Something DIED in me on Tuesday

by Amazing 48 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  Amazing

  Hi Ginny: You make good points in the situation that existed before Tuesday. America tries to talk, meet, negotiate for decades, and these nuts terrorixe our people abroad. We go in with military precision to get these cells during the Carter and Reagan years and some duing Bush sr, and Clinton, and they take out our Embassies, travelers, and others. We try more talk and they finally take out the World trade center and thousands of Americans.

  You suggest that you would rather die than live in such a brutal world of 'kill or be killed.' That was the motto of WWII, and if our parents had thought that way we would not be here. They would be dead under the jack-booted marches of Hitler's army.

  We are now in such a brutal world, and I want my children and grandchildren to have a world without such terrorism. We have tried all the other good efforts, and this is what we got, stabbed in the heart. No more. It is time to take them out. I never suggested killing everyone, but to get all these evil people, their system and organizations, and those rogue states that support them. We as a human race can and will do it. Enough nations are behind us, and it will happen. - Amazing
• 

  GinnyTosken

  Amazing,

  I am not suggesting that the U.S. talk, meet, and negotiate for decades. I am pleading that the U.S. target the criminals as closely as it possibly can.

  There are certainly times when one must kill or be killed. I do not wish to live in a society in which the power to kill is used indiscriminately and without regard for what is just.

  Ginny
• 

  D wiltshire

  Many people in pain over what was done to the innocent on Tuesday, want to feel good with a little good old retailiation.
  And they will feel good for a little while but that's all. Eventually the reality kicks in after the anger subsides, and those that let anger move them to over react now feel very bad. They feel stupid and wished that someone would have help them slow down.

  Terrorism, noun: 1) the systematic use of terror;esp. as a means of coercion.

  To destroy more innocent people indiscriminately just to show we mean business seems so much like the first act of terrorism that motivated the 2nd act.

  When a 2 year old asks a complicated question how do you answer?
  How long have you LIVED and how long has God LIVED?100000000 to .0000000001
  Who is like God?
• 

  Oldhippie

  IMHO the US has a unique opportunity here. For once the American public and in fact most of the world are united or at least willing to allow the US to conduct a campaign against terrorism that goes beyond trying to punish only those directly responsible, but also any who support them. If we are ever going to have a safe world in which to live and raise children, or in my case see grandchildren grow up, we must not allow this opportunity to pass. I do not know how to go about it but the price for sponsoring such cowards must become too great to bear. If not now, than when?
• 

  BoozeRunner

  Hi Amazing,

  I can certainly relate to how you feel. The anger is immense, the pain is nearly unbearable. After 2 days of news stories, and trying to come to grips with this tragedy, I read THIS in Thursdays Edition of USA TODAY.
  
  

  ....ordinary Palestinians were unable to stifle their pleasure at America's downfall.
  ''I've never been so happy in my life as when I heard the news,'' said Khalil Abu Laban, a father of seven. ''The Americans are responsible for everything. 'The friend of your enemy is your enemy,' '' he said, quoting from religious texts. ''I am against killing of innocent civilians, but the Americans are bad. This is good for us, the Palestinians.''
  ''The Jews are assassinating, destroying and wounding Palestinians every day,'' said his wife, Aisheh. ''Let them feel the suffering we have been feeling for a long time.''

  Personally, I have wanted to see the severest punishment this country can mete out as punishment. Collateral damage? Not an issue in my book at this time. These extremists think they are fighting a HOLY WAR-this makes them the most dangerous enemy living on the earth. Their children already hate us. Punishing the perpetrators will just make them martyrs to their fellow terrorists and to their family. For all we know, in 10-15 years or sooner, their kids will do the same things. So whats the damage in turning their homeland into the desert it was thousands of years ago?

  Of course, here is where my conscience comes into play. WHERE THE HELL does it all end? How many more innocents must die?

  To be sure, our innocence as a people died on Tuesday. I know that mine certainly did.

  Boozy
• 

  Kent

  Hi Amazing

  
  

  WAR?: Yes. Whatever it takes. Time for talk and negotiation ended in my opinion. The time for peace died. The time for working things out is over. The time for action to get the ones responsible and their host nations is here and now. No more excuses. No more whining about being 'above it all on the high road.' No, it is time to fight dirty, kick below the belt and destory the enemy until they are gone. Give them a does of their own medicine.

  
  I won't say I disagree, because I really don't. But there still are some considerations to be taken. Let's say it is Bin Laden who is behind this, and let's say the Taliban regime in Afganistan is supporting him. Probably Osamu Bin Laden is also backed up (or at least have been for a long time) by the Pakistan government.

