Elder says that there're apostates who are organized in Spain

by cattails 38 Replies latest watchtower scandals

  • Doubting Bro
    Doubting Bro

    I'm honestly surprised they still worked 1/2 day on Sat. Just look at the reduction in the number of WTs & Awakes they've done in the last couple of years. They went from 2 full WT runs of 20m or so world wide (40m total) to 1 full WT run (20m) + 1 members only run (7m) = 27m or a 33% reduction. Awake production was cut by 50% (2 issues monthly to one).

    Also, the change in the CBS makes it so they don't need to print as many books since its taking a whole lot long to muddle through those puppies. More savings!

    I would love to compare how literature placements are doing vs 10 years ago. My bet is that they have been pretty flat.

    Awaretoday - have you heard how many bethelites are being laid-off. I think we knew there were phases that started a few years ago. I thought they were pretty close to where they wanted to be now. Also, welcome to the board!!

  • awaretoday
    awaretoday

    From my conversation they said nine perhaps more later but none of the branch big wigs. I was stunned to hear the the bethelites were elated about the news and so very excited to leave, my first response was to feel sorry for them but was told that they were really looking forward to this opportunity. OK whatever! It must hurt when you have just been rejected by what you knew as Mother Organization to whom you sacrificed so much to the point of poverty, this is just incredible to me.

    Thanks for the welcome, I have been a reader for a while because so much is beginning to fall into place . Hurtful and doubtful news have emotionally compromised me and what used to be apostate noise is now insightful information to sever my dependency in the personal orientation of the aging GB. I now have allowed others opinions and experiences to be real to me and respect their them for their sacrifice and painat now having anything to show for an entire life of existence and a family that shuns them without mercy. When will this nonesense ever end?

  • JustHuman14
    JustHuman14

    Yeah, the easy excuse as usual....BLAIM THE APOSTATES, BLAIM SATAN, DEMONS, SMURFS, CAPTAIN KIRK, DAFFY DUCK, PINOKIO....

    WT is short of money. They run out from cash flow. That is why they are selling property in other countries and transfer the money in US.( I'M SURE Obama will be delighted with this cash coming to US)

    I recall in the cong I grew up the following:

    1. An old JW brother gives a peace of land to the WT society in order to build a KH

    2. Labour, building material, furniture, ALL were donated by the local JW's.

    3. Then the WT Crap Society comes and demands from the KH that we have build RENT!!! The place was used by 3 congregations and each one had to pay rent!!! A building that it was completely errected by the funds of the local brothers, RENT was payed to the Org. Who takes the money?

    4. Suppose that the Org decides to sell that place( it worths 3-4 millions Euro now)from this transaction WHO is the one that will be benifit? The local Brothers, or the Org?

    Same case in Spain. The local Brothers gave money to have their printing facilities, and more and the Org sells everything and takes the cash in US.

    JustHuman14 formely known justhuman

  • tictoc
    tictoc

    the governing body wouldn't go witnessing not without their boby guards

  • Bangalore
    Bangalore

    *** w84 3/1 pp. 9-12 Spain's Willing-Hearted Ones Do the "Impossible" ***

    Spain's Willing-Hearted Ones Do the "Impossible"

    JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES had been preaching in Spain since 1919. Then in 1936 civil war broke out and their work was brought to a virtual standstill. The authorities took over the Watch Tower Society's small branch office in Madrid and confiscated the printing equipment. The foreign pioneers, or full-time preachers, had to flee the country to avoid imprisonment. By the spring of 1939 General Franco had won the war and a Catholic Fascist dictatorship was imposed. The only religious organization allowed to function legally and publicly was the Roman Catholic Church. In such a setting, would Jehovah's Witnesses ever be able to get back on their feet?

