Freemasonry and the congregation (page 2)

Tea4Two

May I ask....Is any Masonry involved at all in Freemasonry?

Brigid

This is quite another reason I have such a hard time believing there are any real ties between real Freemasonry and any past WBTS authority.

My jury is still out on this. I believe they may have at the beginning, then it got all distorted and finally distilled out replaced by sterile religious practice. I still have not researched (can't say that I care to invest that much either) to make an intelligent argument either way.
Hitler used rite and ritual but ignorantly (thank the gods) but you see quasi magick all over the Nazi symbolism (i.e. the swastika they reversed to end mankind's evolution with the "pinnacle" of the third reich). The point I'm trying to make (and yes, it's a stretch) is that the may have (or had at one time) a little bit of the knowledge of the Mysteries but it morphed into using it to enslave people and eventually distilled into sterile meaninglessness.

I dunno.

~Brigid

under_believer

I have never believed in any Freemason/WBTS link, even now that I appear to be an apostate. I just don't see enough evidence for it, and it also doesn't seem like it would really change anything if it were true.

All, excellent, perceptive analysis of Witness ritual--I am thinking about it in a whole new way now.

daystar

The point I'm trying to make (and yes, it's a stretch) is that the may have (or had at one time) a little bit of the knowledge of the Mysteries but it morphed into using it to enslave people and eventually distilled into sterile meaninglessness.

I'm not arguing that. You don't have to be a Mason to dig up some of the mysteries of the Masons. I mean, I could speak more or less knowledgably with a Mason to where someone not in the know might make the assumption that I am. I could even use some of their symbolism towards my own ends. But that still doesn't make me a Mason. That makes me a person delving into something that could be destructive without the real understanding that Initiation imparts.

daystar

May I ask....Is any Masonry involved at all in Freemasonry?

By masonry, do you mean like, brickmasonry?

Other than metaphorically, not really. The temple of God is a physical temple only to those without... "proper understanding".

freetosee

I think there is a lot of evidence that freemasonry had a strong influence on the WTS. I believe Russell and Rutherford were Masons. Because of the many similarities in the symbolism, doctrine & believes (it’s a long list), especially the Pyramidology, secrecy and definition of ‘lie’.
Russell had a surprising in-depth knowledge of Masonry and wrote: “The Free Masons also expect the same glorious personage and in there traditions, identifying Him with Hiram Abiff, the Archangel, the antitypical Melchizedeck, Priest as well as King, we identify as ‘the Man Jesus Christ’.”
Russell’s early group conducted their meeting in Masonic Halls. That’s why we have Kingdom Halls, not churches or synagogues.
I think Miller and Masonry somewhat put together made the early WTS. If the Masonic Orders were pleased with this, I do not know.
If I had an invitation, I would go just out of curiosity. If you do, please tell us about it.
freetosee /Sorry I keep having problems posting!?

Kenneson

Please get your facts right. Neither Russell nor Rutherford are buried in a Masonic cemetery. There is a Masonic temple across the street from the cemetery where Russell is buried in the Bethel plot, but the cemetery was there years prior to the temple's construction. The cemetery is not owned by the Masons. Nor is it owned by a particular religion; it is non-denominational. If you don't believe me, call Rosemont United Cemetery and confirm it for yourself. Yes, Russell's early Bible Students met in Masonic halls. The Masons made money by renting a room to different groups and the Bible Students needed a place to meet. It was not Russell who called the meeting places Kingdom Halls; that was Rutherford. The first Kingdom Hall built was in Honolulu, Hawaii in 1935. Rutherford is responsible for the name. He said that since the Witnesses were preaching the good news of the Kingdom, the name of the building they meet in should reflect that.

freetosee

Kenneson
I didn’t say they were buried in a Masonic cemetery, although many Masons are buried in that graveyard, the streets names that surround the cemetery are mason. To me Russells gravestone is very much Mason.
Russell did not give the name ‘Kingdom Hall’, but the fact of calling them ‘Halls’ is typical Mason. Why did Rutherford place a typical mason symbol on his famous “Finished Mystery” book? Why did he choose that title? Russell grow up in an very Mason area with much of his family being Mason.
Don’t get me wrong, I have nothing against Mason and secret societies.

freetosee

Most interesting are their parallel beliefs -Russell and Mason. Here are only a few:

ABOUT GOD

Jehovah is the most important word, used rather than Yahweh
Both use the Masonic term Great Architect
Both believe God yielded power to a lesser God

JESUS

Is only a man, not Almighty God
No need for Christ as mediator

CHURCH

Both claim not to be a religion
The church is a pyramid

BIBLE

Is written in a code
It’s a hidden book & is a temple

FUTURE

Both believe in a future life for all mankind, a golden Age (Awake!’s early name)
Both reject doctrine of hell

ABOUT TRUTH

Both say –a lie is not a lie when one deceives someone not worthy to know the truth
Both will lie under oath to protect friends
Both emphasize continuing revelations (new light)
God build the Great Pyramid
Both believe in works salvation, new birth not needed
Catholic Church is

Because of the same buzz words I was asked twice by colleges, after a long handshake, if I was Mason. At that time I know nothing about Mason.

freetosee /sorry I have formatting problems

freetosee

Addition: Catholic Church is Babylon the Great (Sorry, post pieces keep missing)

Freemasonry and the congregation

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