It's one thing to have this information in a secret location. It's another to have them go by it. Many hounders like to throw their weight around, and they will not disclose or abide by anything that is supposed to be secret. Plus, all it takes is for the Filthful and Disgraceful Slavebugger to put out a washtowel article that contradicts part or all the directives in the book, and the hounders will then go by what is in that washtowel instead.
A Secret about DF'ing that Elders will NEVER tell you.
by Amazing 61 Replies latest jw friends
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AWAKE&WATCHING
WTF? I was actually enjoying this post until you started slamming Blondie and Scully so now you can do what Scully has said her shunning relatives can do.
Edited to include the fact that you slammed Scully as well.
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Heaven
My uncle was DF'ed. I don't know why (no one would say). I figured he'd had a disagreement with someone with clout. Then those that DF'ed him got DF'ed so they re-instated him. Huh? He went back because he wanted everlasting life and the joy of seeing his daughter in the new world (she had died due to a nasty car accident). The control and brainwashing these clowns exact is highly effective!
Secrecy is a great control mechanism. If things are kept secret, you don't have to prove them. Isn't this against the Bible? (1 Thessalonians 5:21: "Prove all things; hold fast that which is good." KJV)
Three of the many reasons I never joined this farce -- the DFing insanity, the secrecy, and the non-Biblical practices/beliefs.
Heaven
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mouthy
other cases, the disfellowshipped relative may be living outside the immediate family circle and home. Although there might be a need for limited contact on some rare occasion to care for a necessary family matter, any such contact should be kept to a minimum. Loyal Christian family members do not look for excuses to have dealings with a disfellowshipped relative not living at home. Rather, loyalty to Jehovah and his organization moves them to uphold the Scriptural arrangement of disfellowshipping. Their loyal course has the best interests of the wrongdoer at heart and may help him to benefit from the discipline received.-Hebrews 12:11.
Well I guess my Daughter & Grand daughter are reading the rules Cos they dont talk to me
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willyloman
Interesting topic. I don't think this point has been made yet and I want to add it to the mix:
The average dub elder has almost no idea what the "flock" book says about anything, unless and until he is told to get out the book, turn to pages X, and follow along with the CO as he reads a Society letter that "updates" the highly coded language in said book.
Elders are not allowed to copy or possess these letters and are told to make whatever notes they wish in the margin of the book. As you can imagine, these notes will vary substantially from elder to elder depending on education and comprehension skills. Some elders will make no notes at all and others are so hastily scrawled that they are illegible. For these and other reasons, the flock book sits in the typical dub elder's library and goes largely unused, except for when there is a judical committee - the book contains an outline for conducting them and on those occasions, that is the only section of the book that will be opened and read.
In my experience - more than 20 years as very serious and studious elder - I can tell you that the flock book is pretty much a non-event in the daily lives of the vast majority of elders. What determines JW behavior with respect to DF and DA situations (the theme of this thread) is whatever "Mother" has written in the pages of the WT.
So while I have read and enjoyed Jim's posts for many years and respect his experience and communications skills, I think he started this one off with a false premise.
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minimus
Either "written" or said by a CO, which can trump "written" anytime.
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Gordy
In 1996 I had a breakdown,walked out the home and disappeared for two weeks, and attempted suicide. I was diagnosed as having "acute clinical depression" and spent six week in pyschiatric hospital. I was released and on anti-depressants.
Two weeks after leaving hospital, I was told to appear before a Judicial Committee. I was "privately reproved" and removed as a Min Servant.
It was only a couple of years ago after getting a copy of the "Pay Attention" book that I came across this:
""Attempted suicide may be the result of deep despair or
major depression; deal carefully and compassionately with
such a person. In most cases a judicial hearing is not
required. (Ps. 88:3, 17, 18; Prov. 15:13; Eccl. 7:7; g90
9/8 pp 22-3; w90 3/15 pp. 26-30; w90 3/1 pp. 5-9; w83
8/1 pp. 3-11) ""So did they break their own rules?
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BurnTheShips
In my experience, the WT's DF association rules are applied in widely disparate ways that vary by time, place, and personality. On top of this, there is a lot of favoritism involved in the meteing out of WT "justice." Many Witnesses ignore the rules regarding DF'ed ones or change their stance over time, flipping and flopping. You get the horns after they return from a District Assembly, for example. Amazing's suggestion about the Flock book may help in a given case but I wouldn't hold my breath.
BTS
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Satans little helper
The original point of the post is clear, it underlines the double standards that are applied through the literature and also underlines how manipulative the application of control is throughout the organisation.
My father is still in the borg and his first grand child will be born in a couple of weeks, it will be interesting to see how he reacts to this. I cut him off after he decided not to come to our wedding 6 years ago and I could be an arse about it and not allow him any contact with his grand daughter, but I want to be the bigger man about it. I could so easily remain bitter and twisted but with the help of counselling I have got past the desire to return the hurt caused over the years including the lack of respect through shunning.
The bottom line is this, those still in will shun you if you are df'd or da'd. It's heartless and childish but you have to remember that they are mentally deficient and are therefore not wholy responsible for their actions.
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AllTimeJeff
I haven't read all of the comments on this thread. It was no "secret" where I came from, because one of the first things I tried to do as a new elder was DF family who I knew were associating with their DF'd relatives.
I was appointed in part to help "clean up" the congregation from all the association with disfellowshipped people going on....
As far as how closely the elders book is followed, I agree with those who state that it isn't looked upon very regularly at all. And in the case of a relative who is DF'd, elders would normally ask the CO, and then send a letter to the branch if they were unclear as to how to handle it.... Most elders these days want to write letters or call the CO.... Because within any elder body, there will always be different opinions on how to interpret and administer whats inside the elders handbook....
I was told by two DO's not to make too big a deal out of DF'd relatives...... As long as spiritual association wasn't taking place that is... I could never figure out what that meant... "spiritual association"