Posts by Odrade

48

ever feel violent rage toward BORG?

by Ravyn in

jw
friends

pork chop and in_between_days seem to think i am the only one on this board who is bitter and feels occasionally violent toward the borg...what do you think?.

i have been called low life scum because i made a comment (after being provoked) about not caring if all jws died of antrax.

honestly, there are days i really feel that way.

Odrade

I have a great deal of rage at my parents. I'm beginning to realize at least some of it was misplaced because much of what I'm angry about is stuff they did, "just following orders," of WT. I think the rage is part of the reason I'm so headache prone. That feeling has to come out somewhere. Physical manifestation is the reverse side of strong emotional issues. I really wish I could move past the anger--maybe the headaches would stop, but I think one has to feel it all before they can get rid of it.

Repression of the rage can be even worse than what we feel right now.

68

Who's To Blame For The Child Abuse Problem?

by Englishman in

just trying to get my head around this one.

with the jailing last week of a london dub paedophile, i was wondering: .

is it the religion itself that gives these perverts the feeling that they are invincible and immune from punishment when they commit these acts?

Odrade

amac... thanks for the clarification. You're probably right, there isn't really anything more or less appealing about JW organization (to a newcomer) than any other group with lots of children. It would be the rare sociopath that would specifically target the witnesses for their secrecy.

something like this..."Hey where's Bob? Oh, he's in jail for being a child molester. WHAT?!?! etc etc"

and this makes more sense too. What really surprises me is that the congregation did not have a talk about "GOSSIP AND SLANDER." Your scenario is exactly what happened in my cong., and the brothers were hypervigilant to prevent gossip. Even though it was a matter of public record, we were counselled very strongly not to talk about it. No longer doubting you, just surprised, although I don't know why anything surprises me anymore.

Core... my own feeling is the only way to prevent abuse is from the child/parent end. Preventing the abuser in the first place would be nearly impossible, because the way the typical one operates is usually so subtle and sneaky at first... anyways, parents who ask questions and don't let their children go alone with brothers (or sisters) in the congregation, is probably the best defense. Of course this does nothing to protect the child whose own parent is the abuser...

Odrade

38

Grading of Disfellowshipping Offenses

by RAYZORBLADE in

jw
friends

just putting this out to you.. have you encountered, or noticed on occasion how what you were disfellowshipped for, also dictates who will associate with you, post-jw?

yes, i'm talking about those beloved ex-jws/df'd/da'd/apostates.. by that, i mean, if you were, let's say, disfellowshipped for scriptural/doctrinal issues, perhaps in the ex-jw world, you hold yourself or others of that ilk, in higher esteem?.

those that were disfellowshipped for smoking, heavy drinking or drug use, perhaps as previously not strong people.. those that were disfellowshipped for sexual misconduct: (file under: other) and similar to the above.. it's interesting.

Odrade

Okay, here's another side of that question: Do df'd people feel differently about themselves and the BORG, depending on why they were df'd? Here's what I mean:

If someone is df'd because they got in a bad situation and, lets say, slept with someone, you still hear them say 10 years later "Well, it was really my own fault I'm being shunned." If someone gets df'd because they DECIDE to take a stand against CHRONOLOGY, they will wave that like a banner and say "

In that respect, maybe df'ing reasons do get graded, but the only ones that should count are the grades we give ourselves. (Hmmm, kind of like new age schooling--HA!)

Odrade

68

Who's To Blame For The Child Abuse Problem?

by Englishman in

just trying to get my head around this one.

with the jailing last week of a london dub paedophile, i was wondering: .

is it the religion itself that gives these perverts the feeling that they are invincible and immune from punishment when they commit these acts?

Odrade

Guest, you ask:

How does one identify a pedophile? If you can't identify a pedophile, unless you have a known history case of such an individual, you can't.

This is very critical, and part of the issue at hand. Personally, I think the problem is so many people have this "dirty old man" idea of pedophiles. The reason the crime is so heinous is the perpetrators usually seem so trustworthy. When things start surfacing, the victim, who already is in critical need of help, is often not believed, because everyone "knows" the character of the accused. Not surprisingly, it's easy to sweep the crime under the rug because the victim requires great strength and courage to continue to stand up against the seemingly "moral" abuser.

My friend who spoke out to the authorities is uncommonly stubborn and brave, plus she had the added incentive of protecting her baby sister. AND, there were people who believed her. I think this example was the exception, rather than the rule since the offenses came to light so dramatically. If it had ended in committee and no one ever found out, that would be more common. If you cut the story off before the point where he is prosecuted by civil authorities, then it would be typical of pedophiles who operate within the org.

The sooner everyone stops stereotyping molesters and their protecters, the sooner they can be exposed. The best way to identify molesters will always be to watch the actions of the children. If you see an outgoing child suddenly become very withdrawn, it should be a red flag. Night terrors, inappropriate aggression, a child who sexually precocious, all are strong indicators something is wrong. To assume an adult is safe because you think you know him, and he is nice is misguided and potentially dangerous.

These are the best, most reliable ways to identify molesters.

68

Who's To Blame For The Child Abuse Problem?

by Englishman in

just trying to get my head around this one.

with the jailing last week of a london dub paedophile, i was wondering: .

is it the religion itself that gives these perverts the feeling that they are invincible and immune from punishment when they commit these acts?

