New Yearbook stats for 2007 now out!

by Dogpatch 111 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  juni

  In Britain last year it said there were 50,164 bible studies is that the number of people who are studying?

  Yes. That total would also include the "allowed" one bible study per family head with immediate family members.

  don't have the records on hand, but starting about a year ago, a new box appeared on the report that congregation secretaries submit to hindquarters, er, I mean headquarters. In addition to the table layout for total hours, literature, return visits, bible studies, and report count of slips for the month for publishers, pioneers, and aux. pios., a separate new box appeared titled "Congregation Members - Active Publishers". Consequently, in addition to the number of active publishers for that one month, there was now a number turned in each month for the number of active publishers for the last 6 months, that would be a higher number.

  pardon me for questioning Billy, but when it comes to "NEW LIGHT" I'm sort of.. lol

  anyway, do you have verification Houston? anyone?
• 

  Farkel

  notyetx,

  Pity your name.

  :You said: A suggestion about the numbers: Calm down!! Nothing happens in a day.

  Was 9/11/2001 one of those "nothings" that happened in a day, dummy? Did "nothing" happen in that day that did not change the world? "Nothing happens in a day" is a non-sequitur that is so ridiculous that it is not worth the time to debate it. Was the bombing of Pearl Harbor in 12/7/1941 a NOTHING that happened in a "day" or are you just stupid or uninformed about stuff like that?

  : Imagine 5-7 years ago when stories like the NBC story could be easily dismissed. Slow but steady progress is being made every day.

  Yeah? So? Where is that "slow but steady progress?" Please give evidence for we curious people. Name just something. Anything. And PLEASE give us a reason why that "progress" should not be speedy for "God's ONLY spirit-directed organization." Why should THEY be given any slack/credit since they claim the high ground?

  :Even with a modest increase (compare the human population increases in each of the countries and the plantas a whole), this says nothing about the degree of intensity with which these beliefs are held.

  : (compare the human population increases in each of the countries and the plant as a whole),

  I don't know much about plants, but I do know a lot about diversionery tactics. The Muslims are winning and the dubs are losing! 1.3 BILLION Muslims, and .006 (that is POINT zero zero six) billion dubs or less than one dub for every 1,000 rag heads who just want to impose their faith on everyone else. Oh, wait! I forget! That is EXACTLY what dubs want to do! And they BOTH call on their own God to kill those who disagree with them. Dubs = Muslims. Muslems = dubs. Different Gods, same bullshit. Same killing of those who differ.

  Also, look up and read the definition of "red herring". "Intensity of belief" does not provide any excuse for crappy and basically non-existent increases.

  : There is a cynicism deeply indebted with those who have been in the Organization for a period of time.

  That should cause you pause to stop and think why, my friend.

  : Remember the current leadership (and long-term followership) are more interested in the power game. It is about maintaining the status quo and avoiding reform and renewal.

  You got that right.

  : Slowly but surely, the Organization will have to move. I think there is a quiet (even silent) revolution happening but it requires patience.

  America would still be under Briitish rule if we thought that way: maybe King George III would no longer be insane in a few years....Let's be patient... He really means well, you know.....

  Do you think the Governing Body will no longer be insane in a few years when they have ALWAYS been insane, my friend?

  It doesn't require patience. Idiots think that way. Lazy people think that way. People who expect the people who cause the problems and can solve them, but haven't and won't unless they are forced to do so think that way. It requires ACTION. What major changes were ever made requiring "patience" for intractable problems with intractable people?
  
  :A second suggestion: A more scientific way to discuss the JW population. Among the people in the ex-JW community are sociologists, mathematicians, and psychologists and university professors. Professionalize the statistics and get a rival number to the official stats.

  That is not a suggestion. That is total idiocy. Dubs are window washers and janitors. The GB has less skills than that. Many of them did not graduate from High School. Dubs have been discouraged to get the skills you mentioned, and those that do are most certainly not elders or COs or Dos. They are "marked" with having "wordly" intentions.

  :Why hasn't someone done a survey that looks not only at population numbers, but at income, age, education, "intensity" of belief, actual hours in the ministry, health issues, retirement prospects, etc.? Anonymous packets or calls to a scientific sample of JW's could give better info. (Imagine a Gallup poll type scenario.) It would be a more honest accounting of the numbers and less subject to manipulation by the Org (or ex-JWs).

  A better question might be, "why hasn't the WTS done that survey??

  :Keep up the good work. Use your heads, don't lose them.

  Pflooooot! Quid pro quo. Find your head. When and if you do, please try to use it.

