I am Frustrated beyond belief~/Please read! (page 3)

Sassy

you mom doesn't want to know the real truth.. she doesnt want to analyze them, because she wants to believe.. thus she doesnt want to discuss it with you. my mother wouldn't either..

Sorry for your frustration Restrangled. Well done though for perservering with your mum. Like everyone has said though they will only hear what they really want to and just now she is watchtower programmed. Maybe just give her little comments on such subjects and then move on to something else?Might make it more palatable for her to take in and make her think a bit on the quiet. Take care x

John Doe

I heard a saying recently that is applicable here. "Never wrestle with a pig. You'll just get muddy, and the pig loves it."

Scully

I was accused of trying to destroy her beliefs, and if I was not in agreement to reject the entire religion........which of course I have already done many moons ago.

Any beliefs that cannot be shattered when its adherents do not give a crap about some of its members destroying the lives of children by way of sexual molestation, cannot possibly be healthy in the first place.

PEC

r. you have said many times that your mother will never leave the dubs. What did you gain/lose from this argument?

Good one, JD.

alt

Philip

flipper

Oh , let me see if I get this right. Your mother says because the witnesses only settled in the millions of dollars to molestation victims , as opposed to the catholics settling billions of dollars of lawsuits, it makes all the difference in the world. That makes alot of sense (not). Let's see which cult molested more children than the other! That's almost like saying because O.J. Simpson only killed 2 people (alledgedly ) and Jeffrey Dahmer about 30 it makes O.J. less accountable ! Where do the witnesses come up with this " Crisis of No Concsience" reasoning ?

But Restrangled I feel for you. I go through the same thing talking with my daughters about it. It's like talkin' with a brick wall. Hang in there friend, in time this cult will come down. My wife told me it's like talking to a person who has been spiritually mentally disabled and diseased from the witnesses beliefs. They can see no evil, hear no evil, or speak no evil about themselves. That is the greatest insanity of all. Hang in there pal

steve2

I personally think that both you and your mother need to respect each other's right to each other's beliefs. You really, really don't need to win her over to your side; nor does she really, really need to win you over to hers. It's as simple as that.

Sometimes in a conflicted relationship, someone has to take the first stand towards a more mature, accepting attitude of the other. It sounds like your mother will not be the one to take a more mature and accepting stand, so that leaves it over to you...that is, if you really want to improve your relationship with her and model to her more of an open approach to your relationship.

Respecting the other person's right to her own beliefs does not mean you condone what she believes; just that you recognise at some fundamental level she is responsible for the choices she has made in what she believes; just as you are for yours.

The solution to the frustration is in your hands. Stop putting yourself at the mercy of people whose beliefs differ from yours. End of sermon.

seven006

Rest,
No one can ever penetrate a brick wall by standing in front of it and saying to it, “you're a brick wall, I’m going to penetrate you”. Brick walls don’t know they are a brick walls. Brick walls can’t think like people so don’t try to communicate with them like they’re one.

Your mom has had “almost” all of her thoughts completely manipulated and her mind programmed. Stating the obvious will never get you anywhere. What you might want to try is a little thought association. That’s how she got to become the way she is in the first place.

You know she is in a cult BUT, the word “cult” or verbally expressing any “actions or accusations” (like child molestation issues) toward a group/cult in a negative manner (they/she will always see it in a manner of a negative attack) automatically shifts their mind into defensive mode. Once that is done they are running on pure “cult programming” and things like logic, reasoning, and individual thought examination, don’t have a chance of penetrating trough.

But…if you recognize that “thought association is being used by her/them” you can begin to use it in a manner her mind can associate with and possibly accept. She instantly comes back at you with the Catholic church molestation and court payout amounts, then everything changes to dollar amounts justifying/equalizing the least of two evils which makes her/them more right and less wrong. Words like “molestation” “court cases” “spent millions” “paid out” are words that flips her/their thinking switch to panic association mode. Then they/her go into the “what about them” and “what about you” mode. When that happens the best you can do is jump back onto your white horse and rise off into the sunset to fight again another day.

The last person to recognize they are in a cult is a person who is in a cult. But,…they seem to have the ability to recognize others who are in “some other” cult. How did she feel about Jonestown, Havens Gate or Branch Dividians? Or how does she feel about less obvious (to her) more mainstream cults like Mormons, Scientologist or Seventh day Adventist? They are all wrong, right?

If you can bring out things about them (check out the internet for ex-group members of those groups and learn about them) which she will probably agree with you on. You can use thought association in a manner where she looks at it in a positive “agreement with you” manner and lets down some of her programmed thought defenses. Once that is done, it is a lot easier to communicate and get a point across.

Cults all have the same mind manipulation techniques. If you can eventually get her to associate or recognize what she sees as cult mind manipulation being or has been used on someone else in what she sees as a cult, she just might someday be able to see it in herself.

The advertising industry has been using thought association to manipulate consumers minds to buy stuff for decades and it works better then you’ll ever know or recognize.

Take care,

Dave

I am Frustrated beyond belief~/Please read!