If there is no life after death (page 2)

SWALKER

and shot anyone that pisses me off, even on a whim

onacruse...THERE IS LIFE AFTER DEATH!!! Everyone here knows that...I can't imagine why they aren't telling you the truth....

Swalker

onacruse

Shelly,

You're making my point exactly (even though I'd disagree with you about OJ--he's doing very well for himself, insofar as all the news reports I've seen about him).

The reason we/I behave (or refrain from behaving) is not because of some fear of after-life punishment, but because of immediate gratifications...e.g. it's much easier for me to warm my house because I pay my electric bill because I earn my money because I perform my job because my job is needed by someone else because they need what my conforming behavior provides because the government of my community establishes a fair trade-value for my services which compensates me with "legal" tender which enables me to pay my bills which makes it easier to warm my house.

In that grand scheme of things, life after death has nothing to do with me...just my mediocre little daily necessities...rather like our dog, who jumps and thrills with excitement each morning and evening when we give him the same old food, col out of the can, like it's a brand new thing.

There's no logic to it, other than simple survival.

onacruse

Do you think all those that don't believe in an afterlife live the way you describe?

No, I don't. I'm not talking about why "most" people live. I'm talking about the logic of why we live the way we live. Which leads to:

Or do you believe that most people secretly harbor a belief in an afterlife?

Yes, I do think that.

I think that about myself.

I find it very hard to imagine that I, as a human being, with nothing more (or less) than the capacity to print this message on a machine, a machine which didn't exist even 30 years ago, can now find myself reduced to just the atoms of my molecules, should I die at this instant.

hillary_step

Craig,

Forget my friends, my wife, and any sense of pity for the little-old-lady-down-the-street who I just robbed of her life savings by cutting a hard business deal on her property...anything that lines my pockets with mountains of cold hard cash that gets me drugs and guns and a dozen beachfront properties where I can have sex with as many women and men as I want, any way I want, any time I want...and shot anyone that pisses me off, even on a whim, and just buy off the cops--who themselves are going to die.

I am sure that I can sense a tone of wishful thinking in these comments.

HS

onacruse

I am sure that I can sense a tone of wishful thinking in these comments.

Yep.

Expect to see me soon, on a new episode of "COPS."

I'll be the big, unshaven guy (Outlaw??!! LOL), driving a big ugly truck, running over helpless little animules.

Not because I should, but because I can.

robhic

Forget my friends, my wife, and any sense of pity for the little-old-lady-down-the-street who I just robbed of her life savings by cutting a hard business deal on her property...anything that lines my pockets with mountains of cold hard cash that gets me drugs and guns and a dozen beachfront properties where I can have sex with as many women and men as I want, any way I want, any time I want...and shot anyone that pisses me off, even on a whim, and just buy off the cops--who themselves are going to die.

I don't really have an answer why one would want to live like that, I suppose it's a personal choice. But, for the most part, you've described what it's like to live here in New Orleans!

People getting shot over a beer (!!!), 14 year olds stabbing a friend in an argument, people getting shot in broad daylight walking with their kids and other such insanity.

The politicians lining their pockets (did anyone miss our wonderful congressman William "Dollar Bill" Jefferson and his $90,000 stored in a freezer?) and the recovery efforts from hurricane Katrina hitting all sorts of roadblocks with the end result of the people not being able to fix their property because they have no money. (Who's got it...?)

When the poor cops do anything more serious than write a traffic ticket they get called on the carpet, people protest (for the life of me I think they just do it to do it, not because they have any idea why they're protesting...), the cops risk going to jail and if they DO manage to catch a bad guy, killer or whatever, some fool of a judge (probably on the take) lets the criminal go.

Why the cops even bother is beyond me. They can't do anything without risking offending someone (so what?), impeding someone's rights or causing some poor killer whose mother says he is such a good boy to become the victim. Why do these people act like this?

Maybe they don't know about the "golden rule." Perhaps some of our "ministers" can show them the way.

I guess people just do what they think they can get away with. Down here it's almost anything, but if you can live with yourself afterwards, well, I guess that's the $64,000 question...

kid-A

Based on 2002 US Prison Population statistics, it appears "belief" in an afterlife and/or god, has little or nothing to do with one's "moral" behaviour.

The overwhelming majority of criminal activity and convictions involves religious individuals, while non-religious or atheist/agnostics make up 1/5 of this group.

I think the counterpoint is that being religious, can in many ways provide a licence for immoral behaviour. Afterall, a catholic merely needs to confess and all is forgiven. For that

matter, any religious individual ultimately believes that there is a redemption being offered by their god of choice, regardless of what heinous activities they may engage in in the

"present" life, all can be forgiven on the deathbed, if a clergyman is present....

N.B. The statistic for incarcerated JWs: right in the middle of the curve at 0.7% ....LOL....

Catholic 29,267 31.432%
Protestant 26,162 28.097%
None/Atheist/Unknown 18,537 19.908%
Muslim 5,435 5.837%
American Indian 2,408 2.586%
Nation of Islam 1,734 1.862%
Rastafarian 1,485 1.595%
Jewish 1,325 1.423%
Church of Christ 1,303 1.399%
Pentecostal 1,093 1.174%
Moorish 1,066 1.145%
Buddhist 882 0.947%
Jehovah's Witnesses 665 0.714%Adventist 621 0.667%
Eastern Orthodox 375 0.403%
Latter-day Saints 298 0.320%
Scientology 190 0.204%
Hindu 119 0.128%
Santeria 117 0.126%
Sikh 14 0.015%
Baha'i 9 0.010%
ISKCON 7 0.008%
-------------------- ------ --------

Mulan

We were taught our entire lives as JW's that the "real life" is in the future so don't educate yourself, travel too much, allow your children to do sports, or to waste your time in pursuits other than field service, meetings and studying the publications. It's hard to get that programming out.

This is the real life, so we need to live well, do good and be happy. It doesn't mean trashing our life.

I know what you mean Craig. It's hard to come to terms that this is it. I tend to think that too, but a part of me really wants to believe there is more. My logical mind tells me "no". This is our life. Do the best we can. I just wish I had known that before I was 50 years old.

Narkissos

Hello Craig, nice to see you again

I would submit that "(individual) life after death," at least if understood literally, is just the poorest answer to a valid question. When we are unable to buy into any positive answer to the question "what shall I become?" it turns into another question, "what am I in the first place"? Then it can appear that every "one" of us is made up of countless "others" from time immemorial which built up the world, history, culture, language, we are a part of. They live in us right now and "we" already live in so many others, mostly unawares. The metaphor of eternal life, from this perspective, is not the opposite of individual death, it is the opposite of the illusion of a self-enclosed "I" -- which your problematic rests on.

funkyderek

onacruse:

This, of course, is not the person that I am, or that I ever will be. But there is no logic in why I should not be that kind of person, being as that I no longer am convinced of living after my death.

It's certainly true that belief in an afterlife causes many people to behave as if they were good people, and taking that belief away might cause them to show their true colours. But most godless people manage to live good and meaninful lives.

For me, how we behave in this life is of the utmost importance given that it is the only brief sliver of light we get in an eternity of darkness, rather than being a preamble to a completely different and infinitely longer life. It's not a rehearsal, it's not a test. This is it, our one chance to make our mark on the universe. Why would I want to waste that being a hoodlum?

So why do I insist on continuing to behave as if I do expect to live after I die?

Because we've evolved to behave that way.

If there is no life after death

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