Posts by Abaddon

450

Isn't God Awesome?

by Perry in

http://wonderofitall.com/

Abaddon

Of course, this is the point Vinny gets too 'busy' and runs away...

I've come to like the idea that 'god' is best defined as evolution becoming conscious of itself. Man made god in his own image; the petty, violent gods of the bronze age fitted the times perfectly, the rise of more enlightened philosophies still built upon former belief structures as soceity advanced, and then those same basic moral structures being seen as independent of the former belief structure and secularised leading to modern humanistic thought of today, again reflecting the leading edge of cultural development.

Of course, patterns of belief change with glacial slowness; as they are based upon nothing its hard for them to be displaced by something, as the something is hard put to prove the existence of nothing. Thus we still have bronze-age goat herder beliefs side by side with secular humanism.

What this thread displays well is the hopeless spite of literalistic traditionalists as they try to defend their beliefs using previously refuted hacknyied arguments thy regard as fresh and innovative, and most laughably of all, accurate.

147

Atheists, Why the Anger?

by XJW4EVR in

ok, so you deny the existence of a god, or you lack belief in a god.

my question why do you get so angry over a mythical being?

no one gets as upset over the tooth fairy, santa claus or the easter bunny, as i have seen some of the atheists on this board get over the slightest mention of god.

Abaddon

Top Hat

Oh, I'm not letting you be happy (on the basis of your belief structure based upon a logical fallacy). I am just happy to let you get on with your life provided you do no harm to others. You are the one letting themselves be happy with an illogical and unsupportable belief structure; thems YOUR standards, not mine.

Now, you could actually be honest, and admit you have a belief structure based upon a logical fallacy, but that that doesn't matter to you as you have faith.

Or you can prove that your belief structure is not based upon a logical fallacy.

Or you can carry on as you are, obviously evading a lethal flaw in your argument.

It's up to you what you do.

Vinny

Please keep up your petulant, vain and wholly laughable postings. As an ex-cultist, one of my chief concerns is that those who are just exiting a cult might be taken advantage of by other religionists who are also involved with high-control or otherwise toxic belief structures.

Having someone as transcendent in their ignorance, as palpably evasive and dishonest in their replies, and as repugnantly offensive and vain in their attitudes as you really helps people fresh out of the frying pan realise what fire not to jump into.

You are so far removed from any concept of Christian behaviour as to make yourself a laughing stock for even claiming it.

But please, keep it up. Modern day Pharisees like you and Perry are just what those fresh out of a cult need to frighten them away from religion for good.

Of course, I might have you and Perry all wrong... in which case you'll be able to succinctly and courteously inform me why your insistence that god doesn't have a begining is not a logical fallacy.

If you don't understand what a logical fallacy is, I'll help out. Maybe you are just misguided and ill-informed as distinct from malign and stupid.

147

Atheists, Why the Anger?

by XJW4EVR in

ok, so you deny the existence of a god, or you lack belief in a god.

my question why do you get so angry over a mythical being?

no one gets as upset over the tooth fairy, santa claus or the easter bunny, as i have seen some of the atheists on this board get over the slightest mention of god.

Abaddon

Top Hat

That is called special pleading. You say god needs no creator as he was always there. And your proof of this is? All you are doing is excusing god from the necessity of a creator, which you then insist everything else needed, by saying he doesn't need one for reason 'x'.

It is not a logically sound argument, and I didn't make the rules of argument up.

Now, please, by all means, if this excuse meet your standards of belief, and this makes you happy and enables you to live a happy and fulfied life in peace with your fellow man, go for it.

But don't be surprised if others think your argument is nonsensical and invalid.

147

Atheists, Why the Anger?

by XJW4EVR in

ok, so you deny the existence of a god, or you lack belief in a god.

my question why do you get so angry over a mythical being?

no one gets as upset over the tooth fairy, santa claus or the easter bunny, as i have seen some of the atheists on this board get over the slightest mention of god.

Abaddon

Perry

Why should I falsify something you have not proved?

I could equally quote some 'holy' scripture from the Hindu, Judaic, Islamic, Sikh or other religious tradition, say, there you go, prove Brahma/Adonai/Allah etc. doesn't exist

I proved (unchallenged I might add) that it is impossible to prove that God doesn't exist.

