by Neo 91 Replies latest jw friends
AK-Jeff:
It could just be a statistical 'correction' I suppose, but to me the numbers are moving the wrong way this year. I don't understand the logic in the post here - if my stock gained 1.9% annually, and last year just 1.3%, I would count it good news, not bad for my portfolio. Not that the increase is good - but it is not a decline as the post indicated.
I'm glad you said that - I was thinking much the same myself. I think we're "protesting too much" with this thread.
As witnesses we were constantly reminded of Isaiah chapter 2 which tells us that in the final part of the days the mountain of Jehovah ( his earthly organisation) would be firmly established and rise above all other mountains and to it all nations "must stream" to it.
By there interpretation there should be a solid line of people coming into the organisation, and certainly not a decline nor any slow growth.
Gumby
Also don't forget their efforts to count more of the old people that only get 15 minutes of field service.
Their numbers can be highly misleading, not because I think that they didn't report the data as it comes in but because I think they have been doing alot of work on making those numbers come in more skewed.
The rules are constantly getting watered down as another poster mentioned. What was a Bible study, or minimum time report isn't what it used to be, plus the fact that so many people report in bogus time.
I would also add that we shouldn't be to suprised in a rise or drop from the 1.3% growth figures. That was pretty darn low, and I had a feeling it wouldn't stay there. Thinking about how the majority of new JW converts are JW children tells me that we shouldn't be looking for any kind of steady drop in the percentages. Instead it is the overall trend that we need to be looking at, and that doesn't look very good for the WTS.
It still takes an absurd amount of 'preaching' time in order to create one convert. According to last years numbers for every newly baptized person, 1.5 people became inactive. This organization is becoming quite weak. Just look at its publications, they are written for 12 year olds. All they have left is their mind control.
I think the real numbers to look for are the peak publisher numbers. Then we can see how many people became inactive.
Thanks for that Neo, interesting figures.
I see one or two jw apologists have tried to put a positive spin on them, but I have news for you boys - we aren't fooled. A friend of mine who is fading was telling me about his wife's verdict on their ca a feww weeks ago - attendance down by around 30%, and only 4 blackmail victims baptismal candidates, the oldest of whom was just turned 13, kids of jws in other words.
Whichever way you look at it, one things' for sure
THIS IS NOT GOOD NEWS FOR THE OLD BOYS IN BROOKLYN.
I used to be a farm boy in my youth and I learned a lot about the "sheep" that the WT calls it's great crowd in the KH. If only a couple get the idea to go in a different direction from the main herd that you are trying to force into the loading chute- well then boys, that's all it takes to spook the whole bunch and you will see the whole herd reverse directions and escape from your attemps to corral them.
I believe that these numbers have all been doctored to show an increase over last years figures. All it takes is a misplaced decimal. It's theocratic warfare and anything is possible and required to keep the sheep from escaping the KH. A KH of 200 would have to drop down to 50 before a lot of JW's would finally admit they were being duped by bogus numbers from Brooklyn, NY- they merge KH's to keep JW's from getting wise to their deceit.
Thanks for that Neo, interesting figures.
I see one or two jw apologists have tried to put a positive spin on them, but I have news for you boys - we aren't fooled. A friend of mine who is fading was telling me about his wife's verdict on their ca a feww weeks ago - attendance down by around 30%, and only 4
blackmail victimsbaptismal candidates, the oldest of whom was just turned 13, kids of jws in other words.
You don't have to be an apologist to see that a 1.9% increase is just that an increase. The title of this thread is misleading. What I see are a bunch of people who try to spin a positive into a negative. Most are saying how they count bible studies or hours or whatever, in other words making excuses.
As for your example of your fading friend it just goes to prove how much numbers and attendance differ in between places. My mothers congregation is ready to divide again and form another congregation due to the increase in publishers.
The only time when I would be happy is when we finally see 0% increase or an actual decrease in their yearly numbers.
