Watchtower never took preaching work seriously!!

by proplog2 33 Replies latest jw friends

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  proplog2

  james_woods:

  They don't take it seriously because they hedge their bets. They don't really believe God will take care of them. They give lip service to the importance of the preaching work but they don't set up the structures that would make it possible for so many who would do more but just don't have the means. One of the structures would be communal arrangements sponsored by the Watchtower besides those at Bethel. How hard would it be to build a Kingdom Hall with a common kitchen and a bunk room that could sleep 10 to 20 people. They do it at branch homes. There is more than enough money to do something like that if they followed the principle of being content with sustenance and covering.

  How hard would it be for families to move out of their spacious ranch homes and invest in multitennant housing where 4 to 6 families could pool their resources. No one would be stopped from doing this. But there are no suggestions, examples, experiences, encouragement to do something extraordinary to carry on the door to door work.

  I'm not saying the door to door work is the best way. It certainly has generated publicity and new members. But as long as they believe the end is very near and that there is a shortage of harvest workers, and that human lives will be lost if people aren't contacted, shouldn't they be putting forth extraordinary efforts?

  The fact that they fall short on this hints to me that Jehovah isn't really interested that all men get saved and more likely that there is no Jehovah at all. Please remember this is being framed in the context of the claims made by JW's.

  You said that JW's take it more seriously than other religions. So what. If they believe they have the truth there should be a discernible difference. But it doesn't go far enough IF they really believe in their commission to save lives.
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  bobld

  The GB/FDS say they follow J.C. ex, of going door to door and it still is the most effective way of making disciples.They get their slave drivers (d.o.,c.o,elders) to constantly hammer the R&F that this is the most important work.Also they lay the guilt trip that your life depends on it.When you work with these (R&F) in service they could care less about making disciples.If they were serious they would be out there every day skip coffee breaks and you would see results.It's a joke,if someone is interested in a bible study they try a pass it off to someone else.Look,if I was in marketing and spent all this money on training,meeting.C.A.,D.C. and sad's.I would expect results.They (GB) push hard but they are wasting their time.Which is ok for people of the world.Many here have mentioned there are more effective ways of preaching and I agree.

  PS They like to use Jesus example of preaching yet they like to use modern conveniences ie computers,mp3,cars ,airplanes.Have you ever seen a GB come to a convention on a donkey.
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  JWdaughter

  James, I see what the OP meant. The WT/JW folks go on, ad nauseum about how important the preaching work is. . .but really don't have any provision to really support full time intense missionary work. Basically a bunch of dilletants who put in less work each month than many (for example) food bank volunteers put in one day of work. If it is SO damn important, why don't they have vast missionary efforts? Why NOT have something like the LDS-those guys put in more time in one month than some JWs do in a lifetime. And even if you don't like the message, they are helpful, nice and will mow your lawn if you ask them to! They can count their hours, they can count their converts. If the work is so important, the message is so important, they should have devised a more effective campaign to disseminate this life saving information. Frankly, it isn't working as if it is God's last ditch effort before armageddon! Which is isn't and therefore, I am not concerned about anything here but their credibility and honesty in saying that this is urgent! Lifesaving! Just so long as it doesn't interfere with the fresh donuts that always come out of the fryer at 10am. Or the Tuesday soup special at the local cafe. It is feel good theology/doctrine, but it isn't actually FELT. They enjoy the sense of self righteous superiority w/o having to make the real effort.

  I am GLAD for that though, as what they do is futile and I hate to see their lives more ruined than they already are. I don't WANT any of them to be miserable. I would LIKE all of them to find joy in life. I don't think it is found in passing out cheap literature to people who mostly accept it thinking it will get them off their doorstep.
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  thecarpenter

  If the Watchtower REALLY believed in the life saving nature of the witness work they would be on an emergency basis.

  I think you are going a little too extreme in your expectation to preach. Christians were given a commission to preach but it was left up to the individual as to how much they were to do it. People have families, jobs, etc... Jesus also said later on that the preachers would have to carry a coin purse latter on because of the inhospitality they would eventually find.

  The pioneer arrangement, missionary arrangement and other arrangements are different levels of public preaching that individuals can avail themselves to according to their circumstances. IMHO the witnesses have taken this commission to preach more seriously than other churches.

  If they took it seriously they would discourage people from spending money on luxuries, - cruises, vacation homes, luxury automobiles, . Everyone would REALLY be content with sustenance and covering.

  I think they do this all the time. As for being content with sustenance and covering, what compromises this is a individual choice.Christ wasn't setting up a little Nazi state.

  They never took it seriously.

  I think they are not as effective as they could be. They us only one primary method of mass media, the printed page ( and to a much lesser extent, the internet) . As IP_SEC mentioned, they have Radio, TV, greater internet use, ads in other magazines available to them, etc... but they don't really avail themselves to these other forms. (the media terms for this is called horizontal integration and symbiosis)
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  TheListener

  If they took the preaching seriously they'd:

  -Send everyone to a pioneer school at least once in their dub career

  -wouldn't make the new publications secret until the DC, but get them to the friends as quickly as possible

  -wouldn't make a special "pioneer book" just for pioneers but share that information with everyone (yes, I have the book and know it doesn't contain anything new or interesting but everyone could use it)

  -they wouldn't have special pioneer meetings but incorpate that into a special talk or meeting during the CO visit.