You didn't prove a thing, you just copied a very old and hackneyed, extremely well known logical argument. One cannot prove the non-existence of something which you cannot prove the existence of. You may well impress yourself and your monkey with your opinion of your intelligence, but don't assume we have such low standards.

The scripture doesn't say that the doubter, or the one who is unsure is a fool.... only the one who claims definitively "there is no God".

But sweetums, it is equally true any one who claims definitively there is a god is a fool.

Vinny

...but what is NOT "fakeness" here, is the reality that you have an entire UNIVERSE, EARTH, and LIFE on that earth SITTING IN YOUR LAP. Now, HOW'D THEY GET THERE THEN? All from nothing buries atheists every time. Poor atheists have no way out of the mud with their beliefs.

Dear Christiotroll, the only thing that stops your theistic argument from suffering from exactly the same problem (something from nothing) is because you use the logical fallacy of special pleading to get round it. If this makes you happy and enables you to lead a happy and fulfilled life, good for you. Do not expect everyone else to have such low standards though.

Junction-Guy

Another thing I have noticed is that the Atheist XJW's are'nt nearly as friendly as the christian JW's, and they seem to lash out more at everyone, no matter what the subject involves, be it politics or religion. Atheists hate Bush, they hate the Bible, they hate traditional american life, they hate just about everything except other atheists.

Well, maybe your opinion is a wee bit slanted by your beliefs regarding god and politics, and your inability to even attempt forming an objective viewpoint. If you were a left-wing atheist, you'd think theists weren't nearly as friendly as atheists.

greendawn

Please, try to restrict yourself to factual argumentation in supporting your beliefs. Please provide support for your claim that atheists who know anything about linguistics say "... languages get ever more complicated (gramatically) as we go back in time... because they are simpler and easier to learn"

http://www.ancientscripts.com/hl_why.html

~

And may I remind most of the theists on the board that they are atheists too? Theists are atheistic regarding all but one god, for exactly the same reasons atheists are atheistic towards all gods. It's just theists are inconsistent and incapable of substantively differentiating the gods they disbelieve in from the god they do believe in as regards proof.

147

Atheists, Why the Anger?

by XJW4EVR in

ok, so you deny the existence of a god, or you lack belief in a god.

my question why do you get so angry over a mythical being?

no one gets as upset over the tooth fairy, santa claus or the easter bunny, as i have seen some of the atheists on this board get over the slightest mention of god.

Abaddon

My question why do you get so angry over a mythical being? No one gets as upset over the Tooth Fairy, Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny, as I have seen some of the atheists on this board get over the slightest mention of God.

Your answer is in your question if you think about it.

Please list the wars, tortures, injustices and inhumanities meeted out in the name of the Tooth Fairy, Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny.

Then list the wars, tortures, injustices and inhumanities meeted out in the name of various gods.

See the light yet?

Of course such actions on the part of believers may not have anything to do with god; but that's not the point. The idea of god has been responsible for a hell of a load of suffering. And yes, it has also done some good things too... but then people are quite cabale of doing good things without there being some reward/punishment system after one dies.

If a person chooses to believe in God isn't hat his/her own choice?

Yes

Why they anger, almost to the point irrationality?

Yes, wll, your definition of irrationaility (as a theist, this is nothing personal) might be at odds to many atheists definitons. Speaking personally I get frustrated that people have such brutish ignorent ideas about what might be, and accept degradations to their quality and freedom of life and take attitudes about perfectly decent people on account of belief.

ANd obviously, as pointed out already, atheists are like ice crystals.

450

Isn't God Awesome?

by Perry in

http://wonderofitall.com/

Abaddon

Sirona, I totally agree.

Vinny clearly shows him/her self to be vain, arrogant, ignorant, and far removed from any standard of Christian behaviour.

I find it very encouraging that so-called-Christians, like Perry and Vinny, by their disgusting attitude towards their fellow man, act as a signal example of what to avoid.

They come here on some ego-boosting ministry, yet by their behaviour actually put people off their faithless, empty, unsupportable belief structures.

Vinny, Perry, your philosophy tastes of ashes, you are Pharasees, but do keep posting; you serve as a signal example of what to avoid to those who have recently left high-control groups.

