The Challange of Faith

by truth_be_told 41 Replies latest jw friends

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  truth_be_told

  I stumbled on this site dong some research, I post now only for those you have not sinned against Jehovah's Holy Spirit, since only Jehovah knows this, some value might be taken form this.

  I currently serve as the service overseer in my congregation, I have been an elder for over 10 years.

  The fundmental issue that challanges every JW faith at some point are the imperfections of the WTBS, & those that take the lead sometimes make huge errors. As a third generation JW with a huge network of elders, I have heard many bad things about those that take the lead.

  Some of these have effected myself and my family, this is the test, no different than what Job faced, but it is more on the emotional and mental level. You can 't survive as a JW if you can't chalk these things up to imperfection and move on, no matter how devasting they might be.

  This is where the problem starts, the Elders represent Jehovah's Soverienty within the congregations, this huge responsibility is abused by some, by interfering in peoples personal lives, it saddens me when this happens, but again it's imperfection. When people dwell on this it destroys faith. I feel bad for people who have been stumbled by those taking the lead, it is truely tragic.

  But those that Jehovah has appointed to take the lead in the past have had failing too, look at King David & the Apostle Peter.

  This fact remains constant "Men(WBTS) that make huge error/mistakes don't change the truth, it changes how we view the truth"

  It makes us resentfull and bitter, but it doesn't change what the truth is, our perpective is changed because of flaws in men, not Jehovah.

  The internal test is more deadly than even having to had a purple triange during WWII, certianly it is more successfull, and that is why it is allowed.

  It's Job like in this aspect Satan says to Jehovah "as long everything goes good for them within the congregation, they have no reason to leave, let me for a change test them from within, and see if they will stick with you or leave you?" Will you pass this test and challange of faith?
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  Star Moore

  Dear Truth,

  I know you are sincerely trying to help. But the thing is, there shouldn't be a governing body. The word, governing body is not in the bible.. The apostles in Jerusalem and older men, helped with one single problem, circumcism, and that was only after the arguing went on for years.. They didn't rule the people. The thousand year reign of Christ hasn't begun yet, so noone should be ruling over us. At this time, there is only one mediator between God and man, Jesus Christ.. So the structure of the WT is wrong, from the core.. I believe there are alot of good-hearted people within the org. There are many wrong things.. One thing is that nobody should order you to quit speaking with your loved ones, if they are disfellowshipped. If someone wants to quit associating with someone..because they are a bad influence, it is their decision and theres alone.. There is much more.. I know you want to help but......
• 

  nelly136

  you sound very tired and worn down

  nice to meet you
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  Kristofer

  The problem here is that you equate leaving the organization with leaving Jehovah. As it states in Scripture, Jehovah does not change. So when the organization changes it's view on one issue or another, which is truth? Jehovah doesn't change but the organization does quite frequently. We must decide what is the truth by using our own conscience as both Peter & Paul teach us. So at what point do you say, this organization is no longer or never was speaking for Jehovah. And if they don't speak for Jehovah, then they are not the sole channel of communication between God and man.
  
  
  I decided this once the organization proved themselves to be false prophets. You mention David and Peter being fallible. This is true. HOWEVER, by no means were they ever fallible when speak in the name of Jehovah. Whereas, the organization has spoken things in the name of Jehovah which have not come to pass.
  
  
  We then run into another problem, by using our own conscience, we risk going against the organization, which is grounds for disfellowshipment.
  
  
  Do not equate leaving the org with leaving Jehovah. They are two separate things. You don't need a congregation to have a relationship with your God and my God.
  
  
  
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  Shazard

  Okey. And now question! Should I allways listen to WT? Or if I read in God's Word that I have to come TO Jesus Christ, then I can come to Jesus and have relation with him, to get him know me and get me know him. As knowing Father AND Son is ethernal life. And there is only one who reveals Father to us - Jesus Christ. When I hear Jesus Christ I hear God, when I see Jesus Christ I see God (John 14) when I talk to Jesus I talk to God :)
  Or in THIS case WT still can be wrong and I have to follow WT not Bible? BTW Which Bible is the right one? Haven't WT made mistakes in translating Bible? Meny Meny Meny scholars have pointed that NWT is bad "translation". So is WT ready to admit their errors, or they admit errors only in minor issues, not major?
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  Highlander

  Such a typical remark. You admit that various mistakes/abuses occur, but yet you put the blame on us! so typical.

  But I shouldn't be surprised,, the WTS has always been this way,, the blame ultimately is on the individual, despite the fact they were seriously wronged by another.
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  Leolaia

  Welcome to the board! I have to say that I appreciate your tone. Many ppl come here still active who are quite judgmental and even abusive, but it looks like you are conscientiously dealing with these real issues, and tho you certainly have a different point of view than most of us, you thus far leave judgment to Jehovah.

  As for the Job analogy, Job was loyal to God and loyal to his principles, not loyal to an organization which is what the WTB&S is. By claiming to be God's organization, it blurs the difference between faith in God and faith in a human organization. Faithful men like Isaiah and Jeremiah remained close to Jehovah regardless of how "apostate" and imperfect those claiming to represent him on earth (such as the king and the priests) had become. When you read the NT, you regularly encounter statements about looking to Christ or to God, not to an organization. There is a brotherhood and a "church" but this is not an "organization" the way the Society claims to be. In fact, the Society condemns what happened to the church after the apostles died, that it became more of an organization, with ecclesiastical structure far beyond that in the Bible, and how the Church itself began to play a greater role in people's lives. By having people look to itself rather than Christ, the organization creates the whole problem of "imperfect men" being stumblers. If JWs regarded Christ their source of direction instead, instead of what is published in the Watchtower, or whatever organizational policies the Society adopts, then they will have Christ as their rock, their foundation. How ever they may be wronged by branch overseers/district overseers/circuit overseers/presiding overseers/elders/ministerial servants, they will know that it is not Christ who is wronging them. Since the organization claims to represent Christ, and since it claims that one obeys Christ by obeying it and one disobeys Christ by disobeying it (see the 1 May 1959 Watchtower, p. 269), it is not hard to see how the organization itself can stumble people.
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  greendawn

  There is a lot more that't wrong in the WTS than just the behaviour of some elders, and your attitude is too docile and submissive, the org's failures are down to God testing us.
  
  Have you ever thought that the same could be the case with the religions of so called christendom? Or that all these problems simply mean that the WTS is not the truth?
  
  The real problem is a governing body that fails to keep up with its duties especially when it comes to christian charitable works.
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  Narkissos

  Welcome truth_be_told,

  I seldom hear truly convinced JWs speaking these days, but every time it happens the extraordinary proportion of (self-)indoctrinating words in their speech strikes me. Especially when they are kind and well-meaning as you are.

  The mere fact of calling something a "test" or a "challenge" (not to mention "faith" or "truth") is an unconscious act of (self-)indoctrination. Every reiteration of such words comforts you in thinking you are "right" and "safe" doing what you do -- being "loyal" to "Jehovah's organisation".

  What you call a "test" or "challenge" others would call "scales falling from their eyes". That's not more objective, only the opposite standpoint.

  Ultimately each one of us is responsible for the words s/he uses to "make his/her mind," no matter how many share the same kind of speech. If I chose to waste my life calling a lie "truth" I did it.

  "I tell you, on the day of judgment you will have to give an account for every careless word you utter; for by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned." (Matthew 12:35f)
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  sass_my_frass

  Oh love, thanks for your thoughts, but I'm really very much happier on this side of the madness.

  I hope that you and your family find a way to live well and happily.