upsidedown,
I think it's rather obvious you have a bias in favor of believing in the Judeo-Christian God. Have fun.
Bradley
logansrun
JoinedPosts by logansrun
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31
A "first-timers" ponderings...
by upside/down ini accidentally posted this improplerly so i'll try again.... i'm a "first-timer"- so please be gentle ( or at least use lube).
can we try and look at the bible's message without any preconcieved notions that we've been fed?
read it as if we've been lost on a desert island our whole life- what would we come away with?
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31
A "first-timers" ponderings...
by upside/down ini accidentally posted this improplerly so i'll try again.... i'm a "first-timer"- so please be gentle ( or at least use lube).
can we try and look at the bible's message without any preconcieved notions that we've been fed?
read it as if we've been lost on a desert island our whole life- what would we come away with?
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logansrun
unclepenn ,
The fact that you state that the gospels were written decades after the fact reveals that you know little to nothing about textual criticism.
Even conservative Christians (ie the JWs) concede that some of the Gospels were written decades after Jesus death. The Gospel of John, for instance, is believed to have been written at the close of the 1st century -- about 70 years after Jesus death. The honorable New Testament scholar Bruce M. Metzger, in his notes to the RSV states that Mark, likely the earliest of the Gospels, was written shortly before the fall of Jerusalem in 70 AD. So, no, I am correct in stating that the Gospels were written "decades after the fact." I'm fully aware of the findings of modern textual scholarship, although there is by no means a consensus.
Nice ad hominem by the way.
Bradley
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Righteous Jehovah's Witnesses
by waiting inlast nite i found a web site which had a group of very straight, righteous jw's.
if any question was dubious, (like most of our group's) these questions were in an isolated section so as not to offend the remaining members.
this was by far the most interesting in questions and comments.. it was the attitude from friends worldwide that was fascinating in a somewhat horrible way.
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logansrun
But Lord, by know the thread stinkith!
And Jesus said,
"Thread! Come on out!"
And the thread came on out.
~b
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Evil Christmas!!!!!!
by Gill inwould you believe that i just got told off my a born again christian minister whose daughter goes to school with my daughter.. he knew that i was an ex jw and that we were celebrating christmas this year and proceeded to give me the full pagan origins thing, and people getting into debt, and it having nothing to do with jesus birth!
then there's the people who let themselves go morally at christmas parties and drink and drive and.........etc.. i thought only jw's would dress someone down like that.
i politely nodded at him and smiled kindly at his preaching.. aaaah!
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logansrun
I once heard a clip of Drew Carey going on about how Christmas had nothing to do with Jesus. Apparently it was a bit he did for the queen when he went to England. Good grief.
And, of course, it doesn't really have anything to do with Jesus Christ, let alone the historical Jesus. Bradley
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The way to get the jw's goat!
by gypsywildone inthe way to stick it to the borg is not self defeating behaviors.
it's not smoking a cigarette, & saying "nah,nah,nah look at me".
it is not putting yourself at risk in risky sexual acting out.
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logansrun
Personally, I would recommend most all the things mentioned in the original post -- except I don't see any reason to do those things "to get the JWs goat" as you call it. Do those things because it is rational and most likely will lead to a happier existence for yourself, not because of some sort of revenge. Strive for sucess for it's own sake, not out of some "need" to "get back" at the JWs.
Bradley
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31
Is There Anything To Admire Jehovah's Witnesses For...... In Reality?
by minimus inyou hear of people saying, "i admire jws for their zeal".
i wonder whether the witnesses' zeal is all that admirable.
al-qaida's got a lot of zeal too......
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logansrun
The thing that I find interesting about this thread -- and others like it, there are many of them -- is the extrapolation of one's subjective experience to the level of objective fact. Think about how this thread is titled: not, "Is there anything YOU admire about JW's..." but "Is there anything to admire...in reality?" The latter acts as if there is some sort of objective standard of admiration by which we can measure things. Too bad this does not exist!
