Help? Bible question (page 2)

Sad emo

Skyking it says "I gave them over to..."

There is a hell of a difference between "I gave them" - which as you correctly imply means the effects came from God and

"I gave them over to" - which means, however you wish to interpret, He allowed it to happen to them, abandoned them to etc... basically, He stopped instructing them and let them choose their own way.

Perhaps you need to improve your reading comprehension or your selective reading abilities.

Anyway, you asked for comments not discussion. I gave you my comments, make of them what you will.

skyking

Skyking it says " I gave them over to... "
There is a hell of a difference between "I gave them" -

What bible are you reading from. All My bibles say "Wherefore I gave them also statutes that were not good, and judgments whereby they should not live"

Interesting transnsaltion you have.

Narkissos

Sad Emo,

Which version are you quoting?

The Masoretic text has I gave (to) them statutes..., nathati lâhem chuqqim... -- cf. LXX edôka autois (dative) prostagmata (accusative)...

I gave them (over) to statutes... would require a different syntax, e.g. nathati 'otham lechuqqim

skyking

JCanon interesting verse

John 21: 22 Jesus said to him: “If it is my will for him to remain until I come, of what concern is that to you? You continue following me.” 23 In consequence, this saying went out among the brothers, that that disciple would not die.

I've seen both John and Paul myself

That must of been really cool JCanon. You should share with us what you talked about.

Sad emo

Narkissos & Skyking

I got that from the NIV - the text in my first post was pasted from BibleGateway. Maybe they misquoted?

It wouldn't surprise me if the NIV translators have 'niceified' it though, I do wonder whether they've done that quite a lot?

I hope Jcannon will let us know what he talked about with the two Apostles. Maybe he could let us have their address and phone numbers so any of us here on the board could talk to them. This could be life altering. I would love to talk to them. Just imagine talking to John. So cool.

Awakened07

Perhaps it's something of the same sort as what it says in Romans 1:26-29 (KJV):

"For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: | And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet. | And even as they did not like to retain God in [their] knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient; | Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers"

?

Narkissos

Sad Emo

It's the NIV indeed (I just checked in a printed copy I have).

Not the first case of harmonising mistranslation I come across in this Evangelical version -- btw, the footnote of the NIV Study Bible does refer to Romans 1...

lalliv01

At work we had a saying about the company's work rules: "While obeying the rules may be beneficial for you, they are really there to fire you by." Is the same idea being expressed in this scripture, that is, the STATUTES and LAWS given by Jehovah did not give life but rather justification to give us/them death?

lalliv01

snowbird

I'm going to chime in with The Message Bible. Although it takes great liberties with the text at times, it also sheds light on many a difficult passage.

Ezekiel 20:25 Since they were determined to live bad lives, I myself gave them statutes that could not produce goodness and laws that did not produce life.

That clears things up a little, doesn't it?

Sylvia

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