New "doom and gloom" brochure

by TR 46 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  Pathofthorns

  You know Waiting,

  posts like yours really make me fume. In all honesty I don't think the society will put those points into print, because i do not believe what that brother told you is the official "published" policy.

  But I also believe that brother took away with him EXACTLY the point the society wanted him to take home.

  1) The society will not put specific guidelines as far as dress into print any more. The skirt above the knee issue is well known, the same as a brother cannot wear a beard, but I don't believe it is so black and white anymore. Sisters i know just hate these remarks, and elders are often at a loss because their wives are wearing short skirts too. I would say this brother is just old school talking some liberties.

  2) I understand the point of not pestering the elders for every minor detail. Many simply want to pick up the phone instead of reasoning on the matter. On the other hand, many elders seem to encourage this, also i think the society has contributed to it as well. The whole research thing is stupid anyway, because you are allowed to come to only one conclusion, the society's. Plus there are so many incompetent elders out there, and reducing the questions posed to these men, reduces the odds of embarassingly wrong answers and liability on their part for stupid advice.

  3) Again, probably not the present stance of the society "in print" regarding DFed family members, but the stance they want you to take. Probably the brother strongly adviced the benefits of not talking to dfed family members in such a way that the audience would come to that conclusion.

  anyways as always, I'm disgusted.

  Path
• 

  RedhorseWoman

  Would these "highlights" be considered new light, or are they simply regurgitated irritations?

  Oh, and the tract was FINALLY delivered to our door. I didn't even get a chance to get there before they scurried back to their car and backed out of the driveway. Then they DROVE into every driveway going down the street. Do people not walk anymore?

  Not surprisingly, this wondrous "new" tract containing earth-shattering information was EXACTLY like every other tract of its ilk published since the 1950's.
• 

  waiting

  Hey Path,

  As for what the brother took away from the one-day, I believe he tried to give me the "meat" of the CO's comments. He wants me & my husband back in the org - we are long time decent friends.

  As for the CO, he's been one for a couple of years now. He's the same one who told us that the Service Dept. told him not to talk to us - so he wouldn't - and hasn't. Has driven right by us in a car, knowing who we were (we were walking through parking lot), would not look at us.

  As for the df'ing old approach - I believe him when he says that the WTBTS is "tightening down on disobedient ones." And I feel this will never be printed by the WTBTS anywhere. Word of mouth procedures. Completely opposite of the official WT website which says "we do not interfer with family ties." (paraphrased words referring to shunning.)

  Btw, this brother was all for these procedures - even though we've had them for decades. He felt we needed these reminders - keep us straight and awake - tightened up & ready for Armageddon.

  He's a nice guy - but he amazes me. He was one of the elders (before being dropped - didn't hardline enough) who df'd my daughter, refused to call the other cong. about the child rapist among them who had raped my daughter, and told my daughter "we hope you don't go off the deep end."

  And he thinks it's a good thing never to talk to your family who leaves The Truth. He's not known for his intelligence, btw. But nice guy, nevertheless.

  waiting
• 

  Frenchy

  Hello, Jehu. Thank you for your post. I see that this is only your second post. I don't remember seeing your first. Anyway, welcome to the board.

  -Seen it all, done it all, can't remember most of it-
• 

  TR

  Hi, Jehu. Welcome!

  Appreciate your "inside" views. Keep them coming!

  TR
• 

  DriveslikeJehu

  Hi everyone, thanks for the warm welcome. It's nice to meet other brothers and sisters online. One thing about waiting's post that stood out in my mind, is that often if you apporach the elders with a question, they will ask you what research you have already done, and if you've prayed about it.
  IMHO, that's very important, b/c if you do those things first, not only will you be able to improve your personal study skills, but you can also strenthen your relationship with Jehovah thru prayer. Most often you'll find your answer before having to come to the elders.
• 

  Angharad

  Just to say hello and welcome Jehu
• 

  Frenchy

  There was an excellent point made in the w 10/1/00 pp. 11,12 p. 14 about just such a thing as has been brought up here.

  The most profitable Bible reading starts, not by reading, but by praying. Prayer is a remarkable privilege. It is as if you began perusing a book on some deep subject by calling on the author for his help in understanding what you were about to read. What a tremendous advantage that can be! The Bible’s Author, Jehovah, offers you that privilege. A member of the first-century governing body wrote to his brothers: “If any one of you is lacking in wisdom, let him keep on asking God, for he give generously to all and without reproaching; and it will be given him. But let him keep on asking in faith, not doubting at all.” (James 1:5,6) The modern-day Governing Body constantly exhorts us to engage in prayerful Bible reading.

  
  What a beautiful thought!
  However a thought that is not so beautiful is expressed in w65 7/1 p. 391 in an article entitled What is Required to Understand the Bible under the subheading: How Can You Obtain the Help of God’s Spirit in the third paragraph of that article a statement is made which, to me, is troubling.

