Donkey reminds me of Kenpodragon. They not only write the same, they even express some of the same beliefs. Curious.
Gary1914
JoinedPosts by Gary1914
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189
Donkey's never-ending atheism thread
by donkey inwih the permission of simon, i would like to start a thread to act as a collection of thought, quotes and miscellany on atheism and agnosticism.
there are so many other threads on this subject but no one place which one can go to on here.
i have much to share - enjoy and contribute with me please.give me the storm and stress of thought and action rather than the dead calm of ignorance and faith.
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112
Thinking about Bill Bowen...
by Pathofthorns ini was looking over the thread... "should i support bill bowen?".
i realize i am one of the few people that gave bill somewhat of a difficult time pretty much from the beginning when it was not "fashionable" to do so.
it was never my hope to see the man reduced to what he has, but rather to gain a better understanding of the issues involved, the intents and goals of silentlambs and to see reasonableness govern everyone's actions in the whole affair.. imo, i don't think there is any other single person in the last while that has done so much to help address the issue of child abuse among jw's while at the same time exposing them for what they really are.
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Gary1914
Island Woman,
I just returned home from work and tonight is my meeting night. Here is the book where the information is contained.
Organized for Kingdom Preaching and Disciple Making published in 1973. It was referred to as the OR book. It was written by Ray Franz as an elder/publisher guidebook in handling or organizing matters in the congregation.
Perhaps someone can help me out and scan the few pages on how children are required to confront the ones they accuse. Thanks.
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Thinking about Bill Bowen...
by Pathofthorns ini was looking over the thread... "should i support bill bowen?".
i realize i am one of the few people that gave bill somewhat of a difficult time pretty much from the beginning when it was not "fashionable" to do so.
it was never my hope to see the man reduced to what he has, but rather to gain a better understanding of the issues involved, the intents and goals of silentlambs and to see reasonableness govern everyone's actions in the whole affair.. imo, i don't think there is any other single person in the last while that has done so much to help address the issue of child abuse among jw's while at the same time exposing them for what they really are.
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Gary1914
One of the reasons I said goodbye to the WTS was seeing time and again how slanderous people got so much support from persons who blindly felt they could do no wrong. In these threads I see the same thing. The slanderer is Bill, plain and simple. I personally don't think he ought to get away with it, though some of you do seem to think he should
I think you need to go and lie down. Obviously, this whole matter is making you delusional. No one, at any time, on any of these many threads you have been involved in, has said that Bill could do no wrong. NO ONE! In fact it has been quite the opposite. No one is following Bill blindly. We all see his faults and his shortcomings. All we are saying is that we see them, we recognize them and although we are saddened by them, we prefer not to throw the baby out with the bath water. It's has gone beyond something that he should or should not get away with. What if anything has he gained? Nothing if I were asked. He has lost a lot of credibility and support, but that does not seem to be enough for you. You are after blood. You will not be satisfied until he is crawling, whimpering along the ground begging your forgiveness. Not one of us is without sin. Not you or me or Mr. Franz. We are all imperfect and we all do things we wish we had not done. If anything, it's almost as if you are worshiping Ray Franz. I am sure he is a nice man, but for goodness sakes get a grip. (This too is not an insult)
So just keep on shouting out your defenses of the fabulous Mr. Franz. After a while it becomes as the old adage says "The more he proclaimed his innocence the quicker we counted the knives."
By the way, what do you think ought to happen to Bill?
Edited by - Gary1914 on 21 November 2002 16:53:38
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Thinking about Bill Bowen...
by Pathofthorns ini was looking over the thread... "should i support bill bowen?".
i realize i am one of the few people that gave bill somewhat of a difficult time pretty much from the beginning when it was not "fashionable" to do so.
it was never my hope to see the man reduced to what he has, but rather to gain a better understanding of the issues involved, the intents and goals of silentlambs and to see reasonableness govern everyone's actions in the whole affair.. imo, i don't think there is any other single person in the last while that has done so much to help address the issue of child abuse among jw's while at the same time exposing them for what they really are.
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Gary1914
Really, fj, my feelings are not hurt so easily. Also, that last quote is not mine, but thanks anyway. The first three are mine and they were not meant to be insults, just observations.
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112
Thinking about Bill Bowen...
by Pathofthorns ini was looking over the thread... "should i support bill bowen?".
i realize i am one of the few people that gave bill somewhat of a difficult time pretty much from the beginning when it was not "fashionable" to do so.
it was never my hope to see the man reduced to what he has, but rather to gain a better understanding of the issues involved, the intents and goals of silentlambs and to see reasonableness govern everyone's actions in the whole affair.. imo, i don't think there is any other single person in the last while that has done so much to help address the issue of child abuse among jw's while at the same time exposing them for what they really are.
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Gary1914
Island Woman, it's a pleasure to meet you. I may indeed have the wrong page. I was reading it last night and I remember the wording. I am at work now but as soon as I get home tonight I will refer you to the correct page number.