    To the isolated groups of Spanish Witnesses back there, a recovery seemed impossible. Yet in 1970, after 34 years of underground, "catacomb," activity, Jehovah's Witnesses finally were given legal recognition in Spain. After a brief search, they located a small building in Barcelona that would serve as a central office and a Bethel home for their headquarters staff. That original Bethel family started with just 12 members. In 1972, when the remodeled building was dedicated by N. H. Knorr (then president of the Watch Tower Society), there was an average of 15,668 Witnesses preaching each month in Spain. Four years later, that figure had doubled to over 36,000! The Barcelona Bethel facilities were already too small for existing needs. But where could a suitable larger property be found?

    One problem was the zoning laws. Normally, land is zoned for either industrial or residential use. What was needed was land that could be used for both purposes, since members of the Bethel family who work in the factory, workshops and offices also reside in the same complex. A nationwide search was mounted for a suitable piece of land on which to build or for a building already in existence that would be adequate for future expansion. The months and years rolled by without any real success.

    In 1980 the impasse finally was broken. A large five-winged factory building was found about 15 miles (24 km) out of Madrid, on the outskirts of the village of Ajalvir. The building was almost brand new and only partially finished, and the local authorities were willing to permit mixed zoning there. But there was one big problem-finances.

    How Would the Brothers Respond?

    For more than 30 years the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society of Pennsylvania, U.S.A., had gladly financed the preaching work in Spain without any repayment. But because of heavy expenditures, due to expansion at the Brooklyn headquarters at that time, it was impossible for the Society to finance new Bethel facilities in Spain. If Spain was to have a new branch complex, the Spanish Witnesses would have to finance it themselves. This was a new challenge of much greater proportions than anything previously faced in the Spanish field. In fact, it seemed impossible that the Spanish brothers, with their relatively low wages, could donate sufficient funds to cover the cost of this enterprise.

    But you may recall what was done when the Israelites of Moses' day were privileged to build a tabernacle for Jehovah's worship. Moses had said to the Israelites: "From among yourselves take up a contribution for Jehovah. Let every willing-hearted one bring it as Jehovah's contribution." They voluntarily gave gold, silver, precious stones and other items. (Exodus 35:5-9) Similarly, the issue was squarely put to the 751 congregations in Spain. The need was clearly explained at the 1980 district conventions all over the country. What was the response?

    At the close of the conventions, people were lining up to contribute their jewels, gold and silver rings and bracelets, so that these could be turned into cash to finance the new project. At the convention in San Sebastián in the Basque country, an elderly sister handed over a heavy gold bracelet. When asked if she was sure that she wanted to donate such a valuable item, she answered: "Brother, it is going to do far more good paying for a new Bethel than it will on my wrist!"

    A young couple contributed money they had planned to use for their honeymoon travel. An older sister brought in a pile of damp and musty banknotes that she had stashed away under the floor of her home over the years.

    As the weeks passed by, men and women, young and old, rich and poor, contributed with a willing heart so that Spain could have the needed new Bethel facilities. Even special pioneers, who receive only a limited monthly allowance, made contributions. For example, one couple sacrificed a trip to the United States and donated their ticket money. Children also sent their contributions to the branch office. One ten-year-old stated: "I am the firstborn of five children, and we have heard the suggestion about sending money for the new Bethel. We would like to contribute what we have saved in our money box. Although it is a small amount, we believe it will serve to buy something."

    Young people also organized themselves in different ways in order to earn money they could send to the Society. Some made little dolls and sold them. One collected sawdust from carpentry shops and then sold it. One youngster who was saving to buy a guitar donated the money for the Bethel project.

    New Challenges to Be Met

    The Spanish brothers responded so well that what had seemed impossible became a reality. The factory building was purchased in October 1980. But there were new challenges to be met. The unfinished building now needed to be remodeled and completed. Separate living quarters would have to be built. A volunteer construction team had to be formed. Specialists were needed for drafting, engineering, building, electrical and plumbing work. At first sight, all of this seemed impossible. But it was a challenge similar to that faced by Moses during construction of the tabernacle. So out went this call for volunteers: "Let all the wise-hearted ones among you come and make all that Jehovah has commanded." (Exodus 35:10) Now experts were needed for Bethel construction, and a similar call went out for willing workers.

