I REALLY DON'T CARE...............................

by Warlock 111 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

Warlock

Hi Warlock! (thats all I have to say)
Hi Butt.
Any hauntings lately?
Warlock
Stealth453

I don't believe in the existence of god, and I could care less who agrees with me.
For the record.
Warlock

I don't believe in the existence of god, and I could care less who agrees with me.
For the record.
I never would have known, since you don't go "thread-to-thread" preaching it. Brief and to the point. I can and do respect that. Warlock
RAF

FunkyD.
Now while you think it's a fallacy I just thinks it's reasonable to not push anything further as fact but just claming an opinion...
Nevertheless, it is a fallacy to think that just because there are two possibilities, both are equally likely. They may be, as in the coin-flipping example, or they may not as in the lottery-ticket example.
I didn’t say that they have to be equally likely, I’ve just said that I think it’s reasonable to not push anything further than that as a fact but just claming an opinion (and that’s not a fallacy) that when the coin-flipping example is not a good example contextally.
I guess you are talking for your own experience, what do you know about mine?
Yes, I am talking about my own experience and deliberate attempts to find evidence. I have found none. Other people often claim to have evidence but either it doesn't satisfy my standards or they simply refuse to share it.
I’ve share it more than once and there are people who never got any experiences in the matter who feels the right to state that what we have experiences is all something else (but then they have to go into so much whatever improbable possibilities to get there that it becomes irritating, they'll never end even and they have to put is as a succession of very weird coincidences and effects at the same time - so PFFFFFFFFFF) … it doesn’t give me any envy to want to share since I don’t even think that is needy to share … I just feel (I say I feel) that if we don’t have the same experience, it’s because we don’t have to. But I’m rational, and I know what it is all about I'm not trying to believe something unbelievable - it's just thing which happened that I can't explain with rational standards (because of it's paranormal nature) … it just leaded me to some conclusions.

Why do you think I do believe? Why do you think I'm not even going to get into details about that (I'll answer this one) because you won't believe me (and I can understand why) to what looks like reaching virtually zero evidence to you ... is closed 99 % for me (it's just that I don't know about the details and I won't push any possible answer as THE ANSWER on anybody).
It seems that you are claiming you do have evidence but you are unwilling to share it. I don't know why you think I wouldn't believe you. I'm a rational person and believe what the available evidence compels me to believe. If your evidence is truly compelling, I will believe. Perhaps our standards of evidence differ. If so, is mine too high, or is yours too low? How could we find out?
Available evidence for someone like you (sceptical-rational) would be to experience it yourself (like me, sceptical-rational but I went there so …) otherwise you’ll try to find any specific reasons to not believe ... been there (read my answer above) but guess why I haven’t been convince by those possibilities? ... Therefore I don’t see why I should expose myself to that on a board like this … So you want this point here you’ve got it … Again I have nothing to prove to make people think that I’m right in any matter … I mean If I talked about it, it was not as a proof for others to believe me but for other to get the point about my reasons (not the same purpose).
It's similar to the proposition that the lottery ticket I am holding is a jackpot winner. Now it may be that my estimation of the probabilities is way off, and that's certainly something we can debate, but my point is that it's wrong to automatically give equal weight to the two propositions.
Yeah like the kind of I know better answers in probalities I would get in exposing my experience ... That's when this comparision becomes fallacious (contextually) ... You put like a view what I know being an experience which lead me to another conclusion than yours so maybe now you can understand how this becomes a fallacious argument contextually (I'm not talking about anything like lotery to lead to a conclusion here).

Off course it's maybe the way you deal with it and wich persuade yourself (so it doesn't seems fallaciou to you) but if you get a closer look at the question itsefl it doesn't change my experience (my 1+1) wich is not the same as yours obviously
No, our experiences are different but there can be only one correct answer. If you believe you have information relevant to the debate, then please present it. Claiming to have evidence but not sharing it is functionally equivalent to having no evidence at all.
Who have no evidence at all? (back to experience matter).
Don't get me wrong ... My point here is: Forget about saying that you know better, (but that you have an opinion related to your own experience) ... Just as I can't say more than that ... I'm the first to be septical about anything paranormal - but my experience tells me to not dissmiss everything ... when yours can't lead you to that.
funkyderek

RAF:
The argument is becoming quite nuanced and unfortunately I'm not sure I understand what you're saying well enough to make it worthwhile replying in detail. I think we may both be missing out on the finer points of each other's argument. Et votre anglais est vraiment mieux que mon francais, et je sais que je peux pas m'exprimer assez bien en francais.
But I still want to reply to one part, which I think is the crux of the matter.
but my experience tells me to not dissmiss everything ... when yours can't lead you to that.
There are lots of things I have no experience of that I completely and utterly believe in - because other people have been able to provide convincing evidence. Unfortunately, the evidence that I have encountered regarding the existence of gods has never been convincing enough. Many people claim to have had personal experiences that have left no discernible trace. Great for them, but if I have no way to tell whether someone really had such an experience or just thinks they did (or even pretends to), then I have to put that evidence to one side, and only use whatever is left.
Using only the evidence I have been able to find, I see no reason to believe in a god. I just think that something as big and important as a god should leave some confirmation of his existence other than unverifiable anecdotes. If you have it, show it to me. If not, then sorry but it's too important an issue for me to take your word for it.
hillary_step

