you have a surfeit of information - I'll just say Hi! You and your husband stick together and find your way out of that maze of disinformation to freedom and peace.
I'm a Pioneer Married To a Wonderful Brother Reaching Out to be an MS...
by cognac 216 Replies latest jw experiences
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TheListener
Welcome to the board Cognac. I have successfully faded from the witnesses over the past several years. For some fading can be quick and for others it can take a long time. I have a wife and kids who are still loyal witnesses. My marriage has survived so far but each new WT inspired crisis or issue makes me nervous.
I know you're in a whirlwind of emotions right now. But, I wanted to tell you how excellent this thread has been. You come across as a very sincere, kind indvidual.
My main issues with the WTS when I began fading were:
607 (at first just the date and then as I researched I realized there was no biblical precedent for interpreting the day for a year counting and no scriptural reason to link Daniel and Revelation - but you can worry aboutt that another day)
Confessing to elders for forgiveness
Blood
The inaccuracy of certain parts of the NWT
Having the Society instill fear of open communication in my marriage so that I couldn't talk to my wife honest and open without fear of beng turned in.
I wish you the best of luck. You've started down a dificult road. We will be here to help anyway we can. Please ask any specific questions you'd like. You will get all sorts of viewpoints.
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JWdaughter
Welcome to the board. As you see, you are not the only one that has faced these questions.
The main comment you made (and there were many interesting points) was that you are concerned that Jehovah is not showing you that this is the truth because you don't have a good heart condition. Such a lame way they have chosen, yet effective to guilt out people. If you feel all alone in your confusion, then you blame yourself for not understanding and comprehending their reasoning. NO one really gets it-they go along with it since they get you agreeing to a few basic things at the beginning (yeah, its a scary, dangerous world out there, etc) and it is just easier to go along then it is to really question. And when you really DO, you are told to wait on Jehovah; you know how many JWs are waiting on Jah because the org. is so messed up, contradictory and confusing? Probably every last one with any amount of education questions the WTS. Its not just you. The expression "I'm just waiting on Jehovah" is so common as to become trite in JW/WT circles. That is because EVERYONE is waiting for it to make sense. It doesn't and it won't. Its not just you.
I have been out since around the time Franz left (a little before it was public). I am not sure why you would need to have asked to be a pioneer and get special permission. When I was young I put in aux pioneer hours the last couple of summers, but was never official (just an unbaptised publisher). Without the magazine discount, what does the official title do for you?(if you believed??)
If you are the nice gal coming to my door, I'd rather you didn't! I really think you ought to re-think the hardcore D2D stuff while you are yourself unconvinced. Did you become a pioneer to help your DH MS ambitions? Do you really want to deal with a MS husband if you are fading?
Oh, and don't think you have to find another religion first. It isn't about religion. What you believe is personal. Mush it around for a bit. If you know you are allergic to something,does that mean you keep eating it till you find an equivalent that you like as much?. You may find that a lot of the 'equivalents' will be just as bad for you. Just lay off for awhile and let your spirit relax, just read the scriptures (or other holy or wise books also) and see what it does for you. Read without the cliff notes telling you what it is you are reading, why it is significant and how it relates to something written 1500 hundred years previously in another country. Just read it for what IT is saying to you, not what you can try to make it say.
I hope this all works out for you, and all my best to you and your (future)family.
Shelly -
R.Crusoe
Hi cognac,
I have wrestled with truth for most of my life until I have come to a realisation that it is not to be wrestled with but perceived and understood. What exists is there because cosmic powers beyond our comprehension permit it!
I will attempt to concisely express my feelings and spiritual position which has evolved from my personal experience of life in my own tunnel of reality. I can only be, at the very least, true to myself otherwise I am a liar before I rise from my bed!
All I can say is what I think I have learned. I say learned because every reality is what we have learned and that depends too on how we think. Reality is not truth, it is a learned perception! And when each of us begins to learn about the different perceptions we may begin to get a perspective. Perspective helps us to see that each person is in their own reality tunnel. There is no TRUTH - only reality. You will find this even speaking to your husband.His reality is not a replica of yours. What his heart fully believes will be different. Imagine how someone born into another culture may view things? Imposing 'TRUTH' on different realities does not establish TRUTH as a common reality - you will find each persons perception of TRUTH is still relative to their own reality tunnel. I question whether a groups 'TRUTH' should be used to shun those who realise this and refuse to agree with what their soul cannot allow.
I even question whether it is plausible that the reality of people living over hundreds of years apart, and visibly evolving their perception of Gods persona as each book of the Bible came to be established by the authorities of the day, can in fact translate to our time in ways which are faultless and unflawed. The Biblical God was one advocating death for even babies of other nations in the Hebrew scriptures, but then rebuking any malice through the philosophies of Jesus. A complete reverse psychology from what I would think was an unchanging God of TRUTH!
