"God is Love"

by Justin 24 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • Justin
    Justin

    After my thread on seminary education, I am doing one more about liberal clergy. My previous thread dealt with the idea that their education seemed incompatible with their calling, and this naturally led to the possibility that they may hide an underlying skepticism from their parishioners. In this thread I am asking why many of them present a God whose love goes beyond that of the biblical God or even the God of traditional theology.

    The title of the current thread, "God is love," is of course a biblical quotation (1 John 4:8). But we know that does not present the total picture of God contained in the Bible. There is another side presented there. Whether we want to talk about the God who fights the war of Armageddon, or the God whose love cannot be exercised unless his justice is also satisfied, it seems unthinkable to simply state that the Christian God is one of love and let it go at that. And yet, many liberal clergy do just that - they present a God who is totally accepting of everyone with a love bordering on sentimentality. One would not arrive at such an idea either from the foundational texts with which such clergy have to deal, or even from the natural world of which we are a part. So where does it come from?

    I can speculate that perhaps early liberals, on their quest for the "historical Jesus," may have isolated certain texts from the Gospels, and this lopsided view of Christ's teachings was retained even when the historical theories were abandoned. But I don't know. It is very strange that such clergy are able to both repress doubt and then present a God-idea which seems as if it were pulled out of thin air and has no foundation in the texts.

  • Soledad
    Soledad

    The hell he is!

  • DelTheFunkyHomosapien
    DelTheFunkyHomosapien

    That 'statement' should come with a disclaimer, 'HIS' love is conditional and that isn't love. Hate to hijack the thread but have a go at writing the 'God is Love' terms and conditions.

  • Shining One
    Shining One

    Hi Justin,
    I appreciate what you are saying about the (Biblical) image of God not be portrayed accurately by many of the clergy. This is what I mean when I say they do not preach the gospel, which is an offense to some and a joyous revelation to others. I have consistently questioned those who deny the righteousness, holiness and justice of God along with His overwheming love for a dying world.
    The very nature of liberal theology is the denial of the parts of scripture that they find personally embarrassing. Then there is the corrupting influence of modernism upon Christianity. You have heretics like Spong denying practically everything in the book that he claims to 'respect and love', so much so that he has to 'rescue it from fundamentalists'.
    The compromise is what is appreciated and adored on this forum. I suspect that the skeptics embrace this types of Christian because their weak, watered down gospel does not force them to deal with their own sin. Not dealing with the sinful state leads to the eternal state of separation. Its easier here and now but unchangable once the 'tent' of our bodies is discarded for eternity.
    Rex

  • Narkissos
    Narkissos

    Justin,

    I guess the problem (if it is a problem at all) lies in the texts themselves.

    Such an absolute statement as "God is Love" does make everything else unnecessary -- even the rest of Johannine theology. It doesn't take a liberal theologian to see that. Augustine expressed it very well.

    If you take such a statement seriously and still don't drop theology altogether at the same minute, you have to choose between (at least) two interpretative strategies:

    (1) re-interpret the rest of scripture from that perspective: the judgement of God is nothing but the burning effect of Love, etc. Highly poetical but hardly respects the texts;

    (2) acknowledge the impossibility of reducing the variety of Scripture to a consistent doctrine and let the texts be what they are in their respective perspective (!) -- relative or absolute.

    I feel both liberal and orthodox theologians are susceptible of resorting to either strategy according to their mood, or the context: # 1 makes better sermons, # 2 makes better exegesis.

    The advantage of liberalism imo is that it makes the contrast clearer. Liberal theology has always produced highly critical Bible scholars and highly inspirational preachers. Remember liberalism is the twin brother of pietism.

  • jstalin
    jstalin

    God loves children:

    2 King 2:23-24

    23 And he [Elisha] proceeded to go up from there to Beth´el. As he was going up on the way, there were small boys that came out from the city and began to jeer him and that kept saying to him: “Go up, you baldhead! Go up, you baldhead!” 24 Finally he turned behind him and saw them and called down evil upon them in the name of Jehovah. Then two she-bears came out from the woods and went tearing to pieces forty-two children of their number.

  • GentlyFeral
    GentlyFeral

    Shining One,

    I cannot see how a biblical inerrantist, given "demonstrations" of God's "love" as cited by jstalin, can avoid defining love in such a contorted way as to pervert the word into its opposite.

    narkissos,

    Remember liberalism is the twin brother of pietism.

    You've stated in a nutshell why I believe Spong and his cohort are not heretics.

    Ask your wife if you can marry me, ok? You don't have to divorce first.

    gentlyferal

  • Legolas
    Legolas
    The hell he is!

    Soledad hit the head of the nail!

    The Hell He Is!

  • defd
    defd

    Out of ALL the qualities, Love, Wisdom, Power, and Justice, that God possess, Love is the only one that is described that way in 1John4:8

    It says God IS love. It never says that God IS wisdom or God IS Power or God IS Justice. All the other qualities he possess are GOVERNED by His LOVE.

    D.

  • daystar
    daystar

    As you say, this is the liberal spin on it. And because of that popular liberal spin, many people become disillusioned when they begin to realize just how unbalanced and indefensible a stand it ultimately is.

    When persons quote scripture like 2 King 2:23-24 with some distate, I normally don't respond. This is because this scripture really does help describe the god Jehovah that I am familiar with.

    Or... I can guess that the scripture is more descriptive of some superstitious fantasy used to elevate a person in the eyes of others in a culture that is generally more respective of fear-mongering and violence than todays, perhaps.

    In any case, perhaps God is love, but God is also hate, death, violence, truth, lies, etc. ad infinitum...

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