Do you think that "JW's" will get rid of the "Paradise earth" doctrine?

by booker-t 35 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  M.J.

  The Society could get rid of the soul sleep doctrine pretty easy me thinks. They could just say at death the spirit of the person goes to heaven and stays there until the resurrection and then they will return to earth and join up with a perfect replica recreated body and pet lions and pick fruit.

  Gosh, then they'd essentially be just like a bunch of other "mainstream" Christian groups in this belief.

  Actually, I think that they'll cling to their earth class/heaven class thing. Their main argument being that the heavenly kings and preists will need an earth class to rule over.
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  diamondblue1974

  The January 1, 2036 Watchtower will contain a study article explaining the appropriate way to view the thousands who have abandoned Jehovah's organization in the previous year: Paragraph 20. It is unwise to associate with all those who have stumbled due to "new light" regarding the paradise earth. Such ones have shown that their motives for serving our God were selfish. They fail to appreciate that though some amongst Jehovah's people at one time entertained the hope of living forever in a paradise earth, a more spiritual perspective reveals that the Paradise is amongst us in the form of the bounteous spiritual provisions of the slave class. Due to their fleshly view of things, many such ones have become bitter because their expectations were not realized as they would have liked. Some made great sacrifices to promote their hope of enjoying physical healing and blessings in the paradise. Yet others were negligent with regards to planning for their financial security later in life, and caused themselves and others burdens due to their lack of foresight. They now resent the situation they find themselves in. Such ones do well to ask themselves,"Did I not do so willingly? Was I forced to do as I did?" Of course not! Their own strict manner of interpreting the well-intentioned counsel of the slave class, now numbering into the tens of thousands, is where the real fault lies. All who continue to appreciate the channel that Jehovah has used to feed his servants here on earth for the last 156 years have accepted the new understanding with great rejoicing. One excellent way they show their loyal support for true worship is by sending the appropriate tithe to the slave class. New and exciting ways to support the Kingdom with our valuable things will be considered in the next article.

  Frightening prospect actually. I remember a talk from a CO asking whether we would serve Jehovah even if he didnt offer such 'bounteous' blessings and hope for the future - I remember thinking that I probably wouldnt and then feeling guilty for proving Satan to be correct when he allegedly accused people of only worshipping big J for personal benefit. That didnt last long, it was shortly after that the 1914 generation shift took place and I faded. The best move I ever made! Gary
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  AK - Jeff

  I don't seen changing. Most of what has changed in the last 20 years have really only been "adjustments" and "tweakings" of their teachings.

  Blondie - though I generally agree with your thoughts here - I must make kind exception in this case.

  I could not in any conceivable manner call the change in understanding of 'this generation' or 'the 1914 generation' or 'the 1935 sealing of the annointed' just 'tweaking' of doctrine. These were major flip-flops, that caused in retrospect, many otherwise zombie-like Jw's to wake from spiritual slumber and get out of the organization.

  These changes weakened the 'cornerstone' doctrine of 1914. They have set the stage IMO for potential restructuring of both 1914 and 1919 in due time. I suspect that to avoid 'laughingstock' status these have occured, as likely some change in the others will, especially when 2014 rolls around.

  Additionally, timbers have been weakened in the 'blood' doctrine as well.

  But - like you, I can't see the 'paradise earth' falling off the platform anytime in the foreseeable future, or they would likely have a WWCoG type split. The rest of these things, even significant ones, do generally get ignored by the blind r&f.

  Jeff
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  Sunspot

  Oh well.....AK JEFF gave my answer before I got here! (And did it MUCH better cuz HE knows how to put the graphics up, haha!)

  But NO....without this "hook", and the "wouldn't YOU like to live THERE", the WTS has nothing to offer....and I think the moldy carrot will be their ace in the hole for as long as they are in existence.
• 

  AK - Jeff

  Oh well.....AK JEFF gave my answer before I got here! (And did it MUCH better cuz HE knows how to put the graphics up, haha!)

  So sorry, my dear Sunspot. Didn't wish to steal your thunder.

  This is the real paradise isn't anyway? This tiger gets along just fine with Sunspot the teddy-mouse.

  Jeff
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  under_believer

  I have to throw in with Blondie. Honestly the recent changes are just tweaks. When Witnesses think about what they believe in, they really don't dwell on or think about 1914, "this generation," the two classes of worshipers, chronology, two witnesses, the kings of the north and south, etc. They think:
  
  Paradise Any Day Now, No Hell, No Trinity.
  
  No matter how important it seems to the ex-JW community, to the average self-absorbed, ignorant Witness, none of those tweaks matter because they didn't really understand the doctrine behind them in the first place and they aren't key to why they are Witnesses anyways. I have seen Book Study conductors gloss over chronology- and prophecy fulfillment-related paragraphs so many, many times... They just want their perfect paradise. If they were Christians before becoming JW's, they are happy they don't have to worry about Hell anymore. And even the Trinity doctrine isn't that important compared to the other two--it's just a means of pointing at other religions and laughing at them.
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  blondie

  No matter how major it may seem, Jeff, it is still an "adjustment" of an existing doctrine, in one case that the "generation" living at the beginning of the time of the end would still be alive for the end; instead of the generation starting with people who were alive in 1914, it is now the lifetime of any person alive in 1914 up to and including people born today. Again, the WTS has not abandoned the idea that only a small group will be going to heaven, just that people in that group could still be being selected today.

  A total change would be saying that people will burn in hell forever and ever or that God really is three persons in one God or however the trinity is defined by certain individuals and groups.

  Blondie
• 

  OnTheWayOut

  I could not in any conceivable manner call the change in understanding of 'this generation' or 'the 1914 generation' or 'the 1935
  sealing of the annointed' just 'tweaking' of doctrine . These were major flip-flops

  Jeff and Blondie,
  You are both right. They cannot just tweak the 1914 generation anymore. First they said adults in 1914 would not
  pass away, then they tweaked to say people who understood what was going on would not pass away, bringing it
  down to adolescents, finally they tweaked it to babies born by 1914 would not pass away.

  Once they exhausted the tweaking possibilities, they had to abandon this teaching someway.

  The average "hope to live on Paradise-earth" Joe Publisher will not see the importance of the 1935 swinging door.
  He will see it as a tweaking. They are in the process of abandoning that belief, but trying to keep the publishers from
  noticing. For the most part, they will succeed.

  They have tweaked and tweaked the Paradise. Stating that we are in a spiritual paradise so that we forget how the
  physical one hasn't arrived yet. Telling us the anointed might stick around and might not. Saying that our dead loved
  ones can come to paradise even if they weren't JW, because armageddon didn't arrive yet, meaning they weren't judged
  yet. That keeps our hopes up. We can only see them if we make it to paradise.

  They are tweaking paradise out of the constant barrage of literature. It's there, but not in our faces. They want
  everyone to focus on Loyalty to the Faithful Slave and their Governing Body. Paradise doctrine is for newcomers. The
  rest of you need indoctrination lessons on obedience. Don't doubt, don't communicate with apostate relatives, just
  do as we say.
• 

  Ozner

  This was the first I thought about when I read the may 1, 2007 QFR. It can be also like this: maybe armagedon has taken place! Invissible, and are we now living in the 1000 years behind.
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  AK - Jeff

  OTWO -

  Agreed. I think you put a finer point on that.

  The 'double doctrine' approach will solidify and begin a new approach to keeping the 'loyal' in the cult, IMO, with the launch of the separate WT mags in 2008.

  They will then be able to concentrate on holding the enculted within, while a slick Paradise Oriented Outside Plan [POOP] is in place with the Public Watchtower.

  Jeff