Conversation with a JW (page 5)

TheKings

i hope you realize that proving another religious teaching unfactual is merely a distraction from the rafter in thine own eye... two wrongs don't make a right.

Actually, I'm not that mislead. Religion does serve a purpose in my opinion. Can you imagine some of these nutbags without the constraints of religion? Sure, man has a certain moral code that dwells within him, but where do you think it would be if religion never existed? I'm thinking Mad Max beyond Thunderdome meets Escape from New York. You can appreciate living in a civilized society; a civilized society based on religion (In God we trust).

found-my-way

Can you imagine some of these nutbags without the constraints of religion?

This sentence speaks volumes.

nutbags - do you mean scrotums?

so you are stating that religion is constraining?

Main Entry:	constraint
Part of Speech:	noun 1
Definition:	force
Synonyms:	coercion, compulsion, driving, duress, force, goad, hang-up, impelling, impulsion, jones, monkey, motive, necessity, no-no*, pressure, repression, spring, spur, suppression, violence

yes all of the above words aptly apply to fanatical dogmatic religions.

Who are you?

Actually, I'm not that mislead. Religion does serve a purpose in my opinion. Can you imagine some of these nutbags without the constraints of religion? Sure, man has a certain moral code that dwells within him, but where do you think it would be if religion never existed? I'm thinking Mad Max beyond Thunderdome meets Escape from New York. You can appreciate living in a civilized society; a civilized society based on religion (In God we trust).

I'm sure that you know that in prison the lowest of the low are considered pedophiles and most times pedophiles have to be seperated from the general prison population for their own safety. Moral codes exist in every segment of society.

Clam

I'm a JW and I'm a free thinker.

Good for you. Have you read Crisis of Conscience by Raymond Franz by any chance?

Clam

By the way what's with the avatar? Looks like Hitler and someone. Is it Ribbentrop or Rutherford?

TheKings

religion, like everything in life, is a mixed bag. it's a force for good for some people, and others don't need it to live happily. will you not agree, Beroean, that in the name of religion great evils have been commited. This is where you will probably assume that JW's are superior, but doctrine has claimed lives in JW-land. this is not acceptable.

found-my-way

I'm thinking Mad Max beyond Thunderdome meets Escape from New York. You can appreciate living in a civilized society; a civilized society based on religion (In God we trust).

There are people without a religion and they get along just fine with the rest of the world.

There are civilizations that are non-christian, they are pagan, and they have a moral code of conduct.

religions do not keep people in order, people are by nature orderly and usually have a herichy system in place no matter what part of the world you look in. .the most bloodiest of centuries and the darkest of ages were the ones lead by ''christian'' religions. If you think the holy crusades were civilized and non-chaotic, then what is your definition of civilized?

Warlock

The Bible is the authority. All Christian religions are held to the standard of the Bible. I base my opinions solely on that. Nothing else.

BEROEAN,

Amen to that. That's why I'm now inactive.

Warlock

BizzyBee

Beroean,

I suppose we should define terms before disagreeing, (but that gets so tedious!)

Briefly, when you said

I'm a JW and I'm a free thinker.

I was gob-smacked by the illogic of that assertion. My skepticism is based on the definition of both those positions. (Nearly) everyone on this board knows intimately what it means to be a JW. But a freethinker is defined as follows:

Freethought is a philosophical viewpoint that holds that beliefs should be formed on the basis of science and logical principles and not be comprised by authority, tradition, or any other dogma. The cognitive application of freethought is known as freethinking, and practitioners of freethought are known as freethinkers.

Fre ethought holds that individuals should neither accept nor reject ideas proposed as truth without recourse to knowledge and reason. Thus, freethinkers strive to build their beliefs on the basis of facts, scientific inquiry, and logical principles, independent of the factual/logical fallacies and intellectually limiting effects of authority, cognitive bias, conventional wisdom, popular culture, prejudice, sectarianism, tradition, urban legend, and all other dogmatic or otherwise fallacious principles. When applied to religion, the philosophy of freethought holds that, given presently-known facts, established scientific theories, and logical principles, there is insufficient evidence to support the existence of supernatural phenomena.

A line from "Clifford's Credo" by the 19th Century British mathematician and philosopher William Kingdon Clifford perhaps best describes the premise of freethought: "It is wrong always, everywhere, and for anyone, to believe anything upon insufficient evidence." Since many laws, doctrines, and popular beliefs are based on dogmas, freethinkers' opinions are often at odds with commonly-established views.

So, Beroean, those two points of view - JW and freethought - could not be more diametrically opposed. You cannot genuinely be a JW and genuinely be a free thinker - they are polar opposites!

TheKings

explain how false prophecy is "unimportant"... false prophecy in a religion that claims utmost superiority as the mouthpiece of God should be a red flag to anyone who isn't lobotomized. Divisions? try an attempt at education. would you accuse jesus of causing divisions when he denounced the pharisees just because it rocked the boat? No, because he was right...just like it is absolutely right to name the watchtower bible and tract society a false prophet.

Conversation with a JW

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