Is it all just a 'Cosmic Crapshoot'? (page 3)

AK - Jeff

I am enjoying the discussion so far. Many good thoughts expressed so far on a very difficult topic.

This seems to be a good idea;

Jeff

Consider the possibility that the "still small voice" that people find so comforting, so reassuring, so peaceful is actually YOU as you really are. Let the idea that you are separate from that which is called "God" drop away entirely.

Awakened07

I agree with serotonin_wraith.

The way I see it, it all starts with intelligence. Intelligence leads to self-awareness. Self awareness leads to questions.

Let's as an experiment give life and intelligence to a snow flake:

"Wow - what a wonderful place I find myself in! And look at all my siblings - we're all unique, and we're all crafted with great precision in intricate geometrical shapes! And think of how we came to be: had the temperature been just slightly warmer, or the humidity been too low we wouldn't exist at all. This is proof that the Great Snowflake created us in It's image. Sure - we'll fall to the ground and eventually disappear, but we'll be given life again. What would be the purpose of all this otherwise?" Now take their life away again, and they're 'only' snowflakes - a result of natural processes. Beautiful, unique - but only snowflakes.

I'd like there to be a bigger meaning and purpose, and who knows, maybe there is, but currently I'm getting more and more convinced otherwise. But maybe that'll change.

poppers

That was an interesting example you gave, Awakened07. Thanks for sharing it.

bluesbreaker59

Here's my thoughts on life:

I think you should be the best person you know how to be. Love your family, love AND STICK to your mate like their is no tomorrow, tell them every day, because you never know when its going to be your last. Cherish your friends, thank them for being your friends, and always provide a listening ear in a time of need. Give of yourself and your means to those can't or need help. Stay away from man made food products, cause they'll kill ya, and eat a well balanced diet everyday. Enjoy life, enjoy all that it has to offer, and do all things in moderation. Lastly, never interfere with another's happiness.

Everything else, is small stuff...

Narkissos

Awakened's snowflakes reminded me of the short-lived whale and bowl of petunias in Douglas Adams' Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy... (and the latter's reflection: "Oh no, not again...").

Did we find "purpose" and "meaning" and "awareness" inthe world or did we generate them as the bees produce honey?

That seems to me the most undecidable of all questions.

But it doesn't matter much to "us" either way.

Awakened07

Yes, it's an interesting question Narkissos, and one I'm not fully decided on yet - maybe never will.

If I'm "right" - and I'm not sure I agree with myself here(!) - then computers should eventually gain awareness as a direct result of complexity and intelligence. I tried to think about that; "Why isn't a computer truly intelligent and aware? Is it only because it isn't complex enough yet?" Is it because a computer only "mechanically" picks up information and places it somewhere else, kinda like picking up different colored pebbles and placing them somewhere else for later retrieval? What does the human brain do that's different from that in that case? Some computers, especially in robots, can 'learn' and 'evolve'; a robot may be programmed with a goal of getting from a horizontal position to an upright position, but not programmed exactly how to accomplish it, and needs to learn from it's mistakes. And it works - after several attempts, it's upright, because of all the numerous things it tried to do, only some of them aided it in getting upright, and the mistakes were discarded. But is that intelligence like in humans? At this stage, I'd of course say not. But perhaps at some stage later on, with (much) added complexity? Hard to tell. Is awareness something ethereal - a soul; something a computer can never posses? Unfortunately, if awareness is simply a function of complexity and intelligence and computers therefore can obtain it, I doubt it will be shown in my lifetime.

Narkissos

If a machine, or some non-"human" life form, became suddenly "aware" in the sense of sapiens sapiens, how would we know?

Iow, what criteria do we use to tell the presence or absence of "awareness," "intelligence" or "personality" if not some "specio-centrist" analogy (what looks or doesn't look like the human species)?

Are such qualitative distinctions anything but markers arbitrarily pinned somewhere along a quantitative continuum?

Just harping on your questions with further questions...

serotonin_wraith

^ This reminds me why I like sci-fi so much. Questions like this are explored. E.g. 'The Measure of a Man' (Star Trek TNG) and 'I, Robot' (book and Outer Limits episode).

One change to my last post in this topic- I now think there are only two reasons (not three) why people believe in a god. Being ignorant of certain facts and/or wanting to believe. Indoctrination is being ignorant of the facts too technically, even though it isn't the child's fault.

Satanus

My question is, if/when a computer gets to a self aware state, will a preexisting spirit get in there, as well. One more question.

S

Is it all just a 'Cosmic Crapshoot'?

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