Looking at a Watch Tower Corporation published yearly report is much more like looking at a secular business's sales report than looking at a religion's membership accounting. Remember the Watch Tower Society started as only a book printing business and later it added a pastoring service, then a paid marketing division, then a recompensated marketing division, then a new member recruiting element, and lastly the current literature giveaway program.
Now a congregation has the role an individual Witness used to have. Think about it.
It's still all related to the printing and distribution of books and literature produced by the original printing company and the report is still a printing company's progress report minus a financial accounting.
All we ever see is the published self report of the evolution of a secular printing business in the business of staying in business. It's interesting, but worthless.
Serious evaluation always needs to be done objectively and independent of the reports published by the subject business when that business has a policy of non-disclosure. An independently audited financial report would be an objective evaluation tool. Missing that, the only tools left are observation and investigation.
If I'd write an abstract report of the Jehovah's Witness movement today, I'd say the strength is at the grass roots level. The lower level Jehovah's Witnesses account for the strength and the good management. The corporate level Jehovah's Witnesses micro-manage and sabotage the congregations while they under-manage the upper levels. The upper levels are now bureaucracy bound. They're stuck in little circles.
The promotions we see are the factions at war.
Some other numbers for 2006:
Baptized - 248,327 (0.28% increase)
Yes and I'll bet that about 200,000 of these are children under the age of 18 or those in Third World Countries. For all the hundreds of millions of hours that Witnesses spend in donut shops "preaching", these figures are truly pathetic.
Bible studies - 6,286,618 (3.7% increase)
Once again, the majority of these numbers are probably the parents reading a portion of "My Book of Bible Stories" to their kids....not only that, but the CO told us about 6 or 7 years ago, that you can stand at the door, read 2 or 3 paragraphs out of a book to the householder and as long as you're there for 15 mintues he said "..you've just had a bible study and the person doesn't even know it!"
Memorial - 16,675,113 (1.8% increase)
This just indicates that there are over 10,000,000 people who apparently have no desire to join the WTS. Not a good sign.
(I don't have # of Memorial partakers, nor stats by country.)
Probably still around 8,000.
All in all, these stats are not very encouraging for the WTS. When you consider the number of meetings everyone must attend, the countless hours it takes to write the literature, print it, bind it, ship it out and distribute it, and the fact that they probably spent over a billion hours last year trying to convert people, a 1.9% increase is an embarassment, considering that most of those baptized are kids raised as Dubs, not converts.
Of course, when they read these stats, they'll either:
Does the report show how much money the Watchtower raked in compared to last years numbers? They always show how much money was spent for the worldwide work.
Blueblades
Some other numbers for 2006:
Baptized - 248,327 (0.28% increase)Yes and I'll bet that about 200,000 of these are children under the age of 18 or those in Third World Countries. For all the hundreds of millions of hours that Witnesses spend
in donut shops"preaching", these figures are truly pathetic.Bible studies - 6,286,618 (3.7% increase)Once again, the majority of these numbers are probably the parents reading a portion of "My Book of Bible Stories" to their kids....not only that, but the CO told us about 6 or 7 years ago, that you can stand at the door, read 2 or 3 paragraphs out of a book to the householder and as long as you're there for 15 mintues he said "..you've just had a bible study and the person doesn't even know it!"
In my opinion it doesn't matter how they got those numbers. Increase is an increase no matter how much spin you want to put on it. I bet its the same way with anything else, you were born a catholic, guess what you will count as a catholic. So of course kids are going to be counted, that's a no brainer.
We all know that the wts will spin this into a good thing and milk it. Even if it goes to negative or no increase I can bet that the WTS will spin it to make it look like the decrease in numbers is due to them being so closes to the end.
No matter what its a no win situation with people in a cult. If one thing happens then its because Jehovah wanted it, if the opposite happens its also because Jehovah let it happen. That's basically the jws way of thinking.