Odrade

Wow, waiting, that's a pretty good estimation of how it happens, IMO. The mothers DO just need a little time for themselves. I've seen many times where the single mother with son has a nice servant brother approach and offer to take the boy in service. The mother ALWAYS says yes. Only one time did I ever hear one say no, and she was not a single mother--she has a good husband. The other mothers are an easy situation for a molester on his mark to take advantage of. It would only be seen as being kind.

AMAC, I don't believe the Org is any different in the opportunities it presents to a pedophile, either. Any church, club, school could be seen as easy prey. The difference is in how the offender is dealt with. Waiting's remark about not speaking of the abuse or offense to anyone EVER is also on the mark. I don't know where this "many people" were allowed to talk about an accused, but I can tell you, it's exceedingly rare. NO ONE is allowed to talk about what happens behind the closed doors of a judicial committee. It's official policy. Not the accused, not the accuser, not the Committee. If you break that rule and tell, you will be disciplined. As well, I have sat through the talks where counsel is strongly given about gossip and slander in the congregation. I've also sat through the stupid "forgiveness" talk when the offender is welcomed back with open arms after their stint in jail.

Personally, I don't care for BB's term "pedophile paradise" either, but for different reason. The fact that the term is in use indicates there is an ongoing serious problem with protecting the so-called "privacy" of the molester. In not allowing his beastly actions to come out, the pedophile is able to not only save face, but if a sociopathic offender, manipulate things so he can easily offend again. I belief that just as registered sex offenders must notify the neighbors in the area that he lives, convicted offenders in the congregation should be noted publicly, so children can be protected. This should happen in the case of judicial committee "conviction," and especially in criminal court convictions.

Only then do I see any hope of coming out from under that label. Even the Catholic Church has begun to withdraw the umbrella of financial support and ecclesiastical privilege from offenders in its ranks. Can JWs, who claim to be Jehovah's pure, clean Organization do any less? To make that claim, while harboring that filth in secret is revolting beyond words.

Odrade

82

What If Jehovah's Witnesses Are Right?

by shamus in

the "what if" thing comes to mind... no matter how much i strongly believe that they are not, what if armageddon happened tomorrow and they were correct?

would you have any sorrow for being wrong???.

i, personally would not.

Odrade

I don't know, I finally came to the conclusion that if this system was 6 weeks, 6 months or 60 years, I wanted to be happy. I wasn't happy there.

So if Armageddon comes, and I die, I'll be dead anyways and not know it. But I would have had a good life in the meantime.

68

Who's To Blame For The Child Abuse Problem?

by Englishman in

just trying to get my head around this one.

with the jailing last week of a london dub paedophile, i was wondering: .

is it the religion itself that gives these perverts the feeling that they are invincible and immune from punishment when they commit these acts?

Odrade

Rom 1:32 "Although these know full well the righteous decree of God, that those practicing such things are deserving of death, they not only keep on doing them but also consent with those practicing them."--NWT

There definitely is an element of "hushing up" crimes against children. The most probable and common reason being not to "bring reproach on Jehovah's name." The so-called integrity of the Organization and it's chosen position of God's instrument of dispensing spiritual food is sacrosant, above any personal consideration that may enter into dealing with the innocent victims. An attitude of "the needs of many outweigh the needs of the few," prevails.

Odrade

11

New Niece!!! Arrived on 8/2/03

by Xandria in

jw
friends

well folks, .

many of you know we have been anticpating the birth of my sister's child.

my sister t called and stated she went to the hospital on the 1st.

Odrade

Congratulations sis T!!

Happy birthday Cassidy Grace!

68

Who's To Blame For The Child Abuse Problem?

by Englishman in

just trying to get my head around this one.

with the jailing last week of a london dub paedophile, i was wondering: .

is it the religion itself that gives these perverts the feeling that they are invincible and immune from punishment when they commit these acts?

Odrade

Thanks Englishman, it was hard to write. Mostly because I'm really careful not to put any revealing details on here. But I couldn't keep quiet on this one. Pedophilia is so insidious because it is a crime of deception and betrayal. In order to operate, they HAVE to get people to trust them. They have to separate what they do from all other aspects of their life or there is an air of deceit about them that others will pick up on. This man was seemingly the most trustworthy person I knew, and others felt the same.

I don't think that JWs have any more or less problems with individual molesters. I do think that they could have more issues with reoccurences though. If the school janitor is a molester, some kid will tell, and it will make the front page of the paper. If a jw molests and a child tells, the whole thing is kept under wraps by ecclesiastical privelege, leaving the offender opportunity to offend repeatedly until someone breaks confidentiality, or defies the Elder Body and goes to the authorities. It's the same with many other closed society churches. I don't think pedophiles come into the organization with the express purpose of molesting, but in living their day to day lives, make choices that, while otherwise are normal ones, bring them into close contact with vulnerable children. It would be the same modus operandi in many settings. Schools, churches, sports organizations, clubs...

Just my $.02

Odrade

20

Last minute details for Apostafest

by Princess in

jw
friends

tomorrow is the big party.. the party is at 2pm, plan on staying as late as you want.that late.. i am going to make some signs to post along the route from the i-5 exit.

i'm not sure what they will say but i'm pretty sure there will be a scarlet a.be sure to look for them.

how do you turn off the red?.

Odrade

Wish we could have been there. Maybe next year...