Posts by sunny23

9

Meeting with friends Pastor

by sunny23 in

my close friend has stopped attending meetings about 2 yrs ago.

is df'd.

and attends memorial and a meeting here and there to appease his mother enough that she will still communicate with him.

I feel it will be hard to keep him on track and face my questions concerning morals and ethics of the OT rather than skirting the issues and putting emphasis on the NT. I feel though he will go one of these 3 routes to excuse acts in the OT:

1) cultural context

2) god works in mysterious ways

3) people of that time had to have those laws in place for the good of the whole and preserving His people

I feel ready to spare those points but I have never had In-Person religious debate before. Thinking things out and typing on a forum are much easier. Preaching work didnt count, not the same.

9

Meeting with friends Pastor

by sunny23 in

my close friend has stopped attending meetings about 2 yrs ago.

is df'd.

and attends memorial and a meeting here and there to appease his mother enough that she will still communicate with him.

sunny23

My close friend has stopped attending meetings about 2 yrs ago. Is DF'd. And attends memorial and a meeting here and there to appease his mother enough that she will still communicate with him. He has however this year realized that the WT is bunk and has no intention of putting all his chips into them.

Now he is trying to fill his spiritual void by going to a non-denominational church his boss introduced him to. From there he started meeting with his bosses father-in-law who was Catholic for many years and then a non catholic pastor, who is now a free-roaming agent of God so to speak that despises organized religion and aspires to enlighten people about the truth of the Bible. Apparently this man met up with my friends buddy who is still active JW who brought a Circuit Overseer with him. This pastor of my friend "tore the CO a new one" in some debate to which the CO retreated by saying he would come back with a researched response. In the car the CO told my friends buddy that they would never go back because that pastor just wanted to argue and didnt want to listen. So now my friend thinks this pastor is apostle Paul reincarnate.

My friend invited me to this church to "give it a try and at least let me know if I'm wasting my time." I agreed even though I had already informed him that I no longer held any supernatural beliefs to which he said, "well you at least still believe in the bible and that its true!?" I replied "no." Gave him a few brief reasons but he wasnt moved by them.

My goal here really is not to deconvert the pastor or my friend. Its to show my friend that he needs to question everything, be skeptical, think critically, and never agree to weak premises just because it sounds appealing. He seems thus far to be chewing up everything this man says as complete fact. I cant teach my friend to think for himself but I can maybe expose a few flaws in what he is learning enough to plant seeds and see where he takes them.

Our first meeting covered topics like OT vs NT God, accuracy of prophecy, the ability to actually "Know" you are saved by God, and i finished with asking how one could reconcile the non action of God in things like tsunamis to which he responded "it can't be reconciled, no one could...God works in mysterious ways." We moved way too fast and topics got switched so much that nothing was addressed adequetly. Im going to try and set a better pace this time and maybe bring a pad and paper to write and keep us on track and finish a topic before moving on.

To The Point:

The main theme of the meeting tonight is Why The God of the OT is Perfectly Loving, Kind, and The Same as the God of the NT. I will try and record it on my phone to post here. Any specific suggestions?

72

Coping With Atheism (Long-ish Post...sorry!)

by humblepotato in

jw
friends

long time lurker (2009-ish), first time poster.

first of all, i want to say thank you everyone who contributes to these boards and provokes stimulating conversations and thought processes.

all the opinions and different perspectives are very enlightening.

sunny23

Theres not enough Ego in the universe for both Brad Pitt and God. I believe Brad exists though.

12

Texan Billboard

by Pubsinger in

didn't the judge rule in the candace conte trial that wts did not have a responsibility to notify the congregation only to protect them?

i think this is hugely missing the point.

other churches and organisations have strict policies to protect members from sex offenders but they do not 'notify' in the sense that i think these people want.. so the wt response to that particular question will be 'no.

sunny23

Its hard to mandate that a sex offender be announced to a congregation during meeting obviously. However upon even one "witness" or victim of abuse (NOT 2), there should be a reporting to the police as well as informing ALL elders and MS in a private meeting that Brother Raper has been accused and should be treated as if he is dangerous around children with respect to assigning him in car groups. In fact making it a policy to only assign him to a car group with an elder or someone informed would be the best.

I agree cappytan that it is the moral obligation to forewarn any parents whos children might come in contact with Brother Raper in service. Actually informing all parents might be necessary to help lower risk of something happening at a get-together or at one of those "lets watch this new WT video just released at my house as a party" type scenario. Or those big camping trips some JW groups have. Theres simply too many scenarios where not informing parents could fall back on a failure of Elders moral obligation. Protecting young sheep should outweigh protecting the reputation of some sick f***. Perhaps give Brother Raper the ultimatum of 1) no attendance at any gatherings outside the Hall whatsoever and limited field service partners to elders only or 2) we announce you as an "accused" or "confirmed" sex offender to all parents we elders see fit in order to protect the cong to the best of our abilities .

Yea that sounds good, JWs love ultimatums anyway, should work fine.

72

Coping With Atheism (Long-ish Post...sorry!)

by humblepotato in

jw
friends

long time lurker (2009-ish), first time poster.

first of all, i want to say thank you everyone who contributes to these boards and provokes stimulating conversations and thought processes.

all the opinions and different perspectives are very enlightening.

sunny23

Welcome HumblePotatoe, I too am in a similar situation except I don't have a wife to worry about deconverting (at least not anymore anyway, long story.)