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112
Thinking about Bill Bowen...
by Pathofthorns ini was looking over the thread... "should i support bill bowen?".
i realize i am one of the few people that gave bill somewhat of a difficult time pretty much from the beginning when it was not "fashionable" to do so.
it was never my hope to see the man reduced to what he has, but rather to gain a better understanding of the issues involved, the intents and goals of silentlambs and to see reasonableness govern everyone's actions in the whole affair.. imo, i don't think there is any other single person in the last while that has done so much to help address the issue of child abuse among jw's while at the same time exposing them for what they really are.
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Gary1914
You really ought to see a doctor
I understand completely fj. When you have no viable answer it's always the cowards way to hurl insults. Actually it would have been wiser and you would appear less the fool if you had just ignored me.
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Should I continue to support Bill Bowen?
by Gamaliel into whom it may concern, .
i have contributed financially to the cause of silentlambs.org and have, to a smaller extent, even promoted the website.
it is difficult enough to fathom the depth of hurt heaped on humankind, but impossible for me to understand how such suffering can be compounded with injustice, as i read experiences on silentlambs.org.
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Gary1914
Gamaliel, it is obvious that you have many ideas and plans for the betterment of Silentlambs. Have you spoken to Bill about these plans or are you just sharing your insight with this forum?
By the way, do you realize that in all your posts, even those that pretend to be conciliatory toward Bill, you couch insults and inuendos toward Bill in your speech?
Edited by - Gary1914 on 21 November 2002 14:36:7
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Thinking about Bill Bowen...
by Pathofthorns ini was looking over the thread... "should i support bill bowen?".
i realize i am one of the few people that gave bill somewhat of a difficult time pretty much from the beginning when it was not "fashionable" to do so.
it was never my hope to see the man reduced to what he has, but rather to gain a better understanding of the issues involved, the intents and goals of silentlambs and to see reasonableness govern everyone's actions in the whole affair.. imo, i don't think there is any other single person in the last while that has done so much to help address the issue of child abuse among jw's while at the same time exposing them for what they really are.
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Gary1914
Thank you Waiting and you're welcome.
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112
Thinking about Bill Bowen...
by Pathofthorns ini was looking over the thread... "should i support bill bowen?".
i realize i am one of the few people that gave bill somewhat of a difficult time pretty much from the beginning when it was not "fashionable" to do so.
it was never my hope to see the man reduced to what he has, but rather to gain a better understanding of the issues involved, the intents and goals of silentlambs and to see reasonableness govern everyone's actions in the whole affair.. imo, i don't think there is any other single person in the last while that has done so much to help address the issue of child abuse among jw's while at the same time exposing them for what they really are.
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Gary1914
bitterness that just oozes out of your every sentence
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That's rich. The venom does not ooze when you speak negatively about Bill Bowen, it just oozes when I speak negatively about Ray Franz? It is no wonder than you become lost in words so easily.
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112
Thinking about Bill Bowen...
by Pathofthorns ini was looking over the thread... "should i support bill bowen?".
i realize i am one of the few people that gave bill somewhat of a difficult time pretty much from the beginning when it was not "fashionable" to do so.
it was never my hope to see the man reduced to what he has, but rather to gain a better understanding of the issues involved, the intents and goals of silentlambs and to see reasonableness govern everyone's actions in the whole affair.. imo, i don't think there is any other single person in the last while that has done so much to help address the issue of child abuse among jw's while at the same time exposing them for what they really are.
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Gary1914
Excuse me for not introducing myself properly. I have been lurking here for a while and I have finally had all I can stand and I must respond.
fj, you mentioned on this thread or another one (I can't remember which) that the reputations of Jim, Carl and others had been diminished because of the "antics" of Bill Bowen. I would like to address that. For me, their reputations were diminished because they came on to this forum waving their Bibles, quoting scriptures, shoving their credentials in our faces all in the name of trashing Bill Bowen. They came one at a time proclaiming their christianity, not to bring about an end to this matter as one would have thought, but to throw more fuel on it. After they left, suddenly you appeared. You have been frothing at the mouth ever since you've been here, jumping into every thread and on every person who dares says something positive about Bill Bowen. Disgusting.
Bill said that Ray Franz supports the two witness rule. Well, lo and behold, he does support the two witness rule. However, we are not to blame him for that. As he says it's Paul's fault and even Jesus' fault. Ray Franz wrote the chapter and when he wrote it he made no concessions for any specific offense. He did not say that this does not apply in the case of children or does not apply in the case of wife beating. The rule was left to stand on its on and so was applied that way. It is only now that he says that it was not meant to apply in all cases.
For those who cannot believe that Ray Franz never heard of child molestation while on the governing body, just for the record, on page 73 in the organization book, it says that a child, a minor, is required to face those he accuses. I wonder what a child could possibly be accusing an adult of? Would the adult have hit him, or would the adult have stolen his toys? I wonder.
I heard that you were down on your luck. Are Ray, Jim and Carl paying you to take up their cause? If so, I think you have more than earned your money.
fj, I think we all know your agenda now. Bill is scum and Ray Franz is a wonderful man. You can go sit back down now