Posts by hannes

170

Proof of Noah's Flood - Presently watching a Documentary about Europe & the Ice Age

by *lost* in

first time i ever heard anyone say there was 'proof' of noah's flood.. very interesting,.

showed a trawler, where the team dredges regularly in the north sea - for animal bones, massive land animal bones, mammoths.. he said, originally, the bones were sent for analysis, and the dr stated, they were proof of noah's flood.. the north sea area was a land mass of dry grazing lands.

and it was very similar to africa.. many bones were found in london, of lions, hippos, etc ... when they were digging out the underground.. .

hannes

A date near 2370 B.C. is historically impossible and not even supported by the probably older textual sources.

170

Proof of Noah's Flood - Presently watching a Documentary about Europe & the Ice Age

by *lost* in

first time i ever heard anyone say there was 'proof' of noah's flood.. very interesting,.

showed a trawler, where the team dredges regularly in the north sea - for animal bones, massive land animal bones, mammoths.. he said, originally, the bones were sent for analysis, and the dr stated, they were proof of noah's flood.. the north sea area was a land mass of dry grazing lands.

and it was very similar to africa.. many bones were found in london, of lions, hippos, etc ... when they were digging out the underground.. .

hannes

If there was no flood and there were no God to help, we would probably die, whether we believed in a flood or not. And if there was a flood, it still does not make a difference for us, because - as it is written - there will be no more flood like that one again. And this we may know, by our trust in the scriptures that say so or just by the likelier ones of available scientific evidences.

170

Proof of Noah's Flood - Presently watching a Documentary about Europe & the Ice Age

by *lost* in

first time i ever heard anyone say there was 'proof' of noah's flood.. very interesting,.

showed a trawler, where the team dredges regularly in the north sea - for animal bones, massive land animal bones, mammoths.. he said, originally, the bones were sent for analysis, and the dr stated, they were proof of noah's flood.. the north sea area was a land mass of dry grazing lands.

and it was very similar to africa.. many bones were found in london, of lions, hippos, etc ... when they were digging out the underground.. .

hannes

Whether there has been a flood or not. None of us was there when it happened or not.

If it happened, we may have comfort that all other thingswould come to pass as well. And even more miraculous things than getting a number of families or couples of marsupialians to some distant part of the earth.

The land Nod in which Kain reportedly had gone, was eretz nod, the same word eretz that means earth as well as land in Hebrew. We do not know: was it the whole inhabited land that was meant to be drowned in that flood or the entire earth. We do not even know, whether Moses knew it. He only edited these earlier documents. (His name does not even appear there once.)

What we read is this: If it was as reported, the whole geography and atmosphere must have been very different than it is today. If there is a river (Tigris, Euphrates) or even a land (Cush, Ashur) of the same name today as before, this does not mean much. There is a York and a Orleans and Vienna in the new world, which formerly was and still is in England, in France, in Austria. The New was added just because the old was still there. (Just for Vienna IL it would have been too ridiculous to call it the new one, since nobody knew it anyway).

36

Why does an Omni... God need Jesus and the 144,000 co-rulers?

by jwfacts in

at the thread about jaracz steve2 made the following interesting comment.

by now, ted should be finding his heavenly posting a routinized bore: 4 years and still counting.

he will have chaffed at the notion that all decisions are made by jehovah god who consults no one and who brooks no questioning or independent thinking.

hannes

It would be the same one people of outstanding honest and great individuals who truly made their way and - knowingly or not because there is no partiality with God - ended up being like the best of the prophets, the truest of the apostles, the kindest of men and women, maybe unseen, few of them like a Moses or a Daniel or a Paul. And they should be like the Son of Man will be, with humankind, friends as priests should be and as the Christ was (the human, not the religious one) and kings not for themselves, for all others so they would become like he is.

(as reference e.g. Letter to the disciples in Rome, ch. 8. Revelation ch. 22)

36

Why does an Omni... God need Jesus and the 144,000 co-rulers?

by jwfacts in

at the thread about jaracz steve2 made the following interesting comment.

by now, ted should be finding his heavenly posting a routinized bore: 4 years and still counting.

he will have chaffed at the notion that all decisions are made by jehovah god who consults no one and who brooks no questioning or independent thinking.

hannes

In this point the jw doctrine really is mistaken.

He h e a r e d 'Israel, 12 times 12000 out of these tribes'.

When it came to s e e i n g , though, what did he see?

'A crowd of people no human could count, out of e v e r y tribe and people and nation and language.'

There were no two classes of disciples meant in all this.

170

Proof of Noah's Flood - Presently watching a Documentary about Europe & the Ice Age

by *lost* in

first time i ever heard anyone say there was 'proof' of noah's flood.. very interesting,.

showed a trawler, where the team dredges regularly in the north sea - for animal bones, massive land animal bones, mammoths.. he said, originally, the bones were sent for analysis, and the dr stated, they were proof of noah's flood.. the north sea area was a land mass of dry grazing lands.

and it was very similar to africa.. many bones were found in london, of lions, hippos, etc ... when they were digging out the underground.. .

hannes

What definitely would speak against such a flood from an ethical point of view is the notion of a final individual judgement that goes with it against scriptural hints that point in a different direction: God making everything new and bringing back into life all that has gone lost.

