HOW THE WTBS CONTINUES TO MISS THE POINT!

by JUSTAMOM 35 Replies latest jw friends

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  Naeblis

  Shelby. You have completely ignored my question. How are the babies "free will agents" when they were killed before they could sin? If god can see the evil in potential hearts why doesn't he kill evil people as he seemed tohave no trouble doing there? Because of free will? Why was it ok then? Your veiled threats do nothing and yes I can see them. The reason that I don't believe that god talks to you is not because Idon't believe in god, but because your "insight" is so cliched and unoriginal it could only come from someone with delusions of grandeur. Take care Shelby. Get help.

  In fact. I will be so bold as to say that you have trapped yourself.

  Humans have Free will

  There are CONSEQUENCES to that free will, one of which is death.

  You claim the babies at the flood were killed because god SAW in t heir hearts.

  Where is the Free Will Shelby?

  What is the point of allowing us to make decisions if god looks in the future, sees the decisions we make, and kills us at birth?
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  Naeblis

  "Know what I find SO 'peculiar', though, Naeb, with folks like you?(Actually, I find it 'amusing') Is that you BELIEVE the acts of vengeance, so as to have an animosity toward my Father... and yet, you have NO fear with regard 'checking His hand'! I mean, IF, dear one, my Father is such an 'exacting' God, such a 'forceful' and 'unforgiving' God... such a hateful, angry, malicious God... what in the WORLD makes YOU think YOU... with your puny mere exhalation of an existence... are going to be OVERLOOKED in the day of His 'vengeance' when YOU... have, in essence... mocked and called down evil upon Him? What makes YOU think you will 'get away'... with checking His hand?"

  Wherever did I say I believed the acts of vengeance or love? Your association with god sure doesn't seem to have helped your reading comprehension. I said I didn't OVERLOOk them. Much the same as reading and commenting on any other book I read. I read the bible. And I note the savegery of God in places, and the mercy. I already explained why I think this is. Go back and read.

  "Methinks you need to 'figure out' just what it is that you BELIEVE, Naeb, dear. 'Cause if He DOESN'T exist... or if He DOESN'T
  'exact vengeance'... then your anger... is moot. But if He DOES... then your HEART... is eventually going to cause your MOUTH... to sin against Him. And indeed, if He IS a God of 'acts of vengeance', SURELY... you don't want to 'fall into His hands' for the sins of YOUR mouth. Do you?"

  I have my whole life to figure out what I believe. In fact. I AM adpoting a wait and see attitude. Just because I'm calling you out doesn't mean I'm burning my bridges with a possible god. I do NOT believe in a god who could justify killing babies. Especially a god who offers free will. Your argument falls flat on its face. And Shelby? If God DOES turn out to be this god of vengeance you seem to believe he is? I will suffer an eternity of torment rather than bow myknee to his madness.

  "My advice to you? As someone here so succinctly puts in their "motto" line... 'get in, sit down, shut up... and hold on.' In other words, wait and SEE. Wait and SEE if there is a justification... and explanation. If so, then you are out of line. If not, then... well, 'call' Him on it. But do it like a MAN... face to face."

  Do it like a man? Face to face? I ussue a personal challenge to your god. Is he sitting there with you at the computer? Tell him if he isn't I personally challenge him to come here and debate me. If he does not come tonight, (im at work so he might have to wait a bit) then it will be exposinghim as a coward, and you as a liar.

  Anxiously waiting Yahweh.
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  ozziepost

  G'day nytelecom1,

  I appreciate your comments but for the benefit of others who might get misled I'd like to pick up again.

  this practice was carried
  over to the Christian congergation

  But it wasn't, was it? The instructions given by the apostles have been interpreted by the WTS as being equivalent in nature to what is found in the OT I know but no Christians were stoned, were they?

  God would likely want to keep his congergation clean

  This is WTS reasoning but who can know the mind of God? All we can say with any degree of certainty is what His Word says and His Word DOES NOT support what the WTS stipulates as judicial procedures in its congregations.

