

  Riz,

  This is larc's wife - not to worry, for I assure you I WILL beat him with a big stick!!!!!
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  83

  I Don't Sympathise With Suicides

  by Englishman in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  let me explain.. firstly i have seen any number of so-called attempted suicides.

  i've walked past an old girl friends house, seen her watching tv through the window, by the time i'm knocking on the door she's told me that she had her head in the gas oven and my knock stopped her.. my mother in law walks into the sea for a pastime.

  every time she can't get her own way she walks in up to her knees and waits for someone to see her.

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  ZazuWitts

  I typed 'suicide warning signs' into a search engine, dozens and dozens of sites came up.

  With little variation on all these sites, this is typically what was stated.

  75% of 'successful' suicide attempts were talked of before hand, and/or indicated by unusual or dangerous behaviors; one often mentioned was combining alcohol with drugs.

  While males have the highest percentage of 'successful' suicides, beginning with older (past age 60) males, then teenagers, then younger to mid-adult males.

  Women are more likely to 'say' they have attempted suicide, or are considering it for the attention factor, or as a desperation measure in a love-gone-bad relationship.

  Homosexuals, lesbians, and bisexuals all have a suicide rate up to at least 7% higher than heterosexual populations. (Some studies put it even higher.)

  Suicidal thoughts and attempts are significantly higher among people who:

  1. Have lost a mate/partner, parent, or other close relative.

  2. Among those who have had a dramatic experience connected with religion - excommunication, disillusionment re formally held deep beliefs, sudden abandonment of previous held beliefs...such as turning from Christianity to atheism, or vice versa without taking the time to be truly grounded/secure in new beliefs.

  3. Have been primary caregivers for someone close to them who has suffered longterm, and died as a result of a henious illness, particularly, but not limited to cancer in its various forms.

  There was much more information presented, but I wanted to specifically mention the above, because in one way or another they apply to Kevin. Furthermore, he had to additionally deal with stress imposed from Jon-Jon's JW father.

  Do I think Kevin truly wants to die? NO, but there is no doubt he is experiencing out of control thoughts, and does need the professional help, which will now hopefully be forthcoming.

  I give him credit, too, for coming back today to apologize, it couldn't have been an easy thing to do, to facing the entire JW.com community, and he could have just as easily privately e-mailed one or two of his chatroom friends.
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  7

  Code or Quiz

  by hillary_step in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  here is a sort of quiz.

  the question is, what is this?.

  sator.

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  ZazuWitts

  Hillary,

  The magic square? Can be arranged vertically and horizontally to spell out Pater Nostras (+). Some attribute it as a secret code of early Christians, others as Mithraic in origin. I think this symbolism was found frequently in Roman and British-Roman sites. Oh, and yes, I recall the extra 'o's and 'a's were placed at top and bottom of +, and perhaps represented the alpha and omega.

  Will be looking forward to your more accurate explanation - it's been years and years since I've encountered this.

  Well, that's my laughable 'stab' at this.
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  87

  Mother's Letter To Start Off The New Year...

  by silentlambs in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i received this letter from my mother over the weekend, it came with a card and a special note to my children.

  i plan to let them read it someday, not today..... silentlambs.

  december 20,2001 .

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  ZazuWitts

  Bill,

  I have read your mother's letter about three or four times. There is something within it that was troubling to me, but I just couldn't quite put my finger on it. Then it dawned on me - I think that while your mother's pain is very real, she penned the letter so that IF necessary, she could share the letter with others!!

  There are several reasons why she might do this, don't you think?

  Consequently, while I think you are entitled to reply, and should reply, I urge you to be cautious with your words. Things are 'heating' up and your own response to her could be publicly used against you, with the intent of portraying you in a negative way.

  Please don't give them the opportunity to do this.

  We all sincerely appreciate your efforts on behalf of the silentlambs Bill. I can only begin to imagine the stress and toll this is
  having in your lives. And, I do think you were absolutely correct in withholding the letters to your children. Both are written in such absolute JW black-and-white thinking, and designed to alienate, not bring together.

  As many others have advised, maybe hang on to the letter for a bit, mull your response over, and make your personal decision as to sending it as or...

  ((((Hugs))))
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  9

  Mohammad Ali and the Watchtower

  by clash_city_rockers in

  1. social
  2. physical

  in 1967 when ali got busted for being a draft dodger there was this lawyer who was a wt attorney.

  who was on ali's legel defense team and again in 1969-70 for the appeal process.

  was it milton hinshel?.

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  ZazuWitts

  Englishman,

  Your recollections sent me on a little search.

  In Penton's book "Apocalypse Delayed", p. 79, it reads, in part: ...in the early 1960s he was forced to leave New York with a severe drinking problem. Only after being excommunicated and reinstated was he to die in good standing as a Witness in 1979.

  I also found a reference in COC, where Franz puts his disfellowshipping in the 1970s. See footnote 14 at bottom of page 85.

