San Francisco is just one of many sanctuary cities in this country. As a permanent residence to the USA having had to go through immigration meetings, medical tests, means tests and a pretty good dose of fear - it bothers me that the same city that I had to go to for my hearing, past armed guards to prove my worth, wants illegals to come out of the woodwork and take advantage of the services the city has to offer, with a promise that they won't be rounded up or harmed in any way. I don't seem to understand this system at all - I feel penalized somehow for doing what was right yet, I can still feel badly for those who are scared while here illegally. Do you think these cities should be able to have this status? sammieswife.
Do You Believe in Sanctuary Cities?
by sammielee24 47 Replies latest jw friends
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Junction-Guy
No, and all federal funding should be yanked out from under them.
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yknot
As a Texan whose family income has suffered greatly due to the illegal use of these "aliens".........nope.
I have a heart but if I break the law by stealing services (employment, state welfare, public schools, hospitals emergency room for things that are treated in a doctor's office visit, or didn't pay income tax to the IRS) we all know what would happen to me or any other lawful citizen/resident.
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Carmel
It'a based on biblical principals. How could a good little jw not approve? carmel
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SirNose586
No, I don't. San Diego is a sanctuary city, unfortunately.
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AGuest
thank you... and may you all have peace!
I said in another thread that there are a few things I am passionate about; this is one of them. So, if my "passion" offends, please forgive - that is not my intent. It is my intent, however, to wake folks up, if I can, and so I will "speak" my heart on this issue.
I have to say that, truly, I totally do NOT understand the chagrin that many people in this country have for "illegal" immigrants, particularly those who are hispanic and come from south of the border. I believe that every one of us would cross a border, any border, no matter the risk, if a better life for our children lay on the other side. We would do what we believed we had to do. I have come to this forum for over 7 years now and I have read the gamut about freedom, and kindness, and acceptance, etc. I have read a plethora of threads where "christians" are supposed to be this and that... and also pooh-poohed for their "talk" of love... and how all one needs to do is be human and do good with respect to their fellow man, etc. etc.. And then I read threads like this.
There are currently approximately 12 million "undocumented" (i.e., "illegal") immigrants in this country. Of these, about 7.2 million are undocumented workers in the U.S. (the rest are mostly children), or about 5 percent of the country's work force. The estimate is that illegal immigrants fill a quarter of all agricultural jobs, 17 percent of office and house cleaning positions, 14 percent of construction jobs and 12 percent in food preparation. These also PAY TAXES... including Social Security. However, NONE of them benefit from those payments - but WE do. And it is documented that they also contribute to the economic, social and cultural developments of their communities. We don't have a problem having our fields harvested. We don't have a problem having our homes cleaned. We LOVE to eat at Mexican restaurants. And yet, "we" have a problem with their presence.
When I was a little girl, Mexico and south of the border was considered MARVELOUS... our "friends." Everything was "Made in Mexico." And there was no illegal immigration "problem." After awhile, however, everything became "Made in Japan." Then, "Made in India." Then, "Made in Taiwan." And now, "Made in China." Because of this change, most of these folks (from south of the border)... LOST THEIR MEANS TO MAKE A LIVING. So... what do we want them to DO? What would YOU do? You would go where the work is... wouldn't you? No one seems to be decrying the increase in the other (asian, indian, european) populations. Why? Because... and this is the TRUTH... there is no moratorium on immigration from THESE countries!! There is on immigration from non-europeanhispanic countries, however.
These (hispanics) are not coming here causing trouble, however. They're not blowing up our federal buildings; they're not flying planes into skyscrapers; they're not overpopulating our prisons... they're not selling drugs to our children... they're not cheating our government out of revenues but actually putting revenues IN. THEY ARE WORKING. And they're doing so simply to put food on the table, clothes on their backs and roofs over their heads. They're not getting MBAs, or running Microsoft, or running for office. They're not wearing Gucci, driving BMWs, or buying mansions. MOST of them are cleaning toilets, picking produce, walking, wearing cast-off clothing... and living in substandard housing.