Seeker,
If you go to my post at the top of page 3, RAF, this is what I wrote: "NO one can say for sure whether god does or does not exist, we all agree to that at the moment - it's just that the TOTAL LACK of evidence makes it reasonable to assume there is no god. At some point a god may decide to reveal itsself. Until then it's a moot point."
Very succintly put, thank you. You carry on displaying such unassailable logic and you may be presented with the 'Medal For Arrogance' normally given to a person on this Board when the opposing debater fails to meet the grade required by the critical thinker, throws a tantrum and pukes on you digitally.
Did you not read that before you posted?
In my opinion, this is the single most common reason as to why debates on this Board commonly descend into chaos. Other reasons? Cherrypicking comments, ignoring main points, a lack of critical thinking, oversensitivity, a rush to post, a rush to judgment, these are all reasons as to why reaching intellectual consensus on such issues is seldom if ever possible.
HS
hillary_step

RAF,
You put like a view what I know being an experience which lead me to another conclusion than yours so maybe now you can understand how this becomes a fallacious argument contextually
The problem with personal experience in these matters is that our religious experiences are dependant on our own interpretation of what is undoubtedly a chemical experience. Personal experience therefore must always bow to universal evidence.
An example. Clinical measurements, illustrative and repeatable have been made of sections of the brain of persons undergoing a Christian 'experience' in which Christ is said to 'come into' a persons heart. The same measurements were made of Voodo priests and India Fakirs undergoing their own religious experiences. The measurements of brain patterns are identical, the crossection illustration of the brain in action are identical, the conclusions are identical.
The religious experience is chemical and internal, not external.
Best regards - HS
RAF

Funky Dereck
Sorry for my english (what can I say)
Now if you want to know about your french (at least the sentence you've wrote) ... well there is not a single word misspelled in it ... ask outnfree BTW ... for the little story ... Something like more than a week ago she sent me something like 20 lignes in french there was not a single error in them ... Not one !!! ... Wow ...
Anyway it's cool to read some stuff in French on here
ok back to the subject
Using only the evidence I have been able to find, I see no reason to believe in a god. I just think that something as big and important as a god should leave some confirmation of his existence other than unverifiable anecdotes. If you have it, show it to me. If not, then sorry but it's too important an issue for me to take your word for it.
I understand exactly what you mean and of course you don't have to take my word for it ... (I know that it would be too much to ask more over in this matter).
We may have a chance to meet one day, and maybe that day my sister will be there too ... if so, we'll tell you (not to convince you but to satisfy your eventual curiosity because since it's paranormal I'm not sure it can do anything but leave people perplex or need to rationalized it at any rate, to the point to become irationnal) ...
Anyway you have to understand that I do understand your point of view ... and your reasons to not believe.
RAF

HS
The problem with personal experience in these matters is that our religious experiences are dependant on our own interpretation of what is undoubtedly a chemical experience. Personal experience therefore must always bow to universal evidence.
Sorry to tell you that "undoubtedly" and "experience therefore must always bow to universal evidence" is fallacious here ... Paranormal is paranormal ... that's why it's called this way.
And please forget about me mixing religion and this matter ... still it does lead to specific conclusion about specific things.
Then (unless you've really read me) you have to realise that my spiritual view one the matter of God is not religious but conceptual.
Best regards ...
funkyderek

Warlock:
What I highlighted in my original post is the problem that you and Abaddon have. CONTROL.
And that's what you've continued to assert throughout the thread, virtually ignoring anything we had to say.
You hide it under the guise of "we just need to correct foolish belief and thought", just like a J.W. "Sir, your religion is misleading you. See.....right here...........read this scripture along with me".
Again, you're putting words in other people's mouths. Why do you do this instead of responding to the issues?
Insofar as my thinking my beliefs deserve respect, when did I say that? I don't care whether you respect them or not.
I should have realised. It even says so in big letters on the thread you started on the subject.
I guess you have failed at what you seem to think you can do. Read minds and interpret peoples life experiences.
Right back atcha.
Concerning alienating people, just so you know, I'm not an ass kisser.
I know that, and I'm sure by now you realise I'm not either. I simply meant that a discussion such as this one could be far more productive and enjoyable if you would adress the issues people actually raised instead of imputing nefarious motives to them. If you fail to do that you will drive those people away from the thread and never satisfy your curiosity (not that you care, of course).
Lastly, you and Abaddon have answered my questions..................perfectly. You two always do.
Of course. Is that perhaps because you had the answers all along and didn't learn anything from what either of us wrote?

I REALLY DON'T CARE...............................

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