  Farkel
• 

  jakesnake82

  I’m white so it’s uncomfortable being the one to mention this but while are angels in all the society’s publications always Caucasian? Well….ok, maybe they’re just Jews with a light complexion. lol
• 

  WTWizard

  I will tell you what I think is responsible for this spike. In fact, several things.

  (1) Children being coerced into getting baptized, and hence becoming publishers, at ever younger ages. This pushes up the numbers of growth for the time being, at the expense of that they are not going to have those children to boost the growth next year.

  (2) Fear. Since summer of 2006, there has been numerous pushes to get the message that Armageddon was coming within the next year, or within a few months. They got people to think their deliverance was at hand, even imminent. They had the false religion crapt that was supposed to have started the Great Tribulation and scared people into thinking they had better get into the work now. There was the crapmorial admonition to have a good look at the table, since it wouldn't be there next year (I remember the same stock line in 1989). They had a few "It is only days, weeks" scares this past June. They had the advertisement of the Grand Boasting Session this past summer. And now they are still at it.

  (3) The crapt work. This was a way for the hounders to get those who are inactive out for the month. They had three of them in the 2007 year, making it easy for them to get all 7+ million on the rolls to at least do that work. They always used the fear of getting destroyed and that it was about to end to get those inactives out there.

  (4) Fake time reports. Publishers fill out a time slip for hours that they did not actually put in, just to stay "active". Those who do not fill out one on their own often have a fake slip filled out on their behalf because the hounder-hounder does not want to see inactive and irregular publishers. They often come with a zero tolerance for such members, and the secretaries need to get the hounder-hounder off their backs. So they will simply fill out fake reports, and then there will be zero irregular/inactive publishers.

  (5) All the new changes. They have to create the illusion of Jehovah blessing the work. Trust me, it is just an illusion. All mysticism. If they put more pressure on people to do all of the above, they will get a fake growth. Pressure is put on children to get baptized at age 6 (meaning that they have to become unbaptized publishers at ages 4 and 5). Times are faked, and whole slips are faked by the secretaries. They have extreme fear. They use easy ways to place litter-ature. Then they get a paper increase, so they can point to it as Jehovah's blessing.

  Note that all this comes with a high price. They can only fake so many slips before it becomes blatant. Congregations with only 40 or 50 in attendance and another 50 inactives cannot have 100 time slips turned in without looking fishy. The fear is going to wear out if they keep using it too much (I remember the negative growth they had following 1975). Those children getting baptized at age 6 instead of age 14 will not become part of the growth when the year 2015 comes here. And, with all the scandals breaking out, they are going to have a miserable time trying to get new recruits out of the field. And the money--if people quit donating at the time they need the money to settle lawsuits, and they run out of assets to sell, they are going to be up sxxx creek without a paddle. Sooner or later, those fake numbers are all going to come back to haunt them, and then they will come back down to earth (zero).

  Meanwhile, this forum continues its expansion. The numbers continue to grow, and are close to impossible to fake since they are calculated post by post, member by member as they join and post. I am seeing numerous members that are newbies today ending up becoming Master Members within 2 months, Jedi Masters within 5 months, Emperor Class members within a year, and Surpreme One status in 3 years. None of those are fake, and very few are deliberate attempts to inflate the post count. Plus, I see members who have been here since 2001 still putting in 300 and more a month, after having more than 20,000 posts. Those numbers, unlike the Watchtower numbers, are quite solid and will continue to increase at rates exceeding the growth of the Watchtower Society.
• 

  jayhawk1

  WTWizard's reasons for growth seem logical, especially 2, 4, and 5.

  Fear: Expect the fear to be a reason for growth through 2014 as we near the century mark of "Jesus' Invisable Reign." Expect a spike about 2012 with the Mayan Calendar's end in December 2012.

  Fake time reports: Who here hasn't fudged their time slips? They've always been filled out on the honor system. The only way that would ever end is if Watchtower used score cards like in golf, where your partner fills out your score (time) and turns it in.

  New Changes: With Watchtower, it is always a moving target. Lower the required hours for pioneer service to have larger numbers of pioneers. Wow, instant increase! Lower the time needed to report to as low as 15 minutes. Wow, more publishers!

  One thing that surprises me, is why they keep publishing the number of Memorial Partakers. I am amazed they don't lie about that number and decrease it to 7000. I guess nobody but us notice that number.
• 

  moomanchu

  Welcome to JWD notyetx.

  farkel, I see you are doing your part in helping bring about change to the watchtower corp.

  Thanks for being so encouraging to new members.
• 

  jgnat

  Notyetx, I value your comments, thank you.