The inherent SELFISHNESS underlies the anti-"illegal" immigrant issue is almost overwhelming. The concern is not that these are "breaking the law." The concern is that if they ARE allowed to be here, their presence makes MY "piece of the pie" just that smaller. That is an absolute falsity and illusion. These people add more to our economy than many of our own unproductive citizens. They HELP pay for the schools and hospitals, prisons and jails, welfare and social service programs... and social security and Medicaid programs... that all of us "legals" can benefit from... at any time. They, however, cannot and do not benefit.
There is no "free ride" for illegal immigrants. Rather, there is constant fear, harassment, terror, uncertainty, hard, hard work... exploitation of ALL types, virutally NO rights, VERY little pay... and absolutely no benefits. If you consider this a windfall, then you really haven't considered the matter very well. Who of you would TRULY like to live like this? Not a one, I am sure. But you would do it, wouldn't you... if it meant your survival... and your childrens'? Yes, you would. I would. I would want to give my children the BEST life I could, and if that meant I had to swim a river and risk capture and return to do it, I would take that risk. You would, too.
The TRUTH is that this economy would implode if every illegal immigrant were deported. We are, in essence, getting a kind of FREE labor as a result of their presence. MOST of the money they make comes right back into OUR economy (and for those who think it goes back across the border, the TRUTH is that while, yes, a bit of it does, that is ALL that goes - a bit. Because it costs way more for the worker to live here than it would for he/she to live there. What they send back, no matter how small... goes a long way there).
"We" should stop lying to ourselves on this issue. "We" should stop saying that their presence poses a security risk. Read the paper, watch the news: hispanics are not our security issue. The people who ARE... either were born and raised right here... or entered "legally"... or come from our supposed "ally" countries. Timothy McVeigh was not only blond-haired, blue-eyed, but an ex-Marine. You don't see anyone crying our for all fresh-faced, crew-cut, ex-Marines to be rounded up and perpetually incarcerated. Osama Bin Laden was "created"... and ARMED by the U.S. Government. Atta and company were here on student visas. Noriega was our "friend"... as is the Saudi royal house. These are the TRUTH and those who originate from south of the border are merely being used as scapegoats for our irrational fear... and overwhelming selfishness.
I am overwhelmed by those who come here, decry the oppressive and hypocritical thinking of the WTBTS... and then take this anti-undocumented immigrant position. People have a right to live... and if they're willing to WORK to do it, they should be allowed to, wherever that work happens to be. Instead of opposing these, we should, if we HAVE to root out "bad," be focusing on helping and/or eliminating our REAL problems, such as the increase in crime (of all kinds), drug and alcohol addiction, child abuse (of all kinds), government corruption (at all levels), religious tyranny, etc. And that's just the start of our "problems."
"We" are SO good at pointing the finger away, and not looking at the three pointing back at "us." Did you enter the country legally? Wonderful! Good for you! That means that, for all of your hard work to do so, YOU get to benefit FULLY from the "fruits" of YOUR labor! THAT is the difference for you. YOU do not have to pay for services and programs and benefits that YOU... and your children... do not get to take part in. I have had to work VERY hard to get to where I have in my life and career. Others have not; some got where they are because of who they know, who their family is, or a "lucky" break. Am I bitter? Of course, not - that is LIFE. I didn't get a free ride to Harvard. I didn't even get a free ride to State college. My father fought in Vietman three times, but could never get promoted past chief petty officer. That's the breaks.
If we're going to be bitter about something and someone, it should at least be people who are benefitted UNFAIRLY. Undocumented workers are not among these; quite the opposite - they are the ones who are largely UNBENEFITTED... unfairly.
I bid you all peace.
A slave of Christ,
SA, who lives in Oakland, CA... a "sanctuary city"... and proud of it!
