Prayer??? Real or just something we fool ourselves with! (page 2)

dedpoet

I used to pray as a jw, and believed in the power of prayer. Nowadays, I never pray at all. I don't believe there is anyone there listening, so why bother?

TopHat

I like to read the Psalm of David...He said some very heart felt Prayers

1 ¶ A Psalm of David. The earth is the LORD'S, and the fulness thereof; the world, and they that dwell therein. 2 For he hath founded it upon the seas, and established it upon the floods. 3 ¶ Who shall ascend into the hill of the LORD? or who shall stand in his holy place? 4 He that hath clean hands, and a pure heart; who hath not lifted up his soul unto vanity, nor sworn deceitfully. 5 He shall receive the blessing from the LORD, and righteousness from the God of his salvation. 6 This is the generation of them that seek him, that seek thy face, O Jacob. Selah. 7 ¶ Lift up your heads, O ye gates; and be ye lift up, ye everlasting doors; and the King of glory shall come in. 8 Who is this King of glory? The LORD strong and mighty, the LORD mighty in battle. 9 Lift up your heads, O ye gates; even lift them up, ye everlasting doors; and the King of glory shall come in. 10 Who is this King of glory? The LORD of hosts, he is the King of glory. Selah.

Qcmbr

I've said something similar before but here is my take on prayer:

Reason for prayer:

1/ Obedience - i.e. prayer is in and of itself a test of faith.
2/ To thank God - this is the part of prayer you wouldn't expect to get an answer for but is perhaps the most fundamental part.
3/ To ask for specific blessings:
i/ Those that are there but require the asking - such as Help in gaining faith, help to overcome an addiction etc..
ii/ Those that are there but require an action as well as the asking - i.e. 'Is the bible true?' Would also require some effort to read it?
iii/ The can I have ones which are often selfish (I'd like good weather tomorrow - unlikely to be answered unless there is some actual reason for them in some divine plan - so no - the Broncos will not win the Super Bowl due to your parayer)
iv/ The requests on behalf of others (Sickness, world peace, partner to 'see the light 'etc..) Which are likely to be answered if the individual(s) being addressed are also of a similar mindset (i.e. prayer isn't a way of forcing behaviour / environmental changes on others.)
4/ This is the biggie - the one 99% of the time I forget and I suspect all praying people have a struggle with this.. To find out the will of God rather than to present my shopping list. This is the one that requires real discipline, quiet, uncluttered thoughts and time - the meditation bit when we can find our path with divine inspiration. This is where understanding dawns and potentials are seen, opportunities are illustrated and dare I say it 'prophetic' events are presented (as opposed to the normal run of the mill daydreams about future possibilities.)

Now looking at this list there are two parts that seem to require an answer to confirm the viability of prayer:

3 and 4

If anyone's experience of prayer is like mine 4 gets neglected, 3i isn't used very often (many of us quite like our lifestyles and behaviour:), 3ii is used a fair amount but then the requisite faith (doing it) is normally lacking, 3iii is used constantly (often like a petulant child with a wish list for Santa) and then 3iv which is normally tagged on with sincere thought but no personal responsibilty (i.e. world peace would be nice but that's the job of world leaders)

Since at least two of the above(3i and 3ii) require action to get the answer and one(4)requires meditation then only 3iii would you expect to receive a direct response to without any personal effort and yet maybe this is the one that most of us would point to as the reason for prayer not working and being a bit of a joke.

Personally I've got answers mainly in two scenarios 4 and 3ii - when I asked for something , got off my butt the answer was normally found in the doing while the spiritual ones that make me a believer were found in the meditative 'what is Your will' prayers.

upside/down

the latter...

u/d(of the when I stopped praying and started making things happen...my prayers were answered class)

Billygoat

"If God knows everything about you, why does he not hear prayer without the magic "AMEN" word"

Where does it say anywhere that He doesn't hear it without the AMEN?

"If everything is "in Jesus name" then why would God not know this every time and require that your keep reminding him"

IMO, this is more for us than for God. It is a reminder to ME that it is through Christ, my mediator, that God hears.

"If God knows your needs, without prayer, why pray?"

Again, this is more for us than for God. He will provide us all our needs, whether we ask for it or not. The sparrow doesn't pray and yet he's taken well care of. The exercise of us asking for assistance is what keeps us humble. Reminds us that we are the creation, not the God.

"If you pray out loud, doesn't the Devil hear you too and if so, isn't that like aiding information to the enemy?"

God is more powerful than the enemy, so no matter what Satan hears, I am safe. I've been saved and it cannot be taken away from me. So what harm is Satan going to do? If God's will be done, Satan isn't going to get in the way of anything.

Andi

Nate Merit

Satanus, hi!

You're right. Beliefs don't really play any part in it. It simply works because that's the way the universe is. I love the cat eyes icon you use.

Nate Merit

Tophat! Your font is too small! I can barely read it!

TopHat

Sorry Nate...I will make my fonts stand out next time.

Crumpet

I remember talking to god and satan when I was 16 just to see if anything happened and even with the loosest of interpretations of ensuing events there was no evidence of response either way. I conceded that despite my complete faith in both of them at the time they simply didn't care whose side I was on.

Now I've realised that I get the same sense of peace and calmness giving myself a good talking to as the long prayers I made on my knees which would last all night. So maybe I am God?

free2beme

God is more powerful than the enemy, so no matter what Satan hears, I am safe. I've been saved and it cannot be taken away from me. So what harm is Satan going to do? If God's will be done, Satan isn't going to get in the way of anything.

I used to think this and then I wondered, "if God was so powerful, why did he allow his enemies to toy with his people so much?" Personally, I think God and Satan are like football players on the much larger picture that is the Universe and just like in football, sometimes they score and sometimes they have penalties and we are their referees. As they really do not control our life, as much as we control our own. Yet, some of just are such big fans of the game, that it would seem they do.

Prayer??? Real or just something we fool ourselves with!

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