Elders School Part 5: Here's how you've been screwing up... (page 2)

Confession

I was going to comment on the same point, swalker... I can't believe how that 70-plus year old elder was put on the spot like that. I don't recall the WTS ever indicating that all meeting preparation had to be done as a family. They encouraged a family study every week--and this guy was already doing that. I'd have loved to hear that brother stop the COOT dude and ask him...

VERSION #1:

"Excuse me, brother, have you ever been married?"

"Well, no, I haven't."

"I see. So then would it be fair to say that you don't understand what married life is like--and why studying for every single meeting together might be a difficult burden for a couple?"

"Well, er, um...heh heh.."(cough cough cough)

VERSION #2:

"Excuse me, brother, have you ever been married?"

"Yes, I'm married."

"Well, do you always study for every single meeting with your wife? And remember, Jehovah is listening."

"Well, er, um..heh heh..let's just say I'm studying with her every chance I get."

"Well it looks like you have something to work on, doesn't it???"

sir82

Hey y'all...

I edited the post, so it is now complete. Be sure to check out Talk # 19!

sir82

Jourles

Some elders have testified in favor of persons accused of child abuse when they had no way of knowing whether he was innocent or guilty."

So it's not OK for elders to testify for the defense, but is it still OK for the R&F to testify for the defense? (notice how I only mentioned the defense?)

We hear of court hearings where half the congregation shows up on behalf of the accused. Will that now change? Or will only the elders refrain from showing up? I'm just wondering if the legal department doesn't want anyone in the command structure appearing under certain circumstances. Would MS's and below be able to attend since they hold no authority in the congregation, unlike the elders?

Did they clarify that issue Sir82?

tall penguin

"the service committe is NOT a separate body of elders."
Really?! I thought those 3 brothers ran the show! And the other elders were there just to make it look good. Or at the very least, to give the lesser assignments to, like shepherding calls.
tall penguin

sir82

Jourles,

They made that statement as is, with no embellishment. Of course there was no opportunity to ask for any clarification.

Actually, I believe the exact quote may have been "Do not involve yourself..." and "Some have testified..." Perhaps I read too much into it? I assumed that that statement, addressed to a roomful of elders, applied to elders.

The speaker was reading the note, rather than speaking extemporaneously.

There is another exact quote with legal ramifications in the next & final part of my notes. I don't know when my posting limit will allow me to post it though.

onesong

Although it makes me sick to my stomach reading your notes, thanks so much for your hard work Sir!

I'm sending you all the good vibes and encouragement I can muster, it must be excruciating being there.

AlmostAtheist

After reviewing the announcement of what to say when someone is publically reproved: "OF COURSE there are restrictions - but we don't announce that from the platform."

Oh, HELL no. We wouldn't want the congregation to start asking what the story is with "restrictions" after a guy's reinstated. That leads to all those nasty questions that don't have any Bible answers, not even nasty ones. Then you've got all the disassociations, it's just a mess. Better to shut up, hope it just goes away.

"But she was reinstated after only 3 months. Thinfs like that could give the congregation the idea that 'I can do what I like, serve my time, and be reinstated quickly'."

Wouldn't want anybody to think we'll be welcoming repentant sinners with open arms like some sort of freaking "Father of the Prodigal Son" or something...

"Nothing should be aded to or taken away from these (DF, DA, etc.) announcements."

"For if he adds to it, the announcement shall be added to him. And if he takes away, his lot will be taken away from the tree of life. Amen and amen. Selah." Wow, thanks sir! This was a fantastic review of all this crap. I gotta go take a bath now... but thanks! Dave

Will Power

very interesting elder school thing they got going there.
egads, behind closed doors, the strategy to keep everyone in line....
as an "outsider" (as in not-an-elder, never a jdub, AND female)
I was under the impression from reading the society's literature
that ALL members of the organization are
MINISTERS
there is no division of laity/clergy. All members are equal. (realizing of course that some are more equal than others)
Do I have this wrong or are they misrepresenting themselves to the public?

under the law of mandatory reporting in states, countries that have this law, MINISTERS must report.
is this a case of picking a choosing the definition of minister?

wp

AuldSoul

sir82,

Would you describe what you received as one-way communication?

From your description the information seems to be designed toward emotional appeal, rather than logical appeal. Would you say that is a fair characterization?

Was there emphasis on engendering a sense of belonging, as an elder, with other elders that are going through the same things?

Did the moral rightness of the view presented form a frame of reference for the talks?

In other words: Would World Book Encyclopedia say your meeting was propagandistic or educational? http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/100209/1.ashx

AuldSoul

Elders School Part 5: Here's how you've been screwing up...

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