450

Isn't God Awesome?

by Perry in

http://wonderofitall.com/

Abaddon

Vinny

What BURIES ATHEISTS is that you say all things just happened ... By series of random chances...

And by your answers you show you understand nothing of the theory of evolution. You saying evolutionists believe this is like me saying that you believe god is made of cheese; it's a straw man.

As always, I find the attitude taken by hard-core literalistic fundamentalists best described by the phrase "Omne ignotum pro magnifico est".

(What people are ignorent seems magnificent/We have great notions of everything unknown/All things unknown seem grand )

By their arguments they show themselves ignorent of the science they dismiss as wrong.

By their attitudes they show themselves guilty of the conceit that they are somehow possessing a special knowledge of god.

Yet they have nothing to prove this except their own words, or as often is the case, someone else's words they copy and paste.

They are more concerned with other people accepting their version of god than they are about any genuine exploration of the divine.

They actually blaspheme against the idea of god they hold by insisting it made the world the same way a bronze age goatherd described, rather than as the ample evidence around us demonstrates, as if god could not do it any way it wished.

They have a formulaic faith that ultimately only seeks to sanctify themselves.

Sad really...

48

Curious about what ExJW's Preach and Teach

by BEROEAN in

i've noticed many of you that have your own ministry.

i'm curious as to what doctrines you teach.

is it "jesus is love.

Abaddon

1. What happens to a person when they die?

As far as we know, the person ceases to exist. The body is disposed of in a variety of ways.

2. Who is God and what is his name?

Is there a god and what is god seem to be two questions arising prior to debate about personality or name.

3. Why is there suffering in the world?

Because organisms experience various degrees of discomfort if the conditions in which they exist are not optimal. This discomfort can be termed 'suffering'. Mostly organisms will take action to stop being in discomfort, as discomfort warns of impending or potential injury or other harm. Thus discomfort, or suffering is an important survival adaptation that helps an organism stay healthy, thus being more liable to procreate, passing individual variation on at a higher rate than those organisms which are not so sensitive to such warnings. Eventually such a massively useful adaptation would be present in all (or as near as) organisms, as those organisms without it simply can't compete as well for finite resources.

4. How did we get here?

Cosmo genesis. Accretion. Fusion. Novae. Abiogenesis. Evolution.

5. According to the Bible, is it okay to participate in wars and politics?

By example, yes, although sometimes it says something different.

6. Is the Devil real? If so, where did he come from?

See 2.

7. According to your religion, is it okay to smoke marijuana?

According to me, yes. It is far less damaging than alcohol as regards behaviour of stoned individuals as opposed to drunk indivduals, and no more likely to cause social disfunction due to abuse. As such, it does not intrinsically harm others, and i a personal choice.

8. According to your religion, is it okay to have pre-marital sex?

According to me, yes. Responsible adults having pre-marital sex are no more likely to cause or suffer harm than individuals having marital sex. As such, it does not intrinsically harm others, and is a personal choice.

9. According to your religion, how do God feel about homosexuals?

See 2. I not know how do god feel.

Homosexuality is a natural part of the spectrum of normal sexual behaviour in our species (as with many others), and a homosexual is no more likely to cause or suffer harm than a heterosexual. As such, it does not intrinsically harm others, and is a personal choice, a biological inclination of varying degrees, or most likely a bit of both, mileage varying with the individuals.

It would seem therefore any god involved in our direct creation, thus having responsibility for this natural variation, would be an utter git if he minded.

10. Does God talk to you personally?

Unless it is by means of rainbows at appropriate moments, no.

And even if that IS some form of 'god', I think 'laughing at' is a better description than 'talk to'.

71

Bilderberg Group - Conspiracy theory or a scary reality? (NWO)

by zagor in

from time to time this new phenomenon hits the mainstream media, though usually it is below the radar and public scrutiny.

for those not familiar with it bilderberg is a group of most powerful and most influential leader who according to many conspiracy theorist rule the world and are according to them poised to introduce new world order whatever that means to them.

now i'm the first to dismiss these kinds of things, you know, usual freemasonry etc.

Abaddon

abbagail

You're a total hot-head, Abbadon.

