Worshipping Jehovah without all the rules? (page 2)

mindmelda

I don't understand the classic Trinity teaching too well either. It does seem to explain some scriptures but not others. But, I've decided that religion must have some mystical elements to it, and as long as it isn't socially or psychologically damaging, it's okay not to understand everything.

To my mind, religion is mostly about metaphor anyway. I don't take much of anything about it literally these days.

But, I never really could see the 1914 doctrine, the 144,000 being the only "born again" Christians and the "God will only save JWs" doctrince and never did, and those are pivotal to being a JW. I always had these and other doctrinal differences with some of the WTS but was too intimidated, being a "mere woman" to try to debate it.

I went through a "chuck it all" phase for anything religious for a few years, but I seem to have some spiritual and social needs and can't ignore t hem.

I just don't want to be part of high control, evangelistic, or fundamentalist religions anymore. Had enuf of that.

yknot

I think many remain Arians (non-trinitarian)

I am still an Arian, and agree with the JWs and BSs about hellfire and immortality of the soul too.

Perhaps it is time to consider shifting your concept of worship to being personal and church activity as fellowship.

I know the WTS pushes unity but unity can simply be in the acceptance of Jesus as the promised messiah, who died and was resurrected, serves as King and redeemer/mediator for all who profess him as Christ. You would be surprised how many churches also have door to door activities too, but are all voluntary and not like the WTS.

I still attend the KH, but I also attend with my spouse at his church. I appreciate the outreach ministries (kids, older ones, couples, singles etc) and charity work along with focus on keeping our personal lives led by the principles set by Christ.

No church congregation or denomination is not without flaws but in the end it is our individual names that are found in the scrolls, not our organizational affliation.

Great thread

insearchoftruth

I still attend the KH, but I also attend with my spouse at his church.

Sounds like a great arrangement....I have many issues with the WTS, not agreeing with many of the doctrines, but the biggest issues are shunning and the belief that non-JWs are doomed as well as the arbitrary second chance given for those who die prior to the big A, but if you are alive at the time of the big A and are not a JW, you have no second chance......all scare tactics.

JeffT

1) Study the Trinity for real. A lot of what the WTBS says about what trinitarians believe is like, well a lot of the other things they teach. I would recommend "More than a Carpenter" by Josh McDowell. It is easy reading, short and concise.

2) I disagree with Unitarian Universalists on a lot of subjects, but nobody has to listen to me. You might find UU a comfortable place to be.

passwordprotected

"To reject it because they teach it is just as rigid and unbending as we all say they are IMHO."

I'm not saying to reject because they teach it, I was just wondering if you'd found yourself in that mindset due to their teachings. I hope you figure it out. I believe Jesus when he said he's send us the Spirit of Truth and that this Counsellor would teach us what we need to know and would testify about him. I'm pretty sure you'll find a place of comfort with your Saviour.

happpyexjw

PP - Sorry if I misread your meaning. One thing I have discovered as I have sampled various churches, is that the membership often has a wide variety of ideas and understandings of scripture and no one seems to get overwrought if someone holds a different one from the official doctrine of the church. I attended a Methodist church a few times shortly after leaving the wts and was shocked when they actually encouraged people to read the Bible and try to figure things out for themselves!

JeffT - I did study the trinity as a youngster in the Catholic Church which I belonged to until my mother started to study with the JWs who came to our door. I couldn't wrap my brain around it then and I still can't.

Where I am at right now is to try and keep an open mind about what role God and Christ have to play in my life. I try very hard to live my life in a way that hurts no one and respects the rights and beliefs of others. When I have to decide on the rightness or wrongness of a decision, I ask myself how I would feel if the situation was turned around. I can't believe that a loving, all-knowing God is going to punish me for being a little confused and uncertain about His nature.

Interesting thread.

carla

Why must you go anywhere? Why not just pick up the bible and read it on your own for a while and see what conclusions you come to without someone telling you what everything means. If you are looking the social aspect take a night class, dance class, diners club, book club, garden club, volunteer, etc..etc..etc..

ptucker8357

Thanks for all the great feedback, all....

My issues with the trinity and the deity of Jesus really has nothing to do with what I was taught as a bible student. It just defies logic to me and, being a very logical person in most other aspects of my life, I can't believe something without some sort of real information to back it up. I guess some would say that I lack faith, but as several have mentioned in this thread, there are many examples that would make you question the trinity idea ... (maybe I just don't understand it well enough)...

And why did Jesus make it a point to say the Father was greater than him? Also if Jesus was God, who resurrected him when he died?

And another... The night prior to Jesus's death, He looks to his Father and says, "Father, if it is possible, let this cup pass from me." Was He talking to Himself?!?!?!

H

Furthermore, how can the Holy Spirit be a person? I think the idea of the Spirit being an active force of God is spot on... One for the JWs, I guess...

mindmelda

You know, I can handle the idea of Christ being "the personification of God's love in the form of his son" quite easily. LOL, is that all there is to the Trinity? If so, I'm okay with that. *G*

I'm not too dumb, but I'm impatient with overly complicated explanations doctrine now that I've decided the JWs are full of it. I'm looking for simple these days. If it's not simple, then ordinary people wouldn't understand it. Even the disciples were, for the most part, ordinary people in terms of their past education and experiences.

I also cannot handle exclusion from God's mercy for others, another thing I always hated about Witness doctrine. That "We're the chosen ones" arrogance is quite dangerous, it leads to nothing good I've ever noticed.

But, I do my praying these days to the Heavenly Father and the Lord Jesus, and strangely, it doesn't seem to bounce off the ceiling anymore. And the NWT..ugh what a wooden and torturous read that is! I use other Bibles now.

I started noticing through my independent studies that from it's outset, there were Christians with various ideas about many things. The one uniting belief was Christ being the son of God, but people were actually allowed some variety of thought on the matter. Beliefs and doctrines were seemingly openly debated amongst the disciples. Their were STRONG disagreements at times, it seems. The ones called "apostate" were those who took advantage of other Christians socially or financially(no group should tolerate that!), not every person who disagreed with another. That is why not all scripture is monolithic. It's expressing somewhat different views by different writers.

The WTS trying for uniformity of mind and doctrine that is not really what "first century Christianity" was all about, when you really study the matter. Why is that fact of Christian church history never spoken of among Witnesses? Oh, right...it would disrupt that mind controlling"unity" they're always going on about.

parakeet

Am I making sense?

Your beliefs don't have to make sense to anyone else, as long as they make sense to you and don't harm anyone.

Posters here will challenge your beliefs, but that's the point of this site. You could assert that water is wet; someone will disagree.

Worshipping Jehovah without all the rules?

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