1) I believe that the "2-witness principle" is fundamentally about truth and rejecting slander and false charges. Corroboration/ substantiation is generally possible once trust is established. Even in this, principles such as found at Proverbs 20:5 (regarding counsel as deep waters) and Proverbs 22:6 (about training according to one's need) must be applied for spiritual healing and reconciliation to take place
I'm going to take this bit by bit as in all candor you do not know what you're talking about.
I believe that the "2-witness principle" is fundamentally about truth and rejecting slander and false charges.
If Jehovah's Witnesses were interested in truth, why does the Flock book allow the elders to disallow (1) minor children's testimony, including the victim himself/herself if the victim is a minor; and (2) testimony from non-Jehovah's Witnesses? Please explain this to me, as I am clearly too stupid to see how this would help determine the truth of the situation?
Why do you approach this situation assuming the victim is a liar? Would you make the same assumption if someone stepped forward and said Brother Joe Blow killed someone? Or that same man was a thief and had held up a convenience store at gunpoint? If not, why not?
Explain to me how a small child can graphically describe oral sex, anal sex, the taste of semen and other sex acts. Explain to me how a child contracts a veneral disease.
Corroboration/ substantiation is generally possible once trust is established.
WTF??????
What does trust have to do with sexual abuse? This statement leads me to conclude you do not understand what sexual abuse means. The vast majority of sexual offenders are known to the victim. This means most of the time, the child knows and trusts the offender. The act of rape, among other things, violates and shatters that trust. This is part of what I referred to earlier when I said abuse victims have very deep and very real spiritual questions after coming out of abuse. Why did god let this happen? Why didn't god stop it? And so on.
But see you also don't know what you're talking about because elders are not interested in finding out the truth. Another real life example I know about -- teenage boy brutally rapes preschool child. The parents, foolishly in my opinion, go to the elders who approach the teenager.
Now seriously, no bs here, if you were that teenager, would you confess? Of course you wouldn't. What is your motivation? The creep naturally didn't, and the elders turned around and told the parents they were forbidden to report this to the police because they would be guilty of slander. Slander -- just the word you used. Their reasoning? Well the offender didn't confess so naturally the child must be a liar, right?
After the parents reported the assault the creep was convicted and sent away. The elders then went around to every person in that congregation threatening them with being disfellowshipped if one word were spoken about the matter.
Trust is established? Yeah right.
Even in this, principles such as found at Proverbs 20:5 (regarding counsel as deep waters) and Proverbs 22:6 (about training according to one's need) must be applied for spiritual healing and reconciliation to take place
But we're not talking about spiritual healing and/or reconciliation, are we? We're talking about whether a rule pulled out of thin air by Jehovah's Witnesses is Biblically based or not. Or at least I was.
But if you want to talk about healing, why don't the elders do just that? Why not let the justice system make the determination of guilt or innocence, meanwhile the focus of the elders should be to that small child and their family. They have all just been through the most horrific experience imaginable. As I've said to you many times, everyone involved is going to have major, major spiritual issues. Why don't the elders make any attempt to address those issues?
They do not. I have cited you several examples, others have come forward on this thread and given similar experiences. This procedure is broken. It's not there to help people it's there to silence people.
If I am wrong, then please explain to me how so many people have been further harmed by Jehovah's chosen people after the horrific experience of sexual abuse? And if the problem is imperfect humans, then WHAT is the Society doing to correct the errors?
It would help your credibility with me if you made an attempt to answer even one of my questions.
2) "He has does not love has not come to know God, because God is love" (1 John 4:8). Jesus, Jehovah's foremost Witness was certainly interested in people, as his compassion demonstrates. Those who follow Jehovah and Jesus in love and interest in people are, therefore, their real Witnesses.
To paraphrase Walt Whitman -- what Jehovah's Witness do, how poorly they behave, speaks so loudly I cannot hear what you say.
Jesus once said "by their fruits you shall know them". Any group of people who protects a man who rapes children, and then does more damage by threatening the child, and their family, are not showing by their actions they have anything in common with a god of love. The scripture you cite merely proves my original statement that a god of love does not exist amongst that sect (He has does not love has not come to know God ).
The last time I ever sat foot in a Kingdom Hall, a smug, fat, elder gave a talk on just this topic and he oh-so-proudly waved around a national magazine where the cover article was on Catholic priest pedophiles. He sharply criticized the Catholic religion, especially on how they protected the priests and refused to help the child victims. He asked again and again, is this what Jehovah or Jesus would approve of?
You remind me of something Richard Pryor once said, when he was caught by his wife in bed with another woman. He said, "Who you gonna believe? Me? Or your lying eyes?!"
By their actions you shall know . . . .
