by onacruse 50 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
I think I do what I do for this life. If it does me any good in a next life-great. I don't believe I have condemned myself for any future existance.
The way I feel today, I could be finding out before the rest of you all. . .i'm off to dr. in a few minutes.
For me, how we behave in this life is of the utmost importance given that it is the only brief sliver of light we get in an eternity of darkness, rather than being a preamble to a completely different and infinitely longer life.
LOL. That's a good one, derek.
Warlock
well, there is no life after death, so if you are only being a good person or upholding your responsibilities in order to get "paid" after you die, then you are wasting your time. loving others should be a reward in itself. and indeed it is.
Oddeye - How do you know that there is no life after death?
The logical consequence would be that I should get absolutely every little piece of self-gratification I can get before I die. Forget the eulogies, forget my kids, forget my lasting impression upon the entire human race for milleniums to come...it's all just a pile of stinking manure if I'm dead, and never to be again.
I don`t think you have a choice... There are basically two kinds of people in this world: People that have a conscience, and people that don`t have a conscience. If you don`t have a conscience, if you have a severe personality disorder, like psychopathy or extreme narcissism, then you can indulge in self-gratification all your life, and die a happy man. But if you are normal, if you do have the capacity to feel guilt, shame, etc, then you have no choice: You have to follow certain absolute ethical standards, cause if you don`t, you will end up feeling like crap, and on your deathbed, you will feel that you have failed in life (which must be the most horrible feeling). (and im not talking about biblical rules, but what we all know is right, such as "abstain from" rape, murder, adultery, violence etc). So I don`t think you have a choice in the matter. Hope that makes it easier for you...
onacruse: Great topic by the way, just really great. I want to mention something no one else has, unless I didn't read everything. You are asking for some kind of reason for acting proper. The reason you do it is because society has made it difficult to act bad, so it's easy to do it the "right" way -- but why morally? What is the point? Maybe, if there is no God or afterlife this is the only life we have right? Then, in that case, it should be our desire -- no, our obligation to act right. If there is no afterlife then it is our responsibility to build THIS society into one that is not full of terrible things for the sake of our children and their children. By acting "right" you contribute to a greater cause : the betterment of future generations. Imagine if EVERYONE who didn't "act right" did "act right" or at least taught their children to a little better. Building a better future, a complete, relatively error free future, is no more impossible than an afterlife. If we could all teach our children, as a human culture, to put away violence (which again isn't anymore implausible than God saving us) it would be a much better place. Acting right isn't about yourself -- it's about your children. It's about love. Love for the future and what could be.
So why do I insist on continuing to behave as if I do expect to live after I die?
Does a brief personal life automatically equate to rampant self-gratification? I'm rebuilding my personal philosophy too. Regardless of my final destination, I feel a personal responsibility to the planet, to humanity. There is a universal quality to certain principles, such as loving others, showing reverence for life. If I consider that every one of my actions as having an infinite ripple across time, across space, they take on greater significance, not less.
Also, I want to wrap the warp and woof of what I've learned in to the next generation. Perhaps like the Jewish worldview, live eternally through my fruit.
I think that the afterlife belief doesn't change the way we act (I'm not certain the conscious mind of most can think very far into the future anyway - the afterlife is as abstract a concept as thinking about moving house in ten years time - hard to think about for long.)
An oft quoted LDS scripture states that 'wickedness never was happiness'. Living life has costs and consequences and it seems that living selfishly has been proven by experience to generally discourage happiness (the selfish western lifestylewe pursue now alienates us from neighbour and nature, we cram our prognitors out of view and palm the young out to strangers - our society isn't build on long term closeness or satisfaction.)
Those who are wise live to harm no one and provide service for many - the essence of all religion.
So where does that leave us? Leave me?
Take a sheet of paper and draw a line down the middle. Above the left-hand column, write "There's an Afterlife." Above the right-hand column, write "There's NO Afterlife."
OK, now take ten minutes to write how you could picture living your life in each of those scenarios. I think you'll find the results to be both surprising and comforting.
Narkissos
You have hit the nail right on the head! According to A Course in Miracles, there is only one of us here. Everyone should go back and read your post. Very insightful!
