Do you think you have 'chosen sides'?

by AK - Jeff 54 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  Chalam

  Of course the "meaning" we each apply to our lives varies depending on other beliefs.

  Agreed!

  All the best,

  Stephen
• 

  drwtsn32

  Priest73:

  Then I love baiting. I'm the master.

  I see what you did there.
• 

  AK - Jeff

  Ecclesiastes I believe.

  So do I but not the WT teaching on Ecc 9:5! The WT are full of lies and deceit. Do you expect their teaching on this verse to be true? As I said to you before, you need to ask the Lord to help you erase the WT teaching from your mind and let Him show you what the truth is. That is, if you really are sincere about His point of view.

  My comment here is taken out of context [as if you didn't know that Chalam]. Shame on you.

  I did not mean that I believed Ecclesiastes - in the sense that it was inspired or particularly more accurate than any of the other books in the Bible. I was referring to my awareness that your book agreed with my reasoning on death. Not that I agreed with it. And certainly not that I agree with the JW assessment of any of this.

  I should have said: 'I believe the reference is in the Bible book of Ecclesiastes'. That is what I meant. :)

  Jeff
• 

  AK - Jeff

  So, Chalam, how do you interpret these verses?

  Ecclesiastes 9

  A Common Destiny for All

  1 So I reflected on all this and concluded that the righteous and the wise and what they do are in God's hands, but no man knows whether love or hate awaits him. 2 All share a common destiny—the righteous and the wicked, the good and the bad, [a] the clean and the unclean, those who offer sacrifices and those who do not.
  As it is with the good man,
  so with the sinner; as it is with those who take oaths,
  so with those who are afraid to take them.

  3 This is the evil in everything that happens under the sun: The same destiny overtakes all. The hearts of men, moreover, are full of evil and there is madness in their hearts while they live, and afterward they join the dead. 4 Anyone who is among the living has hope [b] —even a live dog is better off than a dead lion!

  5 For the living know that they will die,
  but the dead know nothing;
  they have no further reward,
  and even the memory of them is forgotten.

  6 Their love, their hate
  and their jealousy have long since vanished;
  never again will they have a part
  in anything that happens under the sun.

  7 Go, eat your food with gladness, and drink your wine with a joyful heart, for it is now that God favors what you do. 8 Always be clothed in white, and always anoint your head with oil. 9 Enjoy life with your wife, whom you love, all the days of this meaningless life that God has given you under the sun— all your meaningless days. For this is your lot in life and in your toilsome labor under the sun. 10 Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with all your might, for in the grave, [c] where you are going, there is neither working nor planning nor knowledge nor wisdom.

  There is the Bible's answer. Life is meaningless.

  Jeff
• 

  Chalam

  Hi Jeff,

  Ecc is a tricky book for sure. A Christian friend of mine said to me recently "it isn't very good"! However, I have been reading it recently and getting on pretty well. I read it before an found it hard to follow so I understand.

  Ecc 9:5 foxed me for a while. I assume that was because I was led there as the JWs quote it so much in regard to death. So I was off on the wrong foot already :( However, I got to understand what was being said when someone pointed out 9:6 and the "under the sun" phrase. This is key to understanding what verse 5 is actually saying.

  So, the chapter is all about death, where we are all going, the righteous and the unrighteous alike.

  Regarding the word meaningless I checked it out because the version I was reading recently used the word vanity which I found maybe even less helpful to understand. Anyhow have a look here

  of thy vanity

  I think the true meaning lies here, that this current life is something transitory and unsatisfactory

  See here for examples

  Matthew 6:19-20 (New International Version)

  Treasures in Heaven

  19 "Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy, and where thieves break in and steal. 20 But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where moth and rust do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal.

  2 Corinthians 4:17-18 (New International Version)

  17 For our light and momentary troubles are achieving for us an eternal glory that far outweighs them all. 18 So we fix our eyes not on what is seen, but on what is unseen. For what is seen is temporary, but what is unseen is eternal.

  Anyhow, gotta go.

  All the best,

  Stephen