The reality is that admiration is a totally subjective emotion and what I find admirable another person might find abhorrant. By all means say what you don't like, but do realize that that is pure opinion. Don't inflate it beyond that.
Another thing that I find a little frustrating is the totalistic attitude the majority of ex-JWs take about their former religionists (and, of course, the JW's are guilty of this themselves...in spades!). Phrases like "The JWs don't display love" are logically problematic. All JWs? All the time? And, what do you mean by "displaying love"? What kind of love? Some people consider spanking their children "tough love" and others call it "abuse." Which is right? Does anyone display "real love"? And, considering we have no way of getting into other humans heads how do you know that someone is or is not displaying "love"? Again, more confusion.
God damn Aristotileanism!
Bradley
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31
A "first-timers" ponderings...
by upside/down ini accidentally posted this improplerly so i'll try again.... i'm a "first-timer"- so please be gentle ( or at least use lube).
can we try and look at the bible's message without any preconcieved notions that we've been fed?
read it as if we've been lost on a desert island our whole life- what would we come away with?
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logansrun
Didn't he preach to the common people without the need for "middle management" interpreters to re-explain what he was saying?
Considering we have absolutely no record of anything written by Jesus -- or even if he knew how to write -- we have no way of knowing what Jesus said/thought/did except through the "middle managers" of the Gospels (both the four "biggies" and the numerous others). Considering the Gospels contain contradictions and factual errors -- written as they were decades after the fact, and with different agendas in mind -- I would say it is well nigh impossible to uncover what the historical Jesus actually said/thought/did. Oh well.
Bradley
PS...a reason Jesus might not have actually written anything down (if he could indeed write) is that he thought the Jewish Apocalypse and coming of the New Davidic Kingdom was imminant. If the world ain't gunna be around for long, why write anything down? Reminds me of a small Christian cult in Brooklyn I was once part of...
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Depressed and about to lose it
by AloneinOh inonce i left i became about as "worldly" as a person could get.
world that once i left i went totally out of control.
when i left, .
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logansrun
Well, after 20 years out of the JWs I'm glad you've started to use your noodle. Continue!
B.
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22
Not in the truth, but haunted by it...
by confuzzed ini am having trouble dealing with this little voice in the back of my head telling me that if i don't go back to meetings i won't go to the new system and everything i am doing is wrong blah blah blah.
although i have agreed to a study i believe it is more to shut up this little voice rather than because i want to be a witness again.
but if i don't go back i have to deal with this horrible feeling all the time.
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logansrun
There's a lot of information out there and I would highly suggest looking into what is said about Jehovah's Witnesses, "cults", the Bible (from a skeptical perspective) and social psychology (to deal with that "little voice").
Remember something very important, though -- feelings are not facts.
B.
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What have you done to counteract the 'cult of Jehovah's witnesses?'
by AK - Jeff ini know that many here would place jehovah's witnesses on a list of 'cults'.
personally i don't think they meet all the standard definition - but would class them as an 'authoritarian sectarian movement'.
at any rate, most of us would not want our neighbors to get caught up in the mind-twisting that we endured and from which we finally removed ourselves.. that said - have any engaged in successfull enterprises to counter the movement?
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logansrun
A few thoughts:
There are many "threats to my neighbors" out there, such as the JWs, Mormons, Moonies, Master Card and the Republican Party. Am I going to make an effort to "protect" them from all these threats and go totally batty in the process? (The answer is no.)
Witnesses in the US experience very little growth, and what growth they do have generally comes from within the organization (children getting baptised) in foreign language circles (introducion Hermanos Ruben Gonzolez) and among total screwballs who need a paddycack religion to change their diapers and remind them not to touch the stove. Most of my neighbors are normal people who have dogs, go to the Lutheren Church on Sundays and watch a little porn when no one's looking. I think they're safe.
Bradley