I was raised as a JW and started having doubts around age 20 when my critical thinking skills were being honed and never perused my doubts until age 24 (4yrs ago). Through my own research and largely to conversations on this forum I transitioned into deist, agnostic and finally atheist.

I have had much difficulty over the last year with reconciling with the concept of eternal unconsciousness upon death. It can give me strong anxiety if I think too hard on it, will keep me up at night worrying about the dread of an early fate brought on by any number of potential causes.

I have coped with it by a lot of the advice here, talking it out with people who have backgrounds closest to mine, and keeping busy with experiencing as many new things as possible and getting out of my comfort zones as much as possible with adventure, discovery, and learning that I otherwise would have put off for when I'm in paradise and have millions of years to do so.

Achieving things is now more imminent and focusing on doing things rather than the end of things is the most help. Force a smile even when you are down and it will give you some positivity and let that translate into helping others and making new friends. Good luck to you and I wish you the best.

70

Anti-JW billboard going up in Texas

by sunny23 in

the first ever billboard has been crowd funded on reddit and will be going up.

i'm curious to know if it will cause a spark in any jw's who already have questions or doubts and lead them to research into the child abuse cases and lead them to the thought that the wt and gb are not inspired or gods mouthpiece.

at the very least it will provide people a topic of conversation and questions to the jw's who knock on their door: "so whats this whole sex abuse in kingdom halls thing about i saw on the billboard down the road?

sunny23

Its being put up along a major road near a convention center during convention time of the year for the JWS there.

70

Anti-JW billboard going up in Texas

by sunny23 in

the first ever billboard has been crowd funded on reddit and will be going up.

i'm curious to know if it will cause a spark in any jw's who already have questions or doubts and lead them to research into the child abuse cases and lead them to the thought that the wt and gb are not inspired or gods mouthpiece.

at the very least it will provide people a topic of conversation and questions to the jw's who knock on their door: "so whats this whole sex abuse in kingdom halls thing about i saw on the billboard down the road?

sunny23

I know elders won't publicly inform a cong that a sex offender is in their midst or in the car groups with kids. However are JWS hiding sex offenders in entire comminities? Don't they now report them to police or no? I thought they became more apt to police reporting but still hid the dangers from the rest of the cong which is the exposure this bilboard lears towards. If this is true then communities would be informed by sex offender websites.

70

Anti-JW billboard going up in Texas

by sunny23 in

the first ever billboard has been crowd funded on reddit and will be going up.

i'm curious to know if it will cause a spark in any jw's who already have questions or doubts and lead them to research into the child abuse cases and lead them to the thought that the wt and gb are not inspired or gods mouthpiece.

at the very least it will provide people a topic of conversation and questions to the jw's who knock on their door: "so whats this whole sex abuse in kingdom halls thing about i saw on the billboard down the road?

sunny23

A billboard message needs to be clear and focused and it just seems to vague. It's trying to make a claim without really saying anything concrete - almost the definition of a smear campaign.

If you had to make a billboard what would yours say? Its hard to fit in the reasons why 1914 is absurd, or blood transfusions are anti-biblical. It needs to be short, big lettered, provocative and intriguing. This makes it difficult to be so concrete, hence the website link, which I agree should not have a hyphen and be more memorable.

70

Anti-JW billboard going up in Texas

by sunny23 in

the first ever billboard has been crowd funded on reddit and will be going up.

i'm curious to know if it will cause a spark in any jw's who already have questions or doubts and lead them to research into the child abuse cases and lead them to the thought that the wt and gb are not inspired or gods mouthpiece.

at the very least it will provide people a topic of conversation and questions to the jw's who knock on their door: "so whats this whole sex abuse in kingdom halls thing about i saw on the billboard down the road?

sunny23

do agree, theirs is directed more towards active JW's. I think it should look more like this so that non-jw's know who its addressed to and will be able to bring the topic up at the door when they come knocking:

Oh and here is the link to their final approved draft and fund page:

https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/ttatt-billboard-outside-belton-tx-jw-conventions

70

Anti-JW billboard going up in Texas

by sunny23 in

the first ever billboard has been crowd funded on reddit and will be going up.

i'm curious to know if it will cause a spark in any jw's who already have questions or doubts and lead them to research into the child abuse cases and lead them to the thought that the wt and gb are not inspired or gods mouthpiece.

at the very least it will provide people a topic of conversation and questions to the jw's who knock on their door: "so whats this whole sex abuse in kingdom halls thing about i saw on the billboard down the road?

sunny23

The first ever billboard has been crowd funded on Reddit and will be going up. I'm curious to know if it will cause a spark in any JW's who already have questions or doubts and lead them to research into the child abuse cases and lead them to the thought that the WT and GB are NOT inspired or Gods mouthpiece.

At the very least it will provide people a topic of conversation and questions to the JW's who knock on their door: "So whats this whole sex abuse in kingdom halls thing about I saw on the billboard down the road?" I think this could be effective!

$3,200 was the needed funds and it was achieved in less than a month. This is going up in TX but I would gladly contribute $$$ to one here in FL. Of course "our" billboard would have this site link along with JWFacts.com. I know Simon is against this type of "smear campaiging," but what are your thoughts? Do you see any value in this at all?

http://www.reddit.com/r/exjw/comments/30yeon/operation_billboard_fundraising_to_go_live/