Bad actions are still BAD no matter how you spin it!
And Suddenly I Understand the Muslim "Cartoon" Riots
by MerryMagdalene 27 Replies latest social current
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greendawn
The Moslems have to get better control of their primitive aggressive urges and behave in a more civilised way. There have been cartoons, books and even films that have degraded the Christ in much worse ways than those cartoons did to Mohammed, yet no one went beserk, rioted and issued threats to kill, not even the fundies.
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tijkmo
wow ...good article merry...explains a lot
and im going to link it with cordelias latest...cos i think it would help her
styl
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Abaddon
Well, you don't have to be a genius to figure out protesting against linking Mohammed with terrorism in a cartoon by threatening terrorism is... well fucking stupid. Utter lack of self-introspection; the characteristic of most traditional religions and high control groups.
The same lack of introspection leads to complaining about those Danish cartoons whilst Israel fares rather badly in Islamist cartoons.... however, the contest for Holocaust cartoons being held by a newspaper in Tehran in response to the Danish ones is almost funny.
The problem, of course, is that if all tooth fairies are of equal levels of demonstrability, be they Roman Catholic, Iclamic, Hindu, Mormon, Scientologist, Moonie or Dubbie, then one cannot stop upsetting sincere faithful people of an established religious tradition without also giving protection to made-up modern religions.
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undercover
skeptics must always appreciate how hard it is for people to have their beliefs challenged. It is, quite literally, a threat to their brain's sense of survival. It is entirely normal for people to be defensive in such situations. The brain feels it is fighting for its life. It is unfortunate that this can produce behavior that is provocative, hostile, and even vicious, but it is understandable as well.
Sorry, but a bunch of people running around attacking embassys, military bases and killing people is not justifiable action just because they feel "threatened" by some cartoons.
If those actions are justifiable then since most ex-JWs feel threatened by the WTS, lets rise up, storm Bethel and attack the GB members. They're a threat to our survival, we have to act defensively. We'll be fighting for our life. It's unfortunate that they have to die at our hostile actions but hey, it's understandable.
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Narkissos
I agree that "threatened beliefs" is a good explanation of how popular reaction works.
However I don't believe for an instant that this is a spontaneous reaction. Potentially "blasphemous" criticism of Islam has been around in the Christian / post-Christian West for centuries. Those specific cartoons had to be first popularised in Muslim communities / countries to trigger the "threatened beliefs" reaction. And this serves a political agenda.
(So does the popularisation in the Western world of "jihad" quranic quotations out of context, for instance. Manipulation works both ways.)
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MerryMagdalene
LOL...I'm definitely not trying to "spin" anything, and I agree that certain actions are not justifiable or excusable. I am simply trying to understand. And I am finding that contemplating this principle of the defense of personal belief systems as a personal "survival" issue is very helpful in doing so.
It is helping me understand why people will harbour and defend beliefs others find stupid or hurtful of extremely dangerous in a variety of situations: how a mother who loves me could also shun me (as tijkmo picked up on and thought might be helpful for Cordelia), how a man could murder his wife and child, how terrorists can kill innocent people, how leaders leaders can start and perpetuate devastating wars and conflicts.
I do not seek excuses for such behaviours. I seek to understand and inform myself. Belief systems are incredibly complex. Situations in which we find ourselves personally and politically can also be very complex, involving a variety of belief systems we don't understand and, all too often, don't want to understand.
I want to understand and better equip myself to deal with them as they become issues of importance in my life.
~Merry
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MerryMagdalene
And here's the link to the article I was referencing. Sorry I didn't include it earlier
http://www.csicop.org/si/2000-11/beliefs.html
~Merry
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jgnat
Mary, that is great insight. And I agree that understanding where the behavior is coming from is not excusing it. Understanding is the first step to getting to the root of the problem and dealing with it.
Returning the concept to JW-land, understanding what is keeping our loved-ones captive to the concept, is the first step in finding a cure for what ails them.
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roybatty
It's not about the cartoons. Most of the people rioting have not even seen the cartoons.
EXACTLY! I was thinking the same thing and the comparison to the L.A. riots (or for that matter most riots in the U.S.). In just about any area with extremely high unemployment, poverty and a large group of angry, young men you'll find just about any reason for a riot. Added to this is the governments behind the scenes stirring things up. I mean, c'mon, where does one find a Denmark flag???? I wonder if the typical mid-east Wal-Mart carries one?
It's actually a very effective way for governments to stay in power. Distract the people away from your own curruption and poor leadership and instead focus on the great Satan. Hell, the WT used a similiar tactic for years on most of us.