  Would it be any better if Afganistan and Pakistan were bombed flat, back to the stone age? Killing a few millions would be a great "revenge", but the results would GUARANTEED be an enormous amount of new attacks on the countries involved in the attacks on Afganistan and Pakistan.

  Israel is constantly sending out messages the PLO and Yassir Arafat is siding with Osamu bin Laden, and today I heard they said they were in reality together in this act. In the shaddow of the disaster in New York, the Israelis attacked the West-Bank, invaded Palestine territory with tanks, killing people - pretty sure they would get away with their continuing terrorism against Palestinians.

  Israel do have an agenda of their own, and so does - I'm sorry to say - most other countries as well. Can we trust information from CIA or other agencies of the same kind? Hardly. What do we REALLY know about who was responsible for the Lockerbee disaster? Lots of people were killed, and their families STILL don't know who was behind this. The documents are classified, and it's a good reason to ask why!

  In this situation it has to be tempting to get rid of quite a few "annoying" persons, linking them to these terrible events. The Israelis ARE doing it quite openly - even to the degree the US officials more or less told them to stop this shit now - even though the US has been backing everything before.

  Can we be sure the Israelis are the only ones with such an agenda? I think not - the oportunity to use these events to get rid of a hell of a lot of people has to be huge!

  I DO agree this is an act of war against the US, and I DO agree the US can't accept that without hiting back - HARD! So hard NOBODY should be tempted to do such an act again.

  But we're dealing with fanatics, and this time it was not another country attacking. Maybe they are shielded by Saddam Husein and the Taliban government. Maybe they sympathize with these assholes - but they're still not representatives of any country! What about the sivilians of countries like Afganistan or Pakistan? These people are having a hard time, and many flee their country. Just remember the Australian case. It's a reason people are fleeing!

  Let's hope the guilty are punished - not too many innocent people among them. Killing innocent muslems won't help killed innocent Americans.

  Yakki Da

  Kent

  I need more BOE letters, KMs and other material. Those who can send it to me - please do! The new section will be interesting!!

  Daily News On The Watchtower and the Jehovah's Witnesses:
  http://watchtower.observer.org
• 

  LittleToe

  IMHO if Bin Laden gets extradited, the delays of the legal process will likely frustrate everyone as much as that of the Lockerbie one.
  That one is still ongoing, and people are still grieving.
  Maybe US law is quicker than our Scot's law, I dunno, but I doubt it.

  While they're at it they should also lock up all the sick-heads who've started making jokes about this tragedy.

  In reply to the thread - I thought I was beyond this level of pain, since my sister and a few close friends were DF'ed a few years ago.
  And I'm fortunate (?) in that I never lost someone personally close, in this.
• 

  SixofNine

  Collateral damage? Not an issue in my book at this time.

  To Boozy, and all the many others who have expressed the same sentiment, I have to ask; how are you different than the terrorist with that attitude?

  BTW, boozy, did you miss the point of your own quote? "''The Jews are assassinating, destroying and wounding Palestinians every day,'' said his wife, Aisheh. ''Let them feel the suffering we have been feeling for a long time.'"

  No one wants to punish the people responsible for this as much as me, hell, I'll even admit I want revenge. Still, wouldn't it be great to both do that AND make the future better for everyone, my child and the children of Palastinians as well? Do you not read your quote and go 'oh, so that is why they celebrate'? Do you NOT GET IT that those people you saw celebrating have seen what we saw much more up close and personal than we did on tuesday on TV? They live with it, and they percieve us as the problem.

  Hell, with your attitude, maybe you are the problem. Change.
• 

  BoozeRunner

  SixOfNine, did you notice the end of my post? Pay attention, and you will see that I was venting.

  I clearly stated,

  Of course, heres where my conscience comes into play. WHERE THE HELL does it all end? How many more innocents must die?

  Boozy
• 

  SixofNine

  I did see that Boozy, just didn't know what to make of it after a terrorist type comment like "Collateral damage? Not an issue in my book at this time."

  Remember people, I don't where the hell "collateral damage" came into the common verncular, but I sure know it was not a good day for mankind when it did.

  Collateral damage means killing children and old people and infirmed people and frightened housewives and 25 year old men with cerebral palsy and sweet little down syndrome people. You know, all the people who can't man a machine gun.

  Dammit, collateral damage means KILLING.

  You do a good enough job of it, you will piss people off to such an extent that they will later on come and kill your kid. Then you will be responsible for your own kids death. That will be who you will kill with your "not an issue collateral damage".

  To sane people it is ALWAYS an issue. Doesn't mean there won't be any, but GODDAMMIT IT IS AN ISSUE.