  But in looking to God for his holy spirit we may not overlook God’s manner of imparting his spirit. Not only must we study God’s Word, have the right mental attitude and pray for God’s spirit, but we must recognize God’s visible organization. God is consistent, a God of order, not a God of disorder, even as his Word assures us. (1 Cor. 14:33) He does not impart his holy spirit and an understanding and appreciation of his Word apart from his visible organization. –emphasis mine.

  Two years later another such statement appears in the w67 10/1 587 in one of the study articles:

  Thus the Bible is an organizational book and belongs to the Christian congregation as an organization, not to individuals, regardless of how sincerely they may believe that they can interpret the Bible. For this reason the Bible cannot be properly understood without Jehovah’s visible organization in mind.

  So when we look at that study article first referenced here we find that although the thought of asking for God’s Spirit in understanding what we read is very well stated, the questions to this paragraph which is grouped with paragraph 15 do not address this issue directly but rather they circumvent it quite effectively. So much so that when the conductor asked the ‘supplemental’ question: “So if we read something that is difficult to understand, what do we do?” A young sister raised her hand and answered: “We can pray to Jehovah for help and go and do research in the Society’s publications.” The conductor’s reply: “Yes, thank you, very good.”
  But that is not ‘very good’ because that is not what James said to do now, is it? James said to: “…let him keep on asking God, for he give generously to all and without reproaching; and it will be given him.” James never mentioned anything about ‘researching publications’. He never even suggested that they go to the ‘elders’ and ask. Nor did he advise going to himself, or Paul, or perhaps one of the ‘twelve’. He directed the Christians to go to God.
  Let us not criticize the publishers for running to the elders with their questions. As those two excerpts from previous Watchtowers demonstrate, the publishers have for a long time been conditioned to rely on ‘the organization’ and the closest representative of that organization is the local elder. Why don’t they research the publications of the ‘faithful slave’ first? To be quite candid (this is from many years of experience of publishers coming to me with questions) it is because they are never quite sure of what is ‘current truth’. The ‘truth’ changes and they are not certain that got the last change. Remember that a large percentage of the flock is limited in education and that those asking the questions are usually those that are not examples in regularity at the meetings and so they are afraid of having missed some ‘new light’.
  Suppose someone were to pray for God’s Spirit in understanding a Bible passage such as the paragraph APPEARS to advise and God leads that person to believe something contrary to what is taught by the Society what then? That person will be advised to ‘correct’ his thinking to bring it in line with ‘current truth’. So why pray at all? Why not go to the volumes and look it up, making sure it’s the latest ‘revealed truth’? What need do publishers have of prayer if it cannot be relied upon? So in this instance the ‘publications’ have effectively removed the need for prayer in connection with any understanding of Scripture. In so doing they have effectively blocked or hindered God’s Holy Spirit from operating on that individual inasmuch as the publications remain the final authority on the matter. So now prayer is only for those that author the articles. We now have priesthood in place.
  A side point. I also found it interesting that the term ‘governing body’ when applied to the first century congregation is not capitalized but when applying it to ‘the organization’ it is. Significance?

  -Seen it all, done it all, can't remember most of it-
• 

  Roamingfeline

  Two JW's showed up at my door here in Perth today while I was in the process of locking up to take my daughter swimming. One of them handed me the tract. I took one look at it, said, "Jehovah's Witnesses?" He answered, "Why yes, how did you know?" I said, "Before I left the Organization, I was one of you. Here, you can have this back, I won't be needing it, thanks." They went on to the next door, and I left. It felt great to hand that tract back and declare my freedom!!!!!

  RCat
• 

  waiting

  Hey Frenchy,

  Thank you for that explanation. Very to the point and accurate. The brother who I spoke with, was quite explicit about doing research for ourselves with the WT literature, particularily CD Library.

  I've had questions before - remember the famous "oral sex or no oral sex" debate of mid 70's? Well, we young sisters whisper-debated it, anyway. At the beginning of the year - I believe QFR said "no oral sex." By the end of the same year "oral sex conscience matter, but still in grey area and controversial."

  When I moved down here, I reread those articles and then asked an elder about it. He said "No." I asked was that his personal opinion or the current opinion of WTBTS? He said it was his. I again asked what the WT's opinion was currently. He spoke to other elders (he told me) they agreed it was a conscience matter (with stipulations and "as long as" conditions were met - even between husband & wife).

  JW's are trained - here especially - to ask elders everything. Even if they do their own reading - they have been taught locally - and by the Society - to doublecheck that their thinking is correct and current with the Society.

  And I don't think that's going to change in reality. Too much local power would be lost. A parent wants his child to be independent to a degree - if the parent is secure in their relationship to the child. A parent will want full authority and know-abouts of the child if he doesn't trust the child's judgment or actions.

  I feel we, as christian people, are not trusted to make good judgement calls in alignment with the WT teachings. Our actions are watched closely by the local elders and curious ones to report to the elders "to help us". At least this is the way it is here and has been for over 70 years.

  As many things change in printing, many things stay the same in reality. Just another form of politics.

  waiting