Maybe they really are worried about the JIOR? (If anybody gets that, say so, so I won't look like a fool.)
WT monitoring JWD? Absolutely!
by fedorE 65 Replies latest jw friends
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under_believer
SBF and anyone else given to disbelieve this claim, nothing in there was even close to being exotic or out of the ordinary to the kind of monitoring that is performed at most major corporations these days (and the WTS qualifies as a major corporation.) Let's break the claims down, starting with a little bit of background information.
Every computer in the world is assigned an IP address when it connects to any network. This is simply a four-byte number specific to that computer. In many cases the IP address assigned to you by your Internet Service Provider when you connect to the Internet is completely unique to your house (or maybe even to the specific computer in your house depending on your setup.) Also in many cases IP addresses are blocked out geographically, so that a given IP address often will tell where the computer is, usually down to the city at the very least and sometimes down to the neighborhood or borough.
Also you should know that under normal web surfing conditions a website's server logs every single access to their website. Simon Green or any other webmaster can verify this for you. So while Simon couldn't look at your IP address and determine exactly who you are (though he could probably tell approximately where you live,) he could be subpoena'd to turn over the IP logs to the authorities and then they could subpoena your ISP to determine exactly who you are. Thankfully this kind of power is only available to governments and law enforcement agencies and not the WTS!
They have readers that scan what is going on from "IP Hidden" or "Dynamic IP" sources.
This is both trivial to accomplish and would be wise for them to do. As I mentioned above, each computer or organization connected to the internet has one or more IP addresses from which they access. Often an entire organization will run all their access through one IP address. Also, IP addresses are publically registered--you can do an ARIN search right now for "Watchtower" and find out that the WTS's assigned IP range is 208.74.140.0 - 208.74.143.255.
Now it's a given that they have people assigned to come on here and monitor. We KNOW they do this, we've had external proof and personal testimony, and even if we didn't it would be utterly foolish for them to ignore major anti-WTS sites. Now imagine if they did it from their own computers--Simon (and anyone else) would know that the WTS was reading their site, and would be able to announce to the users it was happening, or ban the accounts if they wanted to.
But there exist services--such as the TOR network (Google it) that allow you to surf from behind what's known as an anonymous proxy, which is a service that masks your IP address when you go to a website and makes you look like you are somewhere else. It is free and easy to use these services and someone with a tiny bit of computer knowledge could set it up. I use TOR myself from time to time.
Its an IP trace and system interrogation program. They plant "Land Mines" on forums and discussion boards that link to another site via their controlling site - "news article" or "Read this" - they then track the IP address and/ or plant a spyware cookie.
This is also trivial. I could make my own private IP log right now of everyone who visits this thread. How? There are a couple ways. I could put an picture in here, either a tiny one nobody would notice, or a big one on say the "post your picture" thread (this would be better as it would be less suspicious.) I would host that image from my own computer instead of from ImageShack or PhotoDump or whatever. Then the computer of each person who views it would have to access my own personal computer to get it. And each time that happened I would log the IP address.
This isn't something Simon could stop unless he banned all picture posting.
Another way would be for me to use the method listed above--post a link to some news story or YouTube or something, and make the link a redirect thru my web server. If you clicked it (and you would) your computer would very briefly access my server, and I could send you a cookie if your browser settings allow it (and they probably do) or again just log your IP address.
This is easy, basic, Web Hosting 101 stuff. I could whip up a solution to do this in a couple of hours, for free.
FYI all calls into and out of Bethel are recorded (including pay phones) - This is Salters, Paris, Mill Hill and Bittacy Hill, Patterson and Brooklyn - they use an Israeli system called COMVERSE for this.
I don't know why anyone would disbelieve this. Most corporations record most or all of the calls going to their customer service centers, it's trivial and cheap to do so. Given Brooklyn's notorious paranoia about information control and the relative ease of doing this, it seems like a no-brainer to me.
Also all IP (Internet Protocol) traffic is also logged in and out of the compounds as are all key strokes on computers and web sites visited - this is for secured wireless and Ethernet "connect Direct".
The first claim (all IP traffic logged) is the default setting for any internet-sharing setup such as exists at any large corporation. I have never worked at a company that did not do this. You'd have to take extra effort to turn this feature OFF. This is clearly true.
As for the keystroke logging, this is also very common. Do some research on this. My company does it periodically as does almost every other company in the world. Keystroke loggers are easy to install and are completely legal--you're using their equipment on their network, they can log your keystrokes.
Interesting thing at Patterson and Bittacy is that the steel shanked building is resistant to external Wireless - so they installed an adsl wireless internal system that is open and looks external -but is in fact internal and monitored, just to catch people out.
This is also trivial. The only surprising thing about that is that anyone would be dumb enough to think they could use someone else's internet connection without risk. Whether they've "caught anyone out" with it is another story, but don't doubt that it would be easy to set something like this up.
The only way someone could have a truly private internet connection at Bethel would be to get their internet access thru their cellular provider. You can use Bluetooth, a USB cable, or a dedicated cell modem PCMCIA card to accomplish this. And from what I've heard some do this, though it would be a cause for suspicion and would probably be unwise.
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snowbird
JIOR?
Jehovah Is Our Righteousness? Isn't that JCanon's outfit?
Snowbird
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slimboyfat
Actually, I think it simply reveals the advanced levels of paranoia that must exist at headquarters.
Mmm, I wonder if it doesn't show the paranoia that exists here rather...
Slim
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BizzyBee
I've never doubted for a moment that the WTS would track all available public (and some private) information about themselves. It's only a matter of HOW, WHO, WHEN, WHAT. We know WHY - it's simply a sound business practice.
This thread may answer the HOW - it may be completely or partially correct - but as underbeliever said
nothing in there was even close to being exotic or out of the ordinary to the kind of monitoring that is performed at most major corporations these days (and the WTS qualifies as a major corporation.)
The more interesting question to me is WHO? Obviously it would be perilous for any JW, no matter how high up, to personally monitor this site for any length of time. No, I'm guessing that they hire a legal firm outside the organization to monitor and report back only things that are of interest - publications, legal matters, news, etc. They may search for clues to the identities of active JWs who come here.
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Finally-Free
I'm just cowering in fear.
W
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Seeker4
under_believer;
Appreciate your expertise on this, but it still sounds so-so to me. It also seems to me that we had that quoted post on here sometime in the last couple of years. the one from the person who says they're familiar with the Bethel computer system.
Is it possible that a lot of this stuff is just normal on any large computer system in a corporation? The line that raises a red flag for me is how they brought in some ex-CIA types known as the Plumbers to install some of this security stuff. That just sounds too unrealistic, sorry.
And what good would it do them? Exactly how would they use the info? Could they use it legally? And wouldn't the danger of having a bunch of Bethelites monitoring this site and being exposed to this info day in and day out be worse than just ignoring the site?
Anyway, I don't know shit about these complex security systems, so I'll leave it to you experts. I am pretty good at picking up the hints that something is a line of baloney, and this has a few of those earmarks.
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mavie
This isn't true. C'mon, use your head.
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Dragonlady76
I don't care if they monitor this site, actually it's a good thing they can see where the all the sheep have gone.
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AK - Jeff
I would suggest that the biggest reason that Bethel would make it appear that they do monitor this site is; fear.
I honestly doubt they do all the things suggested in the post. My God are they paranoid enough to do all that?
Jeff