  Cheers,
  Ozzie

  "Evil is the absence of empathy"
  Movie (2000), Nuremberg
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  nytelecom1

  gday ozzie,

  I took your information to heart and approached a co-worker with the
  scripture.....now this person knows i am a dub, but i hardly ever speak to the person of my beliefs, for I am know there is a time and a place for everything. I showed them the scripture and asked them what their view on it was. They reasoned as I did. What then may I ask you would the purpose of Paul putting this instruction down to the Congergation other than to follow it? Christians were not instructed to stone but to "quit mixing" with those in the congergation.

  by the way ...note to all...if you want a response from me, stop writing in cryptic b.s. with an annoying tone : )..m
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  AGuest

  Naeblis... you are speaking of things before the New Covenant. BEFORE such covenant... everything was answered... by death. SINCE the New Covenant, the answer... to EVERYTHING... is love, forgiveness, mercy... and life. Vengeance is no longer carried out immediately.

  You asked about the babies; I do not know my Father's mind... but I DO know that His 'law': an 'eye'... for an 'eye'; a life... for a life. If babies died, know that other babies... those that belonged to my Father... died before. Get it? I gave you the description of 'vengeance'... I was my hope that you would hear, and get the sense of that. Do I 'condone' retribution? It is not MY retribution and I have NO place to 'check the hand' of God. Just like you will, in time, answer for YOUR acts... whether good... or vile... my Father will provide an answer as to HIS acts.

  Okay, with that said, (dang it, Naeblis! I HATE this...)

  The word of my Father to YOU, 'naeblis' (and no, He has not revealed your true name to me...), THROUGH my Lord... is that your challenge HAS been heard... and you will be answered. Your heart will become even more hardened and more obstinate... and then, indeed, you WILL come to know JAH. You WILL see Him... face to face. Indeed, though, you were warned, that it is a TERRIBLE thing to fall into the hands of the living God. But with your OWN mouth... that you have judged... and sentenced... yourself:

  I will suffer an eternity of torment rather than bow myknee to his madness.

  Thus, just as your heart has spoken it... so it will be. And I am sorry... truly.

  Good night, all.

  A slave of Christ,

  SJ
• 

  Naeblis

  "Naeblis... you are speaking of things before the New Covenant. BEFORE such covenant... everything was answered... by death."

  Why has God suddenly become more merciful?

  "SINCE the New Covenant, the answer... to EVERYTHING... is love, forgiveness, mercy... and life. Vengeance is no longer carried out immediately."

  Why the flip flop?

  "You asked about the babies; I do not know my Father's mind..."

  That's the whole point you lunatic. You claim god talks to you. Ask him.

  "but I DO know that His 'law': an 'eye'... for an 'eye'; a life... for a life. If babies died, know that other babies... those that belonged to my Father... died before."

  So because "babies that belonged to him" died he thought it was ok to kill other babies? Sounds like a rather petty god.

  "Okay, with that said, (dang it, Naeblis! I HATE this...)"

  Spare me your contrived pity

  "The word of my Father to YOU, 'naeblis' (and no, He has not revealed your true name to me...)"

  Why not? Any computer person with mediocre skills could find myname from the internet. Your god is really disappointing me Shelby.

  , "THROUGH my Lord... is that your challenge HAS been heard... and you will be answered. Your heart will become even more hardened"

  What you did there was rather clever. You knew you had no answers and knew I would mock you, so you make a prophecy that my h eart will becoem more hardened knowing I will fulfill it. Looks like you paid closer attention during your Witness years then you care to admit.

  . "You WILL see Him... face to face. Indeed, though, you were warned, that it is a TERRIBLE thing to fall into the hands of the living God. But with your OWN mouth... that you have judged... and sentenced... yourself"

  I clearly asked him to come. To this point, the only person who has joined me tonight is the Pizza delivery girl,a nd while she was moderately cute, was hardly god like. Is your god so weak and cowardly that he won't come debate a simple Greeklike myself?? Aren't you embarassed for him? I would be.

  In concusion Shelby, you ignored my argument because you realized you had slipped up, your only way of dealing with it is by saying " I don't know my lord's mind" Well then what good is this relationship you have goin on? ASK HIM!! Of course you won't. Because you can't. You have proven yourself to be nothing more than the charlatan I expected you to be. In this case you 'talk the talk' but can't 'walk the walk' Good night.