  Just some thoughts.
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  blondie

  The WTS has compared to "preaching" work to at least 2 analogies:

  1) Warning people that a tornado is coming; going door to door. Imagine how quickly you would do that...does not compare to the pioneer stroll many JWs have?

  2) Looking for people in the rubble after an earthquake....

  3) Looking for your car/house keys

  Do JWs really think that people's lives are involved? Do they really care whether people die or not (remember they know somewhere in the back of their mind that this includes children) even forever.

  Do their lives depend on whether they even find one person or help one person become a JW? NO.

  JWs get everlasting life whether anyone listens to them or not.

  There was a time that pioneers supported themselves from the profit they made from "placing" WT publications. Also they received a small allowance only if they met their quota (still true of special pioneers). What if JWs only received everlasting life if they placed literature regularly and brought in at least one person every year? Do you think there would be a little for energy in the d2d?

  Blondie
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  james_woods

  Blondie specifically (and PropLog and everyone): Blondie wrote -

  There was a time that pioneers supported themselves from the profit they made from "placing" WT publications. Also they received a small allowance only if they met their quota (still true of special pioneers). What if JWs only received everlasting life if they placed literature regularly and brought in at least one person every year? Do you think there would be a little for energy in the d2d?

  Honestly, no, I don't think these extreme measures would improve the energy in the d2d. I think it would in fact drastically reduce it on practical grounds. These people are families who have to support the WTS, not the other way around.

  For all of their many faults, the WTS organization has past proved to be a shrewd bunch of people manipulators. I think they used to have an almost sixth-sense of exactly how much they could get out of their slaves. I believe that a lot of the control freaking now is coming about because they see the work dropping, and they are just about out of cards to play to get it jump started again. The classics like setting a date, and manipulating a lot of the young men to "pioneer" out of fear of the draft are moot for the foreseable future - so we are left with stuff like the near to the end speeches, and the increasing micromanagement.

  I don't have any problem with the premise that they don't take the real purpose of the work seriously (i.e., to make disciples). It is a miserable failure in that regard. I think they know full well that this work is to sell magazines (if only to the publishers themselves) and to control the lives of the publishers to the maximum humanly possible. I think they are deadly serious about it in that regard, and are pushing their slaves as hard as they know how.

  It is my contention that such stuff as total poverty vows, living in bunk beds in the back of the Kingdom Hall, etc. are neither sustainable by the JW population, historical in any sense, nor would they be effective in gaining recruits or making an effective message. Face it; the JWs already look weird enough the way they are now! And what person in their right mind could possible even consider joining such a draconian thing.

  Anyway, they have already fulfilled Matthew 24 in our own time in their own special way!!!
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  blondie

  james, you are probably right...I was just throwing out what worked in the past. But then those people felt the were going to heaven soon within a couple of years; they were not envisioning "preaching" for 50 years. That is why JWs function better with the core belief that the end is next year.

  Actually, it points to the what I see is motive; most JWs are lured in by the promise of personal everlasting life and perhaps seeing friends and family resurrected. Few become JWs because they care about strangers and want to spend the rest of the life helping people.

  Blondie
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  proplog2

  James

  The question here is not the worlds perception of JW's. But the dedication of JW's to their stated goals and purposed.

  Jesus didn't give a damn what people thought about him. He said it would be almost impossible for a rich person to get into the kingdom of heaven.

  Wide is the path to destruction. Narrow the way to life. The rich young ruler was discouraged because he had many possesions. JW's could add tons of members if they eliminated any of their "fences".

  Since Jesus preached and practiced self-sacrifice it is strange that JW's have never developed organization procedures for making the best use of man power and resources. Current themes of self-sacrifice could easily be elaborated:

  Brother Bright Student turned down his fully paid scholarship to MIT to pioneer.

  Brother Businessman sold his prosperous business and now works part time as a consultant to the new owner to pioneer.

  Sister Menopause had an empty nest so she decided to pioneer.

  Sister Talented Singer gave up a career in music to pioneer.

  But when have they said:

  We have a new program for those who want to expand their service:

  Groups of six families have sold their 4 bedroom homes and purchased a six-family apartment building. They all live together and share baby-sitting and food purchases so that they all can live off of part-time income and pioneer. We want to encourage this brothers and sisters. For this reason we have published a handbook of guidelines that will help you do this successfully. In the coming months we would like to see service communities of this sort all over the world. What a wonderful way for the Master of the Harvest to arrange for more workers in the field. (loud applause?)........

  I am suggesting something more than the fact that JW's have not been very innovative in creating facilitative structures. I am saying that they don't have the help of God nor are they REALLY willing to rely on Jehovah to provide. After 120 years of this you would think they would be able to be a little more creative.

  Jehovah's Witnesses have shown that they will do anything they are told.

  So here is the real question. If JW's are exemplary in their zeal compared to other religions, then doesn't that mean that Jehovah has been unable to keep the fire going that Jesus started? "Luke 12:49 I came to start a fire on the earth"

  Apparently the stones aren't speaking out either. Conclusion: there is NO evidence for a God who cares about saving as many lives as possible.
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  proplog2

  Blondie:

  Thanks for your input. Good points. There is definitely a disconnect between words and deeds.