Nimrod; Tower of Babel (page 2)

greendawn

I always thought of him as an evil stone age nazi because the city of Babel that he built came to be the archetypal enemy of God's people, in other words his spirit lives on in the whore Babylon the great the ruthless and implaccable opponent of Jerusalem the virgin.

No doubt Nimrod viciously persecuted all those that wanted to stick to Noah's God and religion and sought to bring the then mankind under his rule putting on them a heavy yoke of slavery. The rabid rebel against God filled with violent hatred for Him and His people.

In other words he propagated that most ruinous sin, telling God to his face we don't want you, we don't need you, we will do our own thing. To sin without accountability to God. And the world suddenly got filled with all sorts of ugly things, wars, injustice, poverty, hatred, tragedy, slavery, human sacrifice etc. Peace vanished since that time.

That is the essence of Babylon denying God and getting alienated from Him. It's a problem brought in by Nimrod that to this day mankind failed to tackle. So the curse continues, overarching the whole of human history.

TheListener

I guess my question is: what proof of that (your statement) is there?

The Bible itself doesn't offer that proof and it appears that written history about Nimrod comes from relatively modern writers (modern meaning 200BC - 200AD). These writers were writing down oral traditions and legends. Is that enough to villify someone so profoundly?

I'm just asking.

greendawn

There are no direct references to Nimrod in ancient history though some identify him with some other well known persons, but if we read between the lines of the Biblical narrative, Nimrod means "let us rebel" against God that is, and he being the founder or father of Babylon the archenemy of God's people he could only be a rebel against God. His being a mighty hunter before God means that he flagrantly and ferociously opposed His authority and persecuted His worshippers.

He set up an organisation in fierce opposition to that of Noah and his faithful sons with the intention to destroy it.

under_believer

Hey greendawn... no offense but your post reads like a Watchtower article.

I always thought of him as an evil stone age nazi because the city of Babel that he built came to be the archetypal enemy of God's people, in other words his spirit lives on in the whore Babylon the great the ruthless and implaccable opponent of Jerusalem the virgin.

Where is the proof that he built it? And who were God's people at that time, anyways? And what proof is there linking ancient Babel to the whore of Babylon?

No doubt Nimrod viciously persecuted all those that wanted to stick to Noah's God and religion and sought to bring the then mankind under his rule putting on them a heavy yoke of slavery. The rabid rebel against God filled with violent hatred for Him and His people.

A famous Watchtowerism--"No doubt <baseless speculation>"

In other words he propagated that most ruinous sin, telling God to his face we don't want you, we don't need you, we will do our own thing. To sin without accountability to God. And the world suddenly got filled with all sorts of ugly things, wars, injustice, poverty, hatred, tragedy, slavery, human sacrifice etc. Peace vanished since that time.

Would you mind providing a scripture reference to back up those statements? Just curious where the Bible says that.

TheListener

Nimrod:

Strong's word 05248

- Origin: "Probably of foreign origin" (thus not a Hebrew name? If that's true it's hard to ascribe a Hebrew meaning that is significant).

- Meaning: "rebellion" or "the valiant"

the son of Cush, grandson of Ham, and great grandson of Noah; a mighty hunter, he established an empire in the area of Babylon and Assyria

I did a Hebrew interlinear for Genesis 10:9 and the meaning of the words "mighty hunter before the Lord" don't appear to support a positively evil bent. In fact without adding to the text based on oral traditions it could be argued that Nimrod set up his kingdom and sacrificed to God. Hunting animals that were harming his people. Perhaps he didn't have anything to do with the tower of Babel.

james_woods

Doesn't NWT call him "mighty hunter in opposition to 'jehovah'"?

TheListener

Yes it does. The NWT adds "in opposition" into Gensis 10:9. Unless someone can show me a Hebrew reason for doing so I think there translation of this verse was colored by their beliefs.

Narkissos

There are many hypotheses about the Biblical Nimrod, deriving its name either from gods (the Assyrian Ninurta, god of war and hunt, or the Babylonian Marduk) or human heroes (such as the Assyrian king Tukulti-Ninurta I, 13th century BC, or the Babylonian eponym king Marduk in the 12th century BC). Micah 5:5, naming Assyria as the "land of Nimrod, seems to favour the Assyrian connection.

As TL noted, the Bible does not relate Nimrod to the Tower of Babel. And translating liphne Yhwh, "before Yahweh," by "in opposition to Jehovah" as the NWT does is completely unwarranted.

greendawn

Hi Under Believer, it is not just the WTS that has a negative view of Nimrod along the lines I mention above but many mainstream religions paint him in a bad way.

Babylon is nothing but the Greek name of that city its semitic name being babilu which means gate of God. Therein it is perfectly legitimate to associate Babylon the Great with the city that Nimrod had built along with Erech and Accad. At least that's what many people understand by: and the begining of his kingdom was Babel, Erech etc

Babylon was chosen to symbolise the vicious enemy of God's people of the saints if you like, because it was the original archetypal enemy and in my view what we see in her is the spirit of its founder. Of course Babylon the Great is a spiritual entity not a literal entity the same as New Jerusalem is.

Babylon stands for:

Murder, the blood of all those murdered upon the earth, not just of saints, was found in you.

Black magick, "since the days of your youth you toiled in the arts of magick" invoking the powers of the demons in order to rule through them.

Worshipping the culture of the instincts which alienates from God, being a whore sacrificing the lofty spiritual for the ephemeral fleshly gain.

Leolaia

I know Nimrod's name in Hebrew means "Let's rebel".

But is this the actual etymology? The OT is replete with examples of folk etymology and puns, such as deriving Babel from balal in Genesis 11:9, even though the name actually has nothing to do with this word. Moreover, foreign names commonly undergo deformation in the OT, especially theophoric names, i.e. Abednego in Daniel, or Nisroch in 2 Kings which is either Ninurta or Marduk or a confusion of the two, and the many examples of Assyrian royal names. This problem is underscored also by the LXX which has the form Nebrod for Hebrew nmrd, nmrwd. There are theories galore on the origin of the name "Nimrod", two of the most popular guesses construe it as a version of Marduk (i.e. mrdk < nmrd) or Ninurta (i.e. nwrt < nmrt < nmrd), identifications also based on the similarity of Nimrod with these deities, but of course this reads a vexing crux...

Nimrod; Tower of Babel

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