by oompa 24 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
That is a great question. Apparently Jesus inspected in 1918 and found it unclean, and came in 1919 to find it clean. What had changed. The only doctrine that I am aware of of any significance was that "millions now living will never die" - that the early resurrection would start in 1925. In other words, the most significant change was that Rutherford introduced a false prophecy.
For a list of the "pagan" teachings and false prophecies still being preached in 1919 see the following article.
Rutherford made becoming a soldier a "conscience decision."{1914-1918} Also Armegedon was to come in 1918-19 at the latest {Finished Mystery} Russell who was the one and only "faithful slave" at the time was buried next to his giant pyramid. How could Yahweh be impressed with this orginisation?
I have actually been to Russels grave...long story. It is freaking odd. Of course we never hear anything about pyrimidology today, but I still do not know how prominent it was in JW teaching during the "inspection period." If it is, that in itself would seem to disqualify us. My dad/elder always says this though and I would love some help with a response "Son we may have been wrong about a lot of things, but the main doctines of:
1.no burning hellfire
2. no imortality of the soul
3. God is not part of a Trinity
4.that we teach God name is Jehovah
remain unchanged to this day." Another thread I want to do is if there are other religions with these teachings. Anyway, the average JW does not have access to even know if the pyrimid thingy was prominent 1900-1919. More help please....where is Gopher when you need him!!...oompa
Oompa,
Currently they teach that when Jesus examined the religions claiming to have spiritual light (from the illustration of the ten virgins) they say Jesus chose those who were awaiting the arrival of Christ, the Bridegroom.
This cannot possibly apply to the Society or its acolytes at that time. They were teaching that Christ had already returned, in 1874, and that he'd already been enthroned, in 1878. Although the 1878 date was dropped from actively taught doctrine shortly after 1914, the 1874 date was still being propogated throughout their publications until the late 1920s as the year of Christ's arrival and the commencement of the parousia.
If anyone's "lamp" would have been extinguished in 1914 it would be the religion teaching that Christ had already showed up! It would be a foolish virgin indeed who would sit with a lit lamp waiting for the arrival of a groom who had already been present for 40 years.
Respectfully,
AuldSoul
Oompa,
4. that we teach God name is Jehovah.
But God's name is Yodh Heh Waw Heh, not Jehovah. In fact, the Governing Body and many avid Bible students in the Jehovah's Witnesses religion know beyond any shadow of doubt that Jehovah is not God's name.
The absence of or rejection of a belief is not a belief. Three of the four you mentioned are not beliefs at all. They are merely contradictions of the beliefs of others.
Of the four doctrines you mentioned that haven't changed, what spiritual purpose does belief in any of them serve beyond distinguishing them from other religions?
On the other hand, consider this doctrine: "Jesus is not the mediator for all mankind." A religion that claims to be Christian cannot do so rightly and believe this doctrine. It directly affects the relationship of a person to their savior. Ancillary to this belief is the doctrine that prayer to Jesus is a form of idol worship.
How about this one:
Watchtower August 1, 2001, p. 14, par. 8:
First, since "oneness" is to be observed, a mature Christian must be in unity and full harmony with fellow believers as far as faith and knowledge are concerned. He does not advocate or insist on personal opinions or harbor private ideas when it comes to Bible understanding. Rater, he has complete confidence in the truth as it is revealed by Jehovah God through his Son, Jesus Christ, and "the faithful and discreet slave." By regularly taking in the spiritual food provided "at the proper time" -- through Christian publications, meetings, assemblies, and conventions -- we can be sure that we maintain "oneness" with fellow Christians in faith and knowledge. -- Matthew 24:45.
Firstly, "mature christians" are defined as people who do not harbor private ideas when it comes to Bible understanding. How does this affect spirituality? (Hebrews 5:12-6:3)
Secondly, regular spiritual feeding does not include Bible study. Presumably this is the case because that is the source of those naughty private ideas harbored by immature Christians. But what does this actual doctrine do to someone's spirituality?
Respectfully,
AuldSoul
Oompa:
I was aware of the changes, the contradictions, etc... in the Org. I always attributed this to man being imperfect. We were all just trying to get to the same place and hopefully get there at the same time. The brotherhood was a comfort. The emphasis on moral cleanness was a comfort. Etc....