As such I do not put my trust in any writings of man but in my hearts connection with nature and peace and compassion and understanding and love. If that is not enough I will die by it. Any who judge me unworthy because I do not do as they command are attempting to control and bully my spirituality - something I would not do to them. And in shunning me for it they are judging me! Their philosophy is a flawed and loveless one wishing me to abandon the brain, heart and soul I was gifted and clone myself on things my heart does not connect with!
I have come to view many religious books as ones of circular reasoning. Clever combinations of reason which have half answers to everything but no proof of anything. I wonder if they were excellent ways of controlling large populations. In fact I wonder whether they are the ONLY proven ways of doing so effectively over time. It is well known that the Romans used Christianity as a basis for establishing widely, common beliefs in their empire which they could then use to influence the masses politically. It is far easier to control anyone when you have convinced them they are being watched by an unknown god whom they know more about than you do!!
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Fadeout
Hi Cognac! I am new to this board as well, but not new to doubts.
I'm about two years removed from making the decision to learn about forbidden information, and one year into a successful fade.
For Matt 24:14... yeah that was a sticking point for me too, because who else preaches like the Witnesses? Then one day the scales fell from my eyes and I thought, 'Wait a second. The Catholic Church has spread Christianity around the world for the last 2000 years. They have 1 billion members, in every nation. If that didn't fulfill Jesus' prophecy, do I really believe that our measly 6 million members are doing so?'
Most everyone here has given you good advice... take some time to consider what you've learned, don't overwhelm yourself with too many topics at a time, don't discuss your doubts with others, and be grateful your husband has been so supportive.
At one time I did consider going to the elders, confident I could back up my position with facts and Scriptures, and there was no way they could disfellowship me as an apostate for simply telling the truth. Now I realize that there's no benefit to such an attempt at reason; it would be like debating with O'Brien from 1984. I would be denied even going out in a "blaze of glory" because judicial proceedings are closed-door procedures anyway.
I am happy I have never shared my new knowledge with anyone who knows me personally, except for one trusted family member.
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sweet pea
Welcome Fadeout! and all the other Newbies that this thread has flushed out.
We thought as you did and never thought for a minute we would be punished for telling the truth but that it was happened.
We were DISFELLOWSHIPPED FOR TELLING THE TRUTH.
Surreal. -
Pubsinger
Nah YOU were disfellowshipped for not listening to Uncle Pub ROFLMAO
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besty
Welcome Cognac - good luck on your journey - there is more upside than downside even if you do lose a lot of friends/family - its all conditional on you believing exactly as they do or keeping your mouth shut if you don't - not my definition of true friendship and certainly not the way family should behave.
We (SweetPea and I are married - to each other that is) were disfellowshipped for industrial strength heresy and failure to recant our wicked position.
http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/7/144705/1.ashx
I suggest jwfacts.com as providing a lot of very well presented and well written information.
Take your time with deciding who to talk to - there is no hurry - you have given all your life to the Org - try to take as much time as you can bear to keep appearances up while you digest this life changing information.
There's plenty people on JWD who will help and probably some living a lot closer than you think - meeting F2F with fellow ex-JW's is a great thing to do when you are ready.
All the best
Paul Morrison
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Pubsinger
We (SweetPea and I are married - to each other that is) were disfellowshipped for industrial strength heresy and failure to recant our wicked position.
Industrial Strength Heresy - didn't we dring a couple of bottles of that?
How's it going mate!?
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snowbird
Cognac, you asked:
Also, what does Jesus not stating Jehovah's name mean? And how would one put more emphasis on Jesus? We study a lot about him... So, how would you go about putting more emphasis on him?
Jesus never used the name Jehovah because Jesus is Jehovah! I know that is difficult to accept because of WT indoctrination, but it is true. Read a good translation of the Bible and see if you won't come to the same conclusion.
Jesus never used HIS own name except when He appeared to the Apostle Paul. He always referred to Himself as Son of Man. As you mentioned in the above quote, we study/studied a lot - and learn/ed nothing. All of the WT publications, NWT included, are purposely designed to obscure the fact that Jesus is YHWH of the Old Testament! I was shaken to the core when I finally realized this.
As far as Matthew 24:14 goes, I spent many a sleepless night agonizing over this scripture. It eventually dawned on me that Jesus is in full control. The good news has already been preached. Anyone so desiring can pick up a Bible and read it. The so-called good news that JW's preach is nothing but propaganda that most people reject anyway.
I know it is overwhelming to contemplate what your next step must be, but I urge you to remember Who is waiting. He is calling all of us out of bondage to a pseudo-Christian organization into full fellowship with Him.
Grace, peace, and love on your journey.
Sylvia