Given what you believe in your beliefs about me are of amazingly little consequence.

You hate the idea there really is a big bad wolf that seeks world domination, obviously, so what do we have to say to each other?

I am sure you will repeat your unprovable fantasies again and again, as it serves to feed your need to feel important and special. I find you using a metaphor that invokes the imagery of fairy stories stunningly appropriate. I have already said what I have to say to you; seek medical help, and apologize for parroting Nazi propaganda.

Suit yourself. The daily evidence is all around us. Maybe because it's where you live you can't see the forest for the trees, I don't know. Over here it's No Big Secret, and anybody with half a brain, or who does not stick their head in the sandpit, can see the developments.

Please don't assume I am quite as jaw-droppingly ignorant as those who do believe this nonsense. Although 36% of Americans believe that the modern state of Israel is part of the fulfillment of Biblical prophecy relating to the second coming (Pew Institute), as 60% can't even find Israel on a world map (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12591413/) I don't find their opinions about such things particularly informed or reliable. I don't know whether you can find Israel on a map, but

And as usual, you are making a mountain out of a molehill. There was one quote from the Protocols, #15. Period. It's an astounding document, everyone should read it once in their life. You want to believe it's fake. Go ahead, suit yourself. I don't give a hoot what the "experts" say because the "experts" are the same ones working for the global elite, and they are great at suckering in hot-heads like you who want to live in a dream world.

LOL. Too damn complacent and smug you're not even going to LOOK at the evidence relating to them being fabricated?

I'm not the least bit interested in your opinions,

Or facts, or truth or honesty...

I love the way you swing into the equivalent of 'but I have black/gay friends' speech that comes out of the mouth of people who get called on displaying beliefs or attitudes that show their bigotry.

You want to make a big issue that I'm some type of anti-semite?

Now you're lying about me. I have said you use the same material to back your claims as anti-Semites. I know your ability to read and understand is low, but please try to avoid lying about what I say. Even you must realise Christians shouldn't lie.

It's such a lame game you guys play. You don't have a clue what you're talking about. You think by making a big flame with your graphic and make all sorts of loud bashing statements that you are going to what? What it is you want anyway?

To show you for what you are; a sad, vain, ill-informed person. I don't do the job that well, as you're not worth the time, but when you reply to me you show it very clearly to anyone who reads this, which is why I do it. The more I keep you talking the more absurd you appear, and yet, due to your vanity, you can't stop blowing your own trumpet of doom.

But do I like world-domination control freaks who at the very top top top of the heirarchy are either Jewish -- or SAY they are -- and who want to make me a serf in their ego-maniacal kingdom? NO THANKS! I don't care what "color" or "ethnicity" or "race" they are.

I notice you again display your bigoted paranoia. Please do check the meaning of the word bigot before claiming you are not one; "a person obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices".

Maybe then you'll wake up and smell the Jewish roses.

LOL; you trip yourself up, you really do. "I love Jews" to 'smell the Jewish roses" in a few paragraphs.

Keep it up abbagail, one vain religious freak like you puts more people off religion than a thousand atheists.

8

Interesting Critique of Naturalism

by Perry in

naturalism and ethics.

why is it that certain actions are morally right, others morally wrong, and some morally neutral?

where does the demand of normativity come from?

Abaddon

This is predictable trash from Perry; he recently had to tell god that god couldn't be part of Perry's religion as god didn't come up to Perry's standards...

If I thought there was the remotest chance there might be a rewarding discussion with him, I'd take the time to point out that the concept of human rights is an extremely good platform upon which to base ethics, in addition to listing the legion errors in the argument he has plagiarized without accreditation (http://apologetics.johndepoe.com/naturalism-ethics.html) It is a good thing Perry believes he is already saved, as that way he can be dishonest and still retain the self-righteousness so essential to his personality. It is also interesting he lacks the courage to do anything but this cut and paste heroics; I suppose despite appearances to the contrary he is at least smart enough to avoid debate with people he knows from experience will simply make him look stupid. But what do you expect from a parrot? It's quite impressive a parrot can manipulate a mouse and press CTRL C or CTRL V at the same time, but making sense as well ? The least his owner could do is scrape all the guano off the parrot's perch...