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White Dove
Aguest,
WELL SAID!!!! I have friends who were desparately poor and starving in Mexico. Their living conditions are so awful that their "houses" have big gapping spaces between the slats and offer little to no protection from the elements. I would want better for my family and would definately risk all to get it. It takes years to become legal enough to enter the US if one is able to get that far or live that long. Americans are spoiled and don't want to share anything with hardworking people who have nothing, and they call themselves X-tians! What would Jesus do??? I dare anyone who is against Mexicans to answer that. Why not be prejudice against Canadians? Some of them come here illegally, too. No one cares because they come from a "rich" land. That's it, isn't it? The land you come from illegally must be a rich one or you are toast!
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aSphereisnotaCircle
I have a hard time making judgements against people who are doing exactly what I would be doing if i were in their shoes.
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buffalosrfree
Definitely do not believe in Sanctuary Cities, they should have all federal monies and state monies withheld from them. We should never support those who are here breaking our laws and using up services meant to be for those who are "legal" citizens. Get them the hell out of our country, I could care less about how poor they are in theirs, if they don't like it then do something about the country they are from don't come over here and expect a handout, break our laws show disrespect for our laws and then expect us to look at them with benign eyes. Get out I say. That being said I do believe the migrant workers should be able to get visas easily to come here and work just don't bring your families with you until you get to be a legal citizen. If you are here legally then no problem. I feel the same way about churches that act like they are sanctuaries for the illegals also, they should have their tax free status permanently revoked and all those taking part in shielding illegals should also be rounded up and jailed!!!!!
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Layla33
No I do not and I will tell you why. Two of my closest friends and former husband were legal immigrants to this country, they paid thousands of dollars went through tests, etc to come here legally, should anyone be able to just come in a country scout free without any checks whatsoever? Can I tell you a former friend of mine that had a stint in a mental hospital to deal with her identity being stolen by an illegal immigrant (Mexican)? How many illegal immigrants steal identities of American citizens? How many crimes do they commit on a regular basis to live here. And I am sorry, I have come across some very racist and hateful Mexicans that make the KKK and the Nation of Islam look like play school compared to them.
Not committing crimes, not using social services, not causing hospitals to close, not filling up our prisons?? Are you serious? That is about the most incorrect statement I have ever read. Now I have Mexican-American friends, as well as friends from Brazil, El Salavador and Guatamela and they all legally came here, what I do not approve of is those that thumb their noses against the law, but I blame the government most of all for making them the new slave class.
I believe we should not have sanctuary cities, and that we should jail all employers that are giving these people's job.
I came across this stat:
1. $11 billion to $22 billion is spend on welfare to illegal aliens each year.
2. $2.2 billion a year is spent on food assistance programs such as food stamps, WIC and free school lunches for illegal aliens.
3. $2.5 billion a year is spent on Medicaid for illegal aliens.
4. $12 billion a year is spent on primary and secondary school education for children here illegally and they cannot speak a word of English.
5. $17 billion a year is spent for education for American-born children of illegal aliens, known as anchor babies. 6. $3 million a day is spent to incarcerate illegal aliens.
6. 30 percent of all federal prison inmates are illegal aliens.
7. $90 billion a year is spent of illegal aliens for welfare and social services by American taxpayers.
8. $200 billion a year in suppressed American wages are caused by illegal aliens.
9. The illegal aliens in the United States have a crime rate that’s 2 1/2 times that of white non-illegal aliens. In particular, their children are going to make a huge additional crime problem in the U.S.
10. During the year of 2005 there were 4 to 10 million illegal aliens that crossed our southern border, also as many as 19,500 illegal aliens from terrorist countries. Millions of pounds of drugs, cocaine, meth, heroine and marijuana, crossed into the U.S. from the southern border.
11. The National Policy Institute, “estimated that the total cost of mass deportation would be between $206 and $230 billion or an average cost of between $41 to $46 billion annually over a five-year period.
12. In 2006 illegal aliens sent home $45 billion in remittances back to their countries of origin.
So using the lowest estimates, the annual cost of illegal aliens is $338.3 billion a year. So if deporting them costs between $206 and $230 billion, what do you think we should do?