Judgement in its true sense is a bringing to right and repaying for loss, a healing i.e. a making whole and sound again and a revealing of each one's truth.

170

Proof of Noah's Flood - Presently watching a Documentary about Europe & the Ice Age

by *lost* in

first time i ever heard anyone say there was 'proof' of noah's flood.. very interesting,.

showed a trawler, where the team dredges regularly in the north sea - for animal bones, massive land animal bones, mammoths.. he said, originally, the bones were sent for analysis, and the dr stated, they were proof of noah's flood.. the north sea area was a land mass of dry grazing lands.

and it was very similar to africa.. many bones were found in london, of lions, hippos, etc ... when they were digging out the underground.. .

hannes

@ brother of the hawk

What I find fascinating about the languages is the observation of the grammar ever getting less elaborated, making speech a little clumsier and less to the point in the nuances and losing some of the beauty of the original brevity (due to the former grammatical density).

Another interesting thing is the differences of the languages a n d their similarities and parallels, the drifts in the semantics from one to another.

@cofty

You are right. Excuse me. My English is weak. I meant the reporting and handing down of scientific findings. Science tradition or the reception of scientific concepts in the public intellectual debate is what I wanted to refer to.

170

Proof of Noah's Flood - Presently watching a Documentary about Europe & the Ice Age

by *lost* in

first time i ever heard anyone say there was 'proof' of noah's flood.. very interesting,.

showed a trawler, where the team dredges regularly in the north sea - for animal bones, massive land animal bones, mammoths.. he said, originally, the bones were sent for analysis, and the dr stated, they were proof of noah's flood.. the north sea area was a land mass of dry grazing lands.

and it was very similar to africa.. many bones were found in london, of lions, hippos, etc ... when they were digging out the underground.. .

hannes

Hi Phizzy,

the Mayan Calendar says, if I remember correctly, 8th of August 3114 B.C. to be first day after flood. Old Greek (Septuagint), Jos. Flavius (he quotes other historians regarding the existence of some flood in the past), Samaritan Pentateuch come up with similar calculations, less exact though. Fond of Mayan tradition? No. I find a lot of it grotesque, to say the least. I don't even know any tradition that is (entirely or very) trustworthy. The same with scientific tradition. Tradition starts with the first report. Truth, however, I trust is and can be found. By everyone, everwhere, always. That is to me the beauty of life and living. We humans, even the fellow animals and the plants, bacteria and mushrooms find truth. We all just name it differently.

170

Proof of Noah's Flood - Presently watching a Documentary about Europe & the Ice Age

by *lost* in

first time i ever heard anyone say there was 'proof' of noah's flood.. very interesting,.

showed a trawler, where the team dredges regularly in the north sea - for animal bones, massive land animal bones, mammoths.. he said, originally, the bones were sent for analysis, and the dr stated, they were proof of noah's flood.. the north sea area was a land mass of dry grazing lands.

and it was very similar to africa.. many bones were found in london, of lions, hippos, etc ... when they were digging out the underground.. .

hannes

(Even a lot of this vague information I just wrote, I only know from hearsay and not from personal experience. Do I (e.g. in this context) believe in God? Who is God so that I could believe in him? If God is what anyone else knows, I couldn't say. If God is all I know, it can hardly be God, due to the little I know. Do I trust Christ to be God's son? Which Christ? The Catholic, Islamic, Adventist, Evangelical (which?), Jehovah's Witnesses' Christ? Truth, I trust it exists, is the greatest. No one of us has it. But it must be there. We gain pieces, we fight, we grow, we fall. What will remain in the end?)

170

Proof of Noah's Flood - Presently watching a Documentary about Europe & the Ice Age

by *lost* in

first time i ever heard anyone say there was 'proof' of noah's flood.. very interesting,.

showed a trawler, where the team dredges regularly in the north sea - for animal bones, massive land animal bones, mammoths.. he said, originally, the bones were sent for analysis, and the dr stated, they were proof of noah's flood.. the north sea area was a land mass of dry grazing lands.

and it was very similar to africa.. many bones were found in london, of lions, hippos, etc ... when they were digging out the underground.. .

hannes

A couple of years ago, it was common (scientific) sense that parental lifestyle would (apart from actual damage by chemicals or radiation or mutation of unknown origin) not have an effect on the makeup of the genome (and therefore on the phenotype, the 'appearance') of the future child. (It would have been ridiculed as "Lamarckism".)

More recent findings in epigenetics suggest otherwise.

I personally would not advise to be too confident in any such difficult scientific matters.

Even decades after Wegener had proposed the concept of continental drift, he was ridiculed for this whole idea, in part because of a mistake he had made regarding the actual movement of Iceland. Due to wrong data he had made a huge mistake there.

Finding faults may help to improve or discard a theory.

Without immense tectonic occurrences (as in catastrophic events) a lot of things are virtually unexplainable. Gradual sinking of temperature to the point of an ice age as well as a break through of the Mediterranean Sea into the Black Sea basin can account for a number of facts. For many observations the evidence is very difficult to explain, especially when it comes to developing a complete theory of geological as well as biological science.

We may know a lot, but compared to what we know not, this lot comes next to little.