I need the top 5 questions to present to the elders....

by AK - Jeff 32 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  slimboyfat

  1. Read the Deuteronomy scripture about a false prophet being the one who speaks in Jehovah's name and the thing does not happen.

  2. Then get a pre-1995 Awake! and read the raison d'etre that appears in every issue mentioning "the creator's promise of a peaceful and secure new world before the generation that saw the events of 1914 passes away."

  3. Then ask them if: a) Jehovah did make the promise, but did not keep it, or

  b) Jehovah never made the promise and the society spoke falsely in Jehovah's name.

  I can't think of a way round that one.
• 

  Gregor

  Jeff,

  I like the cut of your jib!! (whatever that means) Just a couple of suggestions from someone who has been there.

  When you think about cornering the JC with a logical presentation of simple, straightforward, Society based evidence, always keep a mental picture of the famous three monkeys, Seeno, Hearno and Speakno. This will help you from being too frustrated. The personal mailings idea is good. Keep it pithy. I would not bother with a newspaper classified ad. However, a small display ad would be good if it appeared in your local papers religion section. I know these can cost a few bucks. Contact me through a PM and I would be willing to contribute towards it. Maybe some others would too.
• 

  dozy

  "I want to present myself as having left over serious issues of conscience, and not out of rebellion of any sort. Kill 'em with kindness and careful reasoning. I know it's shot in the dark. But does anyone have a list or just one or two foolproof questions that would stick with these people? I would like to incorporate stimulating questions about the five greatest concerns I have with the organization."

  Is it just me that finds this kind of approach distasteful? Someone wants to DA himself and asks a group of (mainly) ex-witnesses / apostates for a few questions to put in a letter to the rest of the congregation so that he can appear to leaving over "serious issues of conscience". I'm looking for my five greatest concerns - any suggestions for my greatest concerns , folks? Any foolproof questions?

  Maybe JWD could produce a standard DF letter - preprinted , with a space for name and date , with perhaps ten popular "greatest concerns" and the user could maybe delete as required those that didn't really concern him/her. How about adding a few "field tested" foolproof AND stimulating questions guaranteed to stump any witness (money back if nobody is fooled or stimulated [sounds like fun])? It reminds me of the time an evangelical tried to give me the book "20 Questions to ask a Jehovah's witness". I told him that the book was actually for him and not me. I asked him if he knew what the questions were. He admitted that he hadn't read the book - it was in pristine , mint condition. I asked him if he actually had any questions. He said that he didn't , but once he had read the book , he would ask me some of the questions from the book the next time a witness called. And they think we are dumb!

  Have we switched from relying on an organisation which gives all the answers to relying on an organisation that gives all the questions? If so , is this a positive step?
• 

  Legolas
• 

  AK - Jeff

  Is it just me that finds this kind of approach distasteful? Someone wants to DA himself and asks a group of (mainly) ex-witnesses / apostates for a few questions to put in a letter to the rest of the congregation so that he can appear to leaving over "serious issues of conscience". I'm looking for my five greatest concerns - any suggestions for my greatest concerns , folks? Any foolproof questions?

  Dozy - I find your discomfiture with the issue distasteful a bit. I am not asking anyone to give me the 'correct words of truth'. I had to this point elected to leave the sleeping dog lie, and not bother with Da'ing myself. The elders have recently backed me into a corner that may require the choice between Da and Df. The Da'ing option is the one I will most likely choose. I truly did leave over serious issues of conscience, but have simply asked my associates here on JWD to help me put my thoughts together in a form that might catch the eye of a current witness and help them to leave the cult also. As all of us know this is a tricky thing to accomplish given the witness mindset. I only get one shot at it and want to make sure I use an approach that may give another cult member reason to think.

  I am not asking anyone to write a 'form letter' for me, or to make up reasons that are not mine. Just for help in assessing the best wording and issues to present. How that seems distasteful to you I cannot imagine.

  Jeff
• 

  Legolas

  Dozy sweetie...what is your point?

  He wants to help people to see the cult for what it is...and who knows better then us who they REALLY are?
• 

  parlay

  After choosing the five questions you know they cannot answer, why not meet with them and tape their canned non-answers. A tape recording to go along with the letter could be the icing on the cake for anyone you want to know the real truth.

  l
• 

  AK - Jeff

  Thanx Legolas for that support. Appreciated.

  After choosing the five questions you know they cannot answer, why not meet with them and tape their canned non-answers. A tape recording to go along with the letter could be the icing on the cake for anyone you want to know the real truth.

  l

  Parlay - not a bad idea. But I don't know if I could keep from puking if I had to meet face to face with the bastards.

  Jeff
• 

  AuldSoul

  Have we switched from relying on an organisation which gives all the answers to relying on an organisation that gives all the questions?

  No. The posters here are not an organization. The questions don't come from an organization.

  If so, is this a positve step?

  In my opinion, if that were the case, then yes, it would be an improvement. Answers from the organization we left are lies, so they aren't actual answers. A question can't lie, it asserts no knowledge but, rather, asserts the absence of knowledge. Any change from lies to non-lies is an improvement, in my opinion. I would rather admit ignorance than make a false pretense of knowledge.

  *** rs p. 136 False Prophets ***
  Have not Jehovah’s Witnesses made errors in their teachings?
  Jehovah’s Witnesses do not claim to be inspired prophets. They have made mistakes. Like the apostles of Jesus Christ, they have at times had some wrong expectations.—Luke 19:11; Acts 1:6.

  Jesus disciples had mistaken personal viewpoints they received from Jewish religious leaders. Did they teach those viewpoints, or ask a question for clarification? In both cases, i.e. Luke 19:11 and Acts 1:6, they admitted ignorance and asked for clarification (humility and candor). They also had not yet received the helper Jesus was sending.

  In the case of the WTS, we find that within the past 127 years they have engaged in actively teaching many doctrines that later are found to be false, which is quite different from simply believing a false idea or wondering whether a false idea might be correct. Not infrequently, these false doctrines that were actively taught led to the premature deaths or economic ruin of true believers.

  The question becomes, why would anyone need to listen to an organization that admits up front that it may be wrong? Especially considering what Jesus, Paul, Peter, John, and James are recorded as saying about the holy spirit and how it operates on individuals, how could anyone conclude that the holy spirit is guiding these men to error and guiding God's organization into bloodguilt?

  Now, if you and I agree that the holy spirit is not guiding the organization, then why would anyone put confidence in that organization? Would they not be better off trusting the source of truth to which Jesus directed attention? (John 14:26; 16:12-16) The source to which Paul directed attention? (1 Corinthians 2:6-13) The source to which Peter directed attention? (2 Peter 1:19-21) To which John and James directed attention? (1 John 2:18-29; 3:24; 5:5-7; James 1:5-8)

  Unanswered questions are always better than lying answers.

  Respectfully,
  AuldSoul
• 

  justsomedude

  Why are JWs still preaching when the Jan. 1 1989 Watchtower clearly stated that the work would end within the 20th century? And why was the 1989 bound volume sanitized to remove that statement?

  Is there a scan of this somewhere?