  Hmmmm, which is it, 60s or 70s?
  I think it would be safe to conclude that you did hear him speak in the 'early' 60s, and that his disfellowshipment did not occur until ?perhaps? the mid-60s, or so.

  I do recall being at my very last JW social gathering, a picnic, in the summer of 1964, when I learned of his disfellowshippment. It was there that I heard some of his long-time friends feeling there was more too it than the man's alcohol problem.
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  9

  Mohammad Ali and the Watchtower

  by clash_city_rockers in

  1. social
  2. physical

  in 1967 when ali got busted for being a draft dodger there was this lawyer who was a wt attorney.

  who was on ali's legel defense team and again in 1969-70 for the appeal process.

  was it milton hinshel?.

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  ZazuWitts

  Clash,

  Hayden Covington was disfellowshipped in the early 1960's for alcholism.

  I do not know for certain, but perhaps it was during this time that he served on Mohammed Ali's defense team?

  I knew people who were close friends of Covington; many of them felt that the real reason he was DF'd was due to the frequent extremely heated disagreements/arguments he had with Nathan Knorr.

  I remember one old-timer commenting, "Hell, if there going to disfellowship you for booze, I reckon half of them should be gone."

  His closest friends also felt Covington found solace in alcohol because he was overextended and overworked in the extreme by the Society...something had to give. He was, indeed, the chief counsel for the organization for decades, handling the burden of the legal aspects solo...without the huge staff Watchtower Legal now has at their disposal.

  I've always tended to give the Knorr vs Covington reports considerable weight, simply because Covington was REINSTATED shortly after Knorr's death in 1977.
  And, there was a large memorial service held after his death, with hundreds in attendance.

  If, by chance, you haven't seen it yet, Randy Watter's has a most interesting interview with Covington on his Freeminds' site; this interview was conducted just a couple of days or so before Covington's death. Just click on the Freeminds' link below and type Covington into search. Quite a bit of unique history, IMO.
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  50

  Worried about my Dad in hospital :(

  by Simon in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  we visited angharad's parents at the weekend and got a call on sunday night from her sister who'd been called by my sister as they hadn't been able to contact us .... the message was not a happy one:.

  my dad has had a heart attack and was in intensive care in hospital.. it was a while before i managed to speak to anyone over there with people probably out but i eventually spoke to his wife who says he's doing ok and has now been moved to the main ward but is being kept in as you would expect.

  he may have to be moved to calgary for some investigation / tests.. he had heart surgery about 15 years ago and i think 4 of his 5 bypasses have failed so he has to take quite a bit of medicine for pain and stuff.

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  ZazuWitts

  I'm hoping for the best for your Dad, Simon. I know how much it has meant to you restablishing contact with him, and meeting your half-family.

  I take it as an encouraging sign that he has been moved out of intensive care. But certainly a visit by you would really 'do his heart' good.

  I say go ahead and extend your offer to your sister. It's a fine and generous thing to do; and how she responds is certainly up to her. If she drops the shunning act, and shows some true compassion it would be wonderful. If not, you will still know that you did the true, loving effort in trying to bring family together in the best interests of your Dad and family.

  We will all be thinking of you in this difficult time; and please keep us informed as to what happens next.
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  17

  Have you noticed....the skirts?

  by ozziepost in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  just a little observation: have you noticed that the 'sisters' pictured in the magazines invariably wear long, long skirts?

  check out the feb 1st issue.

  even the housewife at the sink washing dishes has an ankle length skirt.

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  ZazuWitts

  Ozzie,

  The "Nutter" Center, on the campus of Wright State University is where the JW's hold their district assembly for this neck of the woods.

  I dropped larc off at the arena this past August; and I did observe that 2/3 of the female attendees wore ankle-length skirts.

  What's ironic to me is that back in the mid-60's I was admonished, after wearing an ankle-length, floral print skirt to a meeting, that it was too 'hippie' looking! Ha,ha.
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  16

  My Story ..A Walk Through The Garden. part 1

  by radar in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  when jehovahs witnesses first started calling on my wife and i, we knew very little about the bible.

  the message that this world with all its wickedness and suffering was soon to end and be replaced by a new order under the rulership of christ jesus was very appealing to me.

  to believe that god had a purpose for mankind, gave my life a new direction.. acceptance of watchtower doctrine along with its rules and regulations is expected of any that wish to be baptized.

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  ZazuWitts

  Radar,

  A fine post...one that I think especially apt for many new posters, and those lurking, or studying with the JW's.

  Am looking forward to Part 2 - bring it on!
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  21

  I love my children! Want to see their pictures?

  by WildHorses in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  steve 17 .

  manuel 12 .

  nicole 9 .

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  ZazuWitts

  Lilacs,

  Lovely looking children; you've a right to be proud. Thanks for sharing them with us.