  Farkel, I don't know where you get off ripping this new poster's comments to shreds. Would you rather advocate panic? Or shall we merely dismiss the recorded increase this year as faked numbers?

  I've taken eighteen selected countries where we have the internet and compared average publishers for five years to see if there is any correlation between internet usage and slower growth for the Witnesses. I can't find it. Most odd is the growth in Australia, where 70% of it's population has internet access.

  Are we getting our EX-JW message to Taiwan? The Witness population has grown by 27% in the past five years, while 63% of their population has internet access. I suspect the Witness growth there is riding on the tails of other evangelical and cult growth in that country.

  TOP 20 COUNTRIES WITH HIGHEST NUMBER OF INTERNET USERS						Average Publishers
  Ranking*	Country or Region	Internet Users, Latest Data	Penetration (% Population)	% of World Users	Population*	2003	2004	2005	2006	2007	% increase past 5 years
  19	Taiwan	14,500,000	63%	1%	22,858,872	4,753	5,091	5,429	5,664	6,054	127%
  14	Indonesia	20,000,000	9%	2%	234,693,997	16,754	17,564	18,111	18,725	19,573	117%
  5	India	42,000,000	4%	4%	1,129,866,154	22,838	23,583	24,333	25,256	26,434	116%
  11	Russia	28,000,000	20%	2%	141,377,752	126,896	132,978	136,726	140,244	146,377	115%
  17	Turkey	16,000,000	21%	1%	71,158,647	1,653	1,697	1,730	1,775	1,866	113%
  6	Brazil	39,140,000	21%	3%	190,010,647	576,069	596,355	608,963	624,140	649,772	113%
  12	Mexico	22,700,000	21%	2%	108,700,891	555,653	581,651	586,501	600,348	620,473	112%
  20	Philippines	14,000,000	16%	1%	91,077,287	141,420	142,313	143,811	147,122	152,290	108%
  8	Korea (South)	34,120,000	67%	3%	49,044,790	89,097	90,282	91,379	92,541	94,066	106%
  1	United States	210,575,287	70%	18%	301,139,947	988,236	992,809	995,071	1,010,422	1,042,528	105%
  7	United Kingdom	37,600,000	62%	3%	60,776,238	125,144	125,271	126,070	127,468	131,149	105%
  15	Spain	19,765,033	44%	2%	40,448,191	97,806	98,922	99,634	100,029	102,310	105%
  9	France	32,925,953	54%	3%	63,713,926	112,308	113,038	113,731	114,439	116,169	103%
  10	Italy	31,481,928	53%	3%	58,147,733	229,920	230,880	232,060	233,231	236,113	103%
  18	Australia	15,085,600	72%	1%	20,434,176	60,510	60,399	60,533	60,692	62,022	102%
  13	Canada	22,000,000	68%	2%	33,390,141	108,409	108,012	107,534	107618	108,974	101%
  3	Japan	86,300,000	67%	7%	127,433,494	217,020	217,097	217,227	217,181	217,929	100%
  4	Germany	50,426,117	61%	4%	82,400,996	162,943	163,092	162,512	161,861	163,065	100%
  	TOTALS	736,619,918			2,826,673,879	3,637,429	3,701,034	3,731,355	3,788,756	3,897,164
  	% of World	11%		63%	43%	0.055%	0.06%	0.06%	0.06%	0.06%
  	World Population	6,602,224,175
  Notes:
  http://www.internetworldstats.com
  https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/index.html
  Taiwan and world population statistics from Kids Yahoo
  I added Ireland and Britain numbers in the WT reports to compare to UK
  Excluded, no WT Stats:
  2	China	162,000,000	12%	14%	1,321,851,888
  16	Vietnam	16,511,849	19%	1%	85,262,356
• 

  jgnat

  I would also like to compare these growth figures with:

  Government stability (Russia and Africa)

  Riding on Evangelical Growth in those countries (The Witness message barely makes sense if the hearer does not have a glancing familiarity with the bible, i.e. Muslim countries, China)

  Athiesm/Agnosticism (France)

  Population Growth (Brazil, African nations)
• 

  outofthebox

  Are the figures false you ask? Well, at least the ones I put in every month are, so...
• 

  Zico

  I expected a big increase compared to recent years. The book 'What does the bible really teach?' was released in 2005, and is starting to have it's desired effect. It's simple, so it's easy for studies to understand, but most of all, it's easy for the Witnesses to understand, and so it's easy to study with. The Jehovah's Witnesses love it, and it's given more of them the motivation to pursue studies, which is, imo, the reason for the increase.