    One special pioneer, an engineer, was called in with his wife and child, serving for several years. A brother from Madrid who is a registered technical architect also offered his services in the quality control of the construction. An architect in Barcelona who is not a Witness heard of this vast project and was moved to volunteer his services for several weekends. However, relatively few such specialists were available among Jehovah's Witnesses in Spain. But expert help came also from outside of Spain. Brothers came forward from many countries-Greece, Germany, Sweden, Great Britain and the United States, to mention just a few.

    However, not only were willing-hearted experts needed but hundreds of permanent and temporary volunteers were required to care for the bulk of the manual labor, as well as the domestic work-cooking, laundering and cleaning. How did the Witnesses respond? Just like the Israelites who responded with willing hearts.-Exodus 35:20-35.

    During the three years that were required to complete the project, thousands of Witnesses from all over Spain volunteered to help out at Ajalvir full time or on weekends and vacations. And their fine help and example served to give a witness. How so? During a period of ten months, the original factory owners continued their industry in two wings of the building while the Witnesses were working on the rest of the site. The former owners were so impressed by the zeal and conduct of the brothers that they adopted a company policy that any future employees would have to be Witnesses-and they have stuck to it!

    The "Impossible" Achieved

    In the fall of 1982 a target date was set for the completion of the new Bethel facilities-October 9, 1983. As the months sped by, this seemed to be a formidable task. It was one thing to get the main structure and the residential modules looking like a Bethel complex, but finishing off the thousands of details was a different matter. Late into the night of Saturday, October 8, volunteers were still working to put the finishing touches to the marble floors and mirrored ceilings in the lobby. Yet, on the morning of October 9-the day of the dedication-there, on a hilltop overlooking a typical Castilian scene with its autumn ocher colors, stood the gleaming white and gray Bethel complex in a setting of green lawns and multicolored flower beds.

    Hundreds of visitors who poured in from Spain and other lands were amazed. Who would believe that an organization that had virtually been put out of existence and driven underground until 1970 could have such a beautiful headquarters just 13 years later! Without a doubt, Jehovah had fulfilled his word by the prophet Isaiah: "The little one himself will become a thousand, and the small one a mighty nation. I myself, Jehovah, shall speed it up in its own time."-Isaiah 60:22.

    The program got off to a grand start with experiences and expressions from old-timers who had lived through the trials of the 1930's and from missionaries who had formerly served in Spain. Next F. W. Franz, the president of the Watch Tower Society, presented a talk on dedication and consecration. This discourse was followed attentively not only by the 956 present at the new Bethel but also by more than 62,000 in 12 different stadiums connected by telephone around the country. By their donations and voluntary work, most in attendance had contributed to this magnificent new Bethel complex. During the years of hard work, they had truly been conscious of wise King Solomon's words: "Unless Jehovah himself builds the house, it is to no avail that its builders have worked hard on it." (Psalm 127:1) With Jehovah's blessing they were among the willing-hearted ones who had made all of it possible.

    Bangalore

  • dissed
    dissed

    And the JW's thought it was hard to be a JW under Franco.

    Little did they know at the time, that the GB of the WTS is the real repressor.

  • agonus
    agonus

    I'm pretty sure I remember reading here in the past that the anti-GB sentiment amongst European JWs is getting stronger, that they're getting fed up and are being less silent about it. Of course, this is just a rumor, but if there was to be a WT schism - and I mean like whole countries revolting - it would probably start in Europe. The European intellect tends to look down upon the Ugly American. In this case, they are absolutely justified.

  • wantarevolution
    wantarevolution

    well- at our meeting, we've just had 2 ex-bethelites join who told me the following - The plan is to sell the present site (Except the assembly hall accross the road) and move to a smaller location, perhaps out in the countryside. The land would be worth a fortune - the buildings probably not so much. There are rumours (note! RUMOURS) that the spanish airforce, who have a base next to the site are interested)

    Eventually the plan is to have spanish bethel have around 20 or 30 in it - basically a service desk.

    As to where the money would go? Well to the world wide work, obviously....

  • wobble
    wobble

    The apostates in Spain to WT are a pain.

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