It was after I became an elder and saw first hand that the teaching and the care of the congregation was not based on love and Christianity, but rather on a set of corporate
directives, that I truely began to have misgivings. When I became convinced that in fact I was following men and man made rules and doctrines and had to subordinate
the truth--- not just thoughts, doubts, etc--- but THE TRUTH!-- to their edicts and directives, then I knew I had to investigate.
To me it was not enough to say that we don't teach hell fire, or a Trinity, or that God's name is Jehovah---- Jews do likewise. And they haven't changed for 3500 years. So,
is Judaism the true religion?
The mediatorship of Christ only for the anointed: this was also a teaching of the WTS that resonated like a bold faced lie. And guess what? The majority of JW's either do not know that is the offical doctrine, or just dismiss it. I know that all the young people in my pioneer class had no clue that JesusChrist was not their mediator. Some were stunned to learn this and hear it for the first time from a CO, a direct rep. from the GB.
It may be too late for your Dad since he has invested so much of his life and faith in this religion. It is definitely difficult to reconcile being a true beleiver with the fact that you were actually a sucker. It hurts. I know, it hurt me like hell.
JW Facts put up a great post. I hope you find the info you need. Be prepared for it not being enough to convince your Dad that the Org. is built on a lie. It's built on shifting sand, that's why it changes so often. It has no true foundation.
All the best.
Zack:The mediatorship of Christ only for the anointed: this was also a teaching of the WTS that resonated like a bold faced lie. And guess what? The majority of JW's either do not know that is the offical doctrine, or just dismiss it. I know that all the young people in my pioneer class had no clue that JesusChrist was not their mediator. Some were stunned to learn this and hear it for the first time from a CO, a direct rep. from the GB.
Zack, yes it hurts like hell, and can really mess you up for awhile. This should probably be in it's own thread, but I would like to get a little more info on if it could be posted or pm'd. I barely remember this point because it seemed like the GC kinda were and benefited, but not really. I never understood the need ever for a mediator. People used to say "hey God, this is how it's goin, but you know that, your God." Why would every prayer be wiretapped by Jesus????
Now if we could get some info on what Jesus would have found upon inspection.....and I need originals.....oompa...thanks all
OOMPA... Is this the one that you are thinking of ?
*** re chap. 18 p. 105 Earthquakes in the Lord’s Day ***
Tremors in Human Society
4
From the mid-1870’s, Jehovah’s people had been anticipating that catastrophic events would start in 1914 and would mark the end of the Gentile Times. This is the period of "seven times" (2,520 years) running from the overthrow of the Davidic kingdom in Jerusalem in 607 B.C.E. to Jesus’ enthronement in heavenly Jerusalem in 1914 C.E.—Daniel 4:24, 25; Luke 21:24, KingJamesVersion.
Not exactly his return, but still a big pork-pie all the same !
Compare it with...
This from 1907
BROOKLYN., NY., JANUARY 15, 1918 Could everyone please read this goodie I just found!...oompa..it is short
ARE THE ADVERSARIES INCREASING IN POWER (article)
TIlE DIVINE PLAN (sub-heading)
Jehovah foreknew that Adam would disobey him and that
all of hls progeny would suffer sickness sorrow and death.
In the exercise of his loving kindness and perfect wisdom,
Go,1 provided redemption of mankind from death through tim
blood of Jesus, his beloved Son. He further foreordained
and provided that because of his full obedience to the, d.ivine
will and program, Jesus should be exalted above all other
creatures (Jehovah alone excepted) PS...I just started looking at an amazing source I never even heard of. I had no idea all the old watchtowers are in pda at wikkipedia, but do now thanks to AlphaOmega. I never knew we believed God had predestined EVERYTHING apparently! I am so appreciate of the info in all the posts so far.....oompa
Very interesting thread, Oompa. I just got to it now, earlier in the day the Trevor-gate thing was too absorbing.
Yes the selection of the WTS/Bible Students was in 1919. I think Babylon "the Grape" fell in 1918, according to WTS dogma.
My only correction is that JW's didn't exist in 1919 -- they were called "Bible Students" still.
----
Thanks for the information that Wikipedia has a link to the Watchtower PDF's up until 1949. That link is: http://tjliberte.free.fr/Library/Watchtower_Publications/WT/
The idea that God "foreknew" that Adam would sin would illustrate that Adam was NOT a "free moral agent", able to make his own decision, as is now taught by the WTS. So now they teach God didn't have foreknowledge of this. This would imply that either he wanted to be ignorant, or he had in mind exactly what he would do if Adam were to be unfaithful -- he would allow a lot of